In a quandary.

[Guest]

Over the last few years I have been chopping and changing telescopes. This was in an attempt to get a combination of telescopes to suit my observing needs. I currently have at home in light polluted skies a Vixen ED115 S. I have recently added a Skywatcher 80mm Equinox. This is used for quick obseving sessions and easy transport. I seem to have got it into me head that the larger Vixen refractor is too large and uncomfortable to use. This is because I sustained rib injuries. My idea was to replace the Vixen refractor with a Celestron C6. I did like my C5 which was sold on. The C6 would be used for observing the moon and planets. I think that it would give better views than the C5, better resolution. Also the Equinox 80mm would give wide field views and solar observing. 

But should I let the Vixen go? It is certainly a bit lighter than the ED 120 I sold to Ade. 

It does give very good views of the planets and the moon. Also it looks great. 

But would an 80mm refractor and C6 SCT combo be better that the 115 ed and 80mm combo?

Your thoughts would be welcome. 

Thanks. 

Edited January 31, 2020 by Guest
Added text.

[Timebandit]

 

 

My personal choice for Luna and planet observing (and splitting doubles) is a refractor. My eyes just seem to to see a clearer and sharper view through a quality descent aperture refractor than other types of scopes. With detailed observation like planets then the optical quality of the telescope is king IMO , with DSO then it comes down to light gathering ability (aperture). So IMO also considering the cool down time, I would stick with the Vixen refractor you already have. But as they say the best scope is the scope you use. So if you feel the C6 will get more use ,maybe this is the change you need to make?

I hope the above helps

 

 

 

[joe aguiar]

My personal opinion is the 80ed is ok for quick grab and go but remember it's really the size and weight of a 4 inch size. A regular 80mm f7 is smaller and lighter then the sw 80ed.

But saying that it's still ok.

I agree with up above if moon and planets is what u want I like the images of a nice refractor. 

The sweet spot if you are semi  serious or serious is the 5 inch size least to me.

Dont get me wrong I have the 6se and 8se both are good for large portable scope but for planets it's hard to beat a nice refractor. 

Not to mention no need to worry bout collimate.

Joejaguar 

[Craney]

If you want to swap your Vixen for my C6  (...😃....)   then  let me know.    

I have just bought an Edge 8 HD  and I suspect my C6 may just get left on the shelf from now on. (  I also have a Mak 140 I bought off of Stu which also covers a similar remit for planets and the Moon).

 

Sean.

 

[Alkaid]

If you're going down the SCT route to better the Vixen, I would step it up a gear....go for the C8.  In good seeing it will beat the Vixen.  The image will not be as 'clean' but there will be more information there.  In poor seeing, you can revert to the ED80.   Form factor is good, the C8 is quite a manageable scope and I suspect not much harder to mount up than the C6. 

[mikeDnight]

Stepping up to a C8 isn't going to do your ribs any good. Also, as superb as Vixen refractors are, and they are, they are hefty beasts for their aperture. I'm just thinking out loud here so to speak, but if you were to stay with a top class 4", but one with a lighter tube, you'd retain that high quality refractor punch. You could perhapse consider selling the Vixen and picking up a FC100DC or DF as a replacement. 

[joe aguiar]

Well on this part I did test my tak 102 TSA against my 100mmf9 evostar and the tak blew the evostar away.

If u like I can post the link to the video I made?

Joejaguar 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, joe aguiar said:

Well on this part I did test my tak 102 TSA against my 100mmf9 evostar and the tak blew the evostar away.

If u like I can post the link to the video I made?

Joejaguar 

Please do. It would be interesting. 

[joe aguiar]

Just another option u can sell the sw80ed and vixen and try to buy a 4 to 4.5 inch high end refractor. 

Basically  it will replace the vixen and being a triplet it can even be shorter making it more portable. But alot better quality tho.

Just a thought.

Joejaguar 

[Guest]

7 hours ago, joe aguiar said:

Just another option u can sell the sw80ed and vixen and try to buy a 4 to 4.5 inch high end refractor. 

Basically  it will replace the vixen and being a triplet it can even be shorter making it more portable. But alot better quality tho.

Just a thought.

Joejaguar 

Good suggestion, thanks. I received a very good offer for the Vixen. So I let it go. I will wait and see what come up. I want to find something that will suit me so I can settle with it. 

