First Night!

[Marky1973]

Well, I got out with my 200p Dob tonight after only having to wait 3 days for a clear sky and I can see this is going to be a difficult hobby to master!   Really struggled to locate anything in the sky using Stellarium/SkEye/Star Chart and Sky Map+ on my mobile - they just don't seem stable enough to use effectively as the screen just seems to jump around all over the place and rarely matched the sky I was seeing with the naked eye. Next time I might just use a compass and Stellarium on my laptop and see how I get on with that - and, either way, as I learn the sky, I am sure I will get better at this stuff! And I have not yet properly started "Turn left at Orion" - so onwards and upwards!

I had hoped to have been able to find at least one DSO, to what sort of images I would see, but in the end, no......

But, I did manage to find the Moon (would have sold the Dob if I hadn't been able to do that) and, what was just mind-blowing, was Jupiter. Found really easily and, through the 10mm at x120, although flickery and difficult to focus cleanly, the banding could clearly be seen, along with some moons.....and that was just awesome. 2 hours in the cold was worth it just for that glimpse!

Now I realise I need a red light torch, some fingerless gloves and a few more eyepieces to vary the magnification!

And probably a flask of tea!

[Qualia]

That's great stuff, Marky and glad you had yourself a great night. I look forward to more adventures and reports

[Langy]

Glad you got to see something Mark. It isn't easy on the first session, especially on your own with no help from someone who has experience.

I think we are blessed to start this time of year with Jupiter high in the sky which is at least one easy object to find.

Not many objects to my list at the moment, but you should find Orion Nebula M42 quite easy. Just look for Orions belt, use Stellarium to at least point yoiu in the right direction. Pleiades M45 is then usually to the right of Orions belt and can be seen with the naked eye as a smudge. You will need a wide EP / low mag for that one. I found Andromeda Galaxy M31 quite early on once. Then it took me ages before I found it again. Another below Jupiter / Gemini is Beehive Cluster a bit more difficult that M45.

If you really want to make things a bit easier get some binoculars. I spent £50 on a pair of Olympus DPSI 10x50 and these are excellent. I can find Andromeda with then in a matter of seconds. Even knowing where it is can still take me 2 minutes with the scope. The bins have to be the best accessory I bought, far better than anything else. With a mount for under £10 you can also mount them on a tripod so if you are using them to help find objects you can flip between the bins and scope without the bins moving around.

This checklist http://astronomychecklist.com/ can give a few ideas as you can sort it by difficulty. Still not an easy thing to do on your own as I am finding out. However just make sure even on a failed session you turn back to the easy ones like Jupiter or the moon to end with and then you still feel that you achieved something.

Trying to read the sky is no easy task for someone new like me, but you have to learn a few points in the sky and look for local objects to that so that you can get your bearings better.

Let us know how you get on in the future.

[Paul73]

+1 for the binos.

I use aps on my phone. The trick is, to switch off the function where you hold it up to the sky and it has a crack at id'ing things for you. Just use it as a map. Make sure that the time is set to now, red screen is on ompreserve your night sight and switch on the constalation lines (join the dots) this will show you the patterns that you are looking for.

Good luck with the targets suggested by other Paul above. All of them great sights.

Paul

[dick_dangerous]

Well the forecasts seem pretty good for tonight, so give it another go! If you're using a finderscope, tweak the alignment on something nice and bright like Jupiter before going hunting for DSOs - a lot of people recommend telrads and rdfs but personally I like the magnification of a finder.

Mars should be high enough to observe around 11pm onwards tonight, and is another good bright target. It's currently to the left of the star Spica, found by following the handle of the Plough to Arcturus and then continuing on to Spica ("Arc to Arcturus then Spike to Spica").

All but the brightest DSOs will be drowned out by the moon, unless you stay up late / get up early to wait for it to set. Try a few open clusters as these are rather less sensitive to moonlight - M67, M35, M36, M37, M38, M46 and M47 are all lovely targets right now, and as suggested above, M42 looks lovely no matter where you are.

Best of luck!

DD

[Orange Haze]

Hi Mark. I think many of us had that initial experience of struggling to find something to look at. I know I did. The thing that made it a lot easier for me was getting a red dot finder, in my case a Rigel Quickfinder. Some prefer the Telrad which does effectively the same thing of projecting a couple of concentric circles onto the night sky. Means that you are always starting in the right ballpark when you search. There are Messier maps that have these circles printed on them to help find DSOs.

Some prefer just the finderscope. It's a matter of individual preference but might be worth having a look to see if you can try one out.

Meant to be clear tonight so I hope you find some more targets. Happy viewing!