[John]

Excellent (and accurate in my experience) roundup of the 4-ish inch refractor options from Roger Vine here

http://www.scopeviews.co.uk/FourInchBG2019.htm

 

[joe aguiar]

On 31/01/2020 at 10:49, Grumpy Martian said:

Please do. It would be interesting. 

ok heres video i made few months ago

 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2020 by joe aguiar

[mikeDnight]

19 minutes ago, joe aguiar said:

ok heres video i made few months ago

 

 

 

I share your enthusiasm for Takahashi, although I feel a like for like comparison i.e. doublet vs doublet might have more meaning. Having said that, I have little doubt the end result will be the same. I had a beautiful SW120ED Equinox and it really was a wonderful scope. It would generally leave other scopes standing in terms of contrast and definition. But, after I bought myself a Takahashi FC100DC in March 2015, and viewing Jupiter through both scopes side by side - the eyepieces were Pentax XW's - the smaller Tak literally took my breath away and left the 120ED lagging behind in no uncertain terms. What i once thought to be good in my Equinox, was lacklustre compared to the Takahashi FC100D.  The seeing conditions on the night were very good, so it might be expected the 120ED would at least keep up with the smaller Tak, but they were worlds apart, with the equatorial and temperate belts, that were packed with detail, almost jumping out in 3D.

[joe aguiar]

well i thought that the SW would have been very close too. Its also f9 so that helps out. altho SW is a doublet and tripet for the tak being f9 on the SW does help colour too. And by the abbie rating or the chart MTF it puts the sw model at 98%.

So again i though it would be kinda close but still the tak would be abit better BUT it just didnt happen that way the images was a HUGE difference but i guess u cant always go by what the % says on a chart etc. Somethimes seeing is beliving.

Lastly the tak cost almost 4x the amount so depends on how much you want to spaend too,

Joejaguar

[John]

Nice scope though the Tak TSA 102 might be it has two disadvantages that I can see with regards to Grumpy Martian's quandary:

1. It is out of production.

2. It actually weighs more than his Vixen ED115S (according to the published specs) this might not help with his injured ribs.

One of the Tak FC-100 F/7.4's would offer much of the performance of the TSA 102 with the advantages of being more compact and lighter than the Vixen he currently has. And they are still in production.

 

[mikeDnight]

There's a beautiful FC100DF for sale on AB&S right now, at a great price too. Or may be a brand new FC100DZ would be an option. It's only money after all - Martin's money - so I don't mind helping him spend it. 

Here's another thought while I'm on a roll: There's the Practical Astronomy Show at Kettering on March 21, there were loads of refractors there last year and it would be an ideal opportunity to get to grips with a brand new Tak. 

Edited February 2, 2020 by mikeDnight

[Guest]

1 hour ago, mikeDnight said:

There's a beautiful FC100DF for sale on AB&S right now, at a great price too. Or may be a brand new FC100DZ would be an option. It's only money after all - Martin's money - so I don't mind helping him spend it. 

Here's another thought while I me on a roll: There's the Practical Astronomy Show at Kettering on March 21, there were loads of refractors there last year and it would be an ideal opportunity to get to grips with a brand new Tak. 

Could I play the sympathy card and attempt a so called crowd funding. 😁 

All the advice is very helpful. Thank you. 

Edited February 2, 2020 by Guest
Add text.

[Guest]

Another option in mind is an Orion Optics 150mm F 5 with 1/10 th wave figure. 

With Newtonian telescope you look through the side. Stating the obvious, apologies. 

Edited February 2, 2020 by Guest

[mikeDnight]

1 hour ago, Grumpy Martian said:

Another option in mind is an Orion Optics 150mm F 5 with 1/10 th wave figure. 

With Newtonian telescope you look through the side. Stating the obvious, apologies. 

And I was just about to send you my £1 donation towards your Tak fund.

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, mikeDnight said:

And I was just about to send you my £1 donation towards your Tak fund.

They are competitively priced. I would promise to send your change from the £1.

[garryblueboy]

I’ll be honest the 115 you have is an excellent scope and very manageable the extra 15mm over a 100 is worth it it’s almost a 120 without the weight unless your going to up the aperture a lot more I’d say it’s perfect , better planetary views than the SE6 in my opinion and cuts through bad seeing better and a great engineered scope 

[mikeDnight]

I'd forgot about the 115ED Vixen. If its lighter than the 120ED as Martin believes, I think I'd be tempted to keep hold of it. It will give better rich field views of star fields than a C6 and if it ticks the lunar and planetary box, then why let it go. And "it looks good," it's a win win or at least that's how it seems.

Is the Vixen 115S lens made by Canon Optron like the old fluorites were, and the modern Tak fluorites are? If so, I'd definitely think twice about selling it.

[paulastro]

mikeDnight said:

The seeing conditions on the night were very good, so it might be expected the 120ED would at least keep up with the smaller Tak, but they were worlds apart, with the equatorial and temperate belts, that were packed with detail, almost jumping out in 3D.

 

Really Mike?  Were you wearing your 3-D viewing spectacles at the time?  🤣    Of course it is possible that the seeing was enough to favour the Tak a bit over the larger aperture 120ED on the night, though I'm sure you'll say it wasn't 😊.

Of course, the Tak is the better optical quality,, but it does depend what you're using it for.  For planetary the 100 DC you have is hugely suitable, as it's smaller aperture means that the image is less dazzling at any particular magnification so the detail is not swamped as it can be in larger apertures.   I'm well aware how good the Taks are for planetary, I remember when we shared that memorable view of Jupiter with my DL.

For some people though, as an all-round telescope larger apertures can be better than smaller Taks.  For my eyes a four inch scope just wouldn' t do it as my only scope if deep-sky objects were the target.  This is the reason I reluctantly sold my four inch refractor to buy a 120ED came up at a great price,  

It would be great if you could join us at Kelling this year, your Tak will show far more detail on deep sky than it will at home, though not as much as my 120ED of course 😃.

[John]

24 minutes ago, paulastro said:

mikeDnight said:

The seeing conditions on the night were very good, so it might be expected the 120ED would at least keep up with the smaller Tak, but they were worlds apart, with the equatorial and temperate belts, that were packed with detail, almost jumping out in 3D.

 

Really Mike?  Were you wearing your 3-D viewing spectacles at the time?  🤣    Of course it is possible that the seeing was enough to favour the Tak a bit over the larger aperture 120ED on the night, though I'm sure you'll say it wasn't 😊.

Of course, the Tak is the better optical quality,, but it does depend what you're using it for.  For planetary the 100 DC you have is hugely suitable, as it's smaller aperture means that the image is less dazzling at any particular magnification so the detail is not swamped as it can be in larger apertures.   I'm well aware how good the Taks are for planetary, I remember when we shared that memorable view of Jupiter with my DL.

For some people though, as an all-round telescope larger apertures can be better than smaller Taks.  For my eyes a four inch scope just wouldn' t do it as my only scope if deep-sky objects were the target.  This is the reason I reluctantly sold my four inch refractor to buy a 120ED came up at a great price,  

It would be great if you could join us at Kelling this year, your Tak will show far more detail on deep sky than it will at home, though not as much as my 120ED of course 😃.

I've compared my Skywatcher ED120 to my Tak FC-100DL quite a few times over the past 3 years. The Tak is completely colour free wheras the ED120 shows a touch of purple around the brightest stars but otherwise I feel that the Skywatcher is not shown up at all by the Tak. Or by my LZOS 130 triplet for that matter. This does not mean that I can't see any differences between these scopes but the ED120 optically holds up really well. It produces a cracking star test and I've used it at magnifications over 300x quite often. A few weeks ago I was at an outreach event and had the task of showing the vistitors Neptune. The ED120 provided a well defined disk on the distant planet at 280x. If I'd been observing on my own I could have used more.

I thought buying the Tak and the LZOS would mean curtains for the Skywatcher but it's not turned out that way by any means.

 

 

[mikeDnight]

You'd need a mighty large telescope to be dazzled by Jupiter Paul. And the seeing was good and both scopes were cool. Jupiter's belts did indeed appear 3D in the Tak, almost as if theyed been braided around the planet. The 120ED definitely didn't have an enhanced view despite its greater aperture, that's why i sold it to you. 

It's been a while since you observed with the Tak, so now that the warmer nights are almost upon us along with a high spring moon, you should come round with your 120ED and refresh your memory. If it gets too warm, you can always use your scope to hang your coat on while you observe with mine.