[Marky1973]

Thanks for the comments and advice on some things to look for - will hopefully get out tonight and have another go - Jupiter was worth lugging the 200p out of the house alone, so i am sure it can only get better. I do have some x8 binoculars that I found lying around the house which are okay, but maybe that is an investment to think about. Will also have a think about alternative finder scopes, but do feel I should persevere with what I have to start with, while I get familar with the sky....well, apart from maybe some more eyepieces! )

I think the main thing is learning the constellations and getting used to seeing them upside down and back to front! Its just tricky finding them when there is so much light pollution.....amazing to look up just the the bins and see how many more stars are visible!

And perhaps I'll take the laptop with stellarium out tonight and just use a compass to pin point which direction I am looking in!

I can find Orion quite easily, so might have a go for M42 tonight!

Cheers

Mark

[swamp thing]

Keep at it Mark it'll come buddy.

I found my way about using a planisphere and a red torch when I was starting out. I kmow it's not techy or exciting but it worked good for me. Cheap too

Once I had a grasp of the constellations I moved on to a star atlas (Nortons). Great book as it gives suggestions on what to look at. This I found very helpful.

Good hunting buddy and clear skies.

[todd8137]

I would not worry it sounds familiar ,where's the dso ? You have a life time to find all the goodies that are waiting ,if it was easy you would be board after a couple a weeks ,start with low power ,invest in a decent 32mm ep to zoom around with it's one,of,my most used eps to be honest ,take ya time start with those that are naked eye,Orion Nebula ,Pleiades ,the moon M35 ,ect

Just enjoy the things you can find if it's any constellation pardon the pun took me about a year to do most of the messier and Herschel. Stuff study star maps on cold cloudy nights

Pat

[Charic]

Really struggled to locate anything in the sky using Stellarium/SkEye/Star Chart and Sky Map+ on my mobile - they just don't seem stable enough to use effectively as the screen just seems to jump around all over the place and rarely matched the sky I was seeing with the naked eye

Will also have a think about alternative finder scopes, but do feel I should persevere with what I have to start with

I think the main thing is learning the constellations and getting used to seeing them upside down and back to front!

Its just tricky finding them when there is so much light pollution.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Marky1973........ In Stellarium you can go into the Configuration, Tools menu, here you can set a folder for screen capture images by pressing  CTRL+S and have the screen image (after cropping) printed to A4 paper if you have a printer. Don't forget to tick the box, "Invert Colours" Then using a RED torch to reduce damage to your night vision. I dont like Mobile Apps or Laptops near the scope, ruins my eyesight, even under  "Red Dimmed" screen?

When using the default Finder Scope 9x50, keep BOTH eyes open. Its easier to align on the subject.

The Joys of reflectors and refractors. The OTA (REFL) will be Left-Right and the finder(REFR) Up-Down. You can change the orientation of Stellarium to match the telescope, 

Also in the Sky and Viewing Options, set Stellarium to introduce a certain amount of light pollution. This enables you to set Stellarium to match more or less what you can see outdoors. 

[Marky1973]

@Steve - a planisphere is probably something I will pick up next week - I am starting to think that my love of all things techy is probably not best suited to beginning astronomy! I need to figure the basics out first! And get better at "nudging"!

@Pat - I was thinking of a 32mm EP for scouting....would I be right in presuming that cheaper Plossls are fine for this wider view? I presume the can be more forgiving than higher mags, so probably nor worth paying a lot, or as much as you would for a good quality higher mag EP?

@Charic - thanks for the tips on Stellarium - only downloaded it on Thursday so still working my way through the menus and settings figuring out what everything does, should make it easier. Will print some out and get a head torch too.....probably better (and safer) than taking the laptop out......and i have a copy of Turn Left at Orion, so will start using that with a vengeance soon!

The main thing is that, after over an hour of struggling to find my way around, I'm still keen to get out and have another go tonight.....have been under a bit of pressure at work and lots of hassle, and it was surprisingly therapeutic sitting out in the dark gazing into space!

[todd8137]

Hi mines a baader classic plossl does the job around 50"quid mark as a said I use it all the time unlike high power ep''s that do not get a look in the more ya pay the better but a standard skywatcher 32mm will do the job just as good,that's hat I had till I left,it on a,hill top,in Buxton

Pat

[Charic]

.............and i have a copy of Turn Left at Orion, so will start using that with a vengeance soon!

Surprising how many books we recommend then just skip through them! I was into TLAO just last Week again, amazing how much  more there is.  Just gotta sit and be patient and read. Especially with this weather spell. It will soon be Winter here! Looking like it could snow right now. Clouds are really moody?

And EPs! ........The standard 25mm at 52° AFOV was too small for M31 Andromeda for my liking, from a dark site.  I couldn't fit it all in? so I became interested in the GSO 32mm 2" at about £50 and the Skywatcher Panaview at about £70. It was a close decision!

It may be the only 2" EP in your collection. And you think the Telescope was big (compared to the tiny supplied SW's?)

[Marky1973]

I do like a read Charic, so will start working on that - I am mildy OCD so have to read the instruction manuals from start to finish first! Although one of the books that came with the scope, in the section on photography talked about the "increasing popularity" of 1 hour photo processing....sonot sure how up to date it is!

@Pat - if I find it can I have it?

Seriously though, I have been looking and was thinking that a 32mm to go with the stock 10 and 25mm I have, alongside the Baader 1.3/2.25x Barlow that FLO have should give me a good range of mags from 37x to 270x - which is probably pushing the useable limits of the DOB - for a resonable outlay....although I am sure I will change my mind tomorrow.....too much choice!

[Marky1973]

Oh and the weather down here is not so bad Charic, although there is some light cloud coming in threatening the supposed clear nights - promised the kids they coudl have a look at Jupiter tonight, so it better be clear!

[todd8137]

Yes if ya find it you can have it also the fold away table and flask ,but a good 32mm is a must I think great lower power blasting ,have a look around orion belt with one or around Cassiopeia. Just brill and a good galaxy buster

Pat

[Charic]

I'm not OCD, but with you on the manuals, gotta have it all?

You can set the limits of magnification, their not strictly limited?   Although our Dobs have a theoretical mag of twice the Aperture (using mm ) so 200mm becomes 400x and due to UK skies we say half that to about 200X or about 240x maybe, there's nothing wrong with looking at the Moon at 375X, as I used to with the revelation 2.5xBarlow on my 8mm . I could go to 480X max now on my 5mm, but not sure what that will look like. Just waiting for the Moon to arrive in my view of the skies. 

A  high focal length wide angle view is just amazing to look through. Everything seems to stand still in a sea of Space! And you really do need a low powered wide angle EP to see the wonders of something like M31 Andromeda from a Dark Site (really dark) It will just blow you away. Your supplied 25mm is a Modified Kellner EP,  Its ok, but the 10mm could be bettered by the use of say an 8mm BST Starguider. Much brighter image, much wider view, and better eye relief. 

[VikN46]

Patience, warm clothes and a smidge of luck, but you will find many great things in time. Keep at it and it will all come together and you will be able to wizz around the night sky like an expert in no time! Keep at it and you will be so proud to find all the objects!!! Start small/easy, experiment and work up, its part of the fun! All the best

[Marky1973]

Cheers! Will definitely keep at it!

[Marky1973]

Charic - just seen a couple of your edits - I was wondering about 2" EPs - are the advantages jsut about a better field of view, or are there other things at play?

And I have read some good things about the BSTs, so that could be a good option for a better higher power EP.

LIke I said - too much choice!

[Charic]

The 2" EP's will effectively offer a wider view than the 1.25" barrel can achieve, due to the size of the barrel. But you cant go to wide with a Reflector telescope. I think about 41mm would be your limit, But 32mm seems to be a sweet spot, and good on price too. 

The BST's are great for my eyes, and recommended by many. If you buy them in pairs you can trial them, returning the one you don't like. I have the whole set. This allows me to frame the object as best as possible. A 32mm , Your 25mm and an 8mm BST would suffice for a good while, but no rush to get them all at once, enjoy the moment of what you already have

[bogdog]

half hour before heading out study roughly in stellarium where your viewpoint would be ex: looking south

sketch on a paper the things around a constellation that sticks out and you seem familliar finding easily

if you have it mapped out on paper you will know roughly the area you need to search to find what you picked out to view

nothing worse when starting than just wildy scanning trying hard to find something to intrest you esp as you start to get colder..been there done that

goodluck for tonight

[bogdog]

oh forgot ..(and hope you dont)..take the paper out with you  

[ronl]

Try this link http://freestarcharts.com/index.php/messier-catalogue you can download

and print all the sky charts, I laminate them, then they don't get soggy when the dew

comes down or does it come up, it's a pain anyway, and do get a red torch. 

[Marky1973]

Hah! Bogdog, that is exactly the sort of thing I would do....good idea though!

And thanks for the link Ron, will have a look. Have Turn Left at Orion, so will have a read fo that in case I do get out later for a viewing.....M42 was recommended and is right in the middle, so should be able to at least get close.

Did just get out quickly with the kids to show them Jupiter and did have a slightly better view than last night - presumably as it was a bit higher in the sky as it is earlier in the evening. With just the 25mm EP, got a nice view of 3 or 4 bands and the 4 main moons, very bright, and the kids got to see it after pestering me all day! Result!