Sp@ce_d 's Esprit 80

[Gina]

I think they're to attach the focuser to the body but I could be wrong - haven't tried to undo it (yet).

A few minutes later... been out to the obsy and I can confirm that the "capstan wheel" is indeed functional - it's a rim that screws onto the scope body and holds the focuser.  When undone the focuser is loose but I couldn't tell if it will rotate as I have a focussing motor attached.  I don't want to take things apart as I have it set up for PA for the next clear night.

[FLO]

Please tell me they're real.

They are real, not ornamental. 

Fuzzy balls, yes. Furry dice, no. Sorry  

[JohnC64]

Yes - Just undid it - the ring was very tight on mine and took a bit of budging - Might need something to ease thread movement on there.  At the moment i prefer the previous method i described to get field rotation. 

John

[ollypenrice]

They are real, not ornamental. 

Fuzzy balls, yes. Furry dice, no. Sorry

Whoa, I didn't believe they'd be ornamantal, hence my question. It's the owners who thought they were.  This is where manuals come into their own. I hope I get one with the EQ8!!

Olly

[Gina]

Yes you do get a manual with the EQ8   Two in fact - one for the mount and tripod/pier and another for the handset.

[ollypenrice]

Yes you do get a manual with the EQ8   Two in fact - one for the mount and tripod/pier and another for the handset.

Good!

I know that rotating things can be a big deal for anyone in mid-image but it is good to know that the Esprit 80 has a rotator. I'd rather go down as a person who encouraged this discovery than as a reflex SW basher, which I'm certainly not!!! Far from it.

Olly

[JohnC64]

It was only when I had the scope on the  mount that was able to undo the rotating ring.  Now that its loosened, its still a little rough and will take a little fettling and boot polish to get it smooth. Yes nice to have one.

A manual would be nice too - even a pdf on the web as a download. Guess it will take a little time.

John

[Gina]

If they can produce them for their mounts I wonder why they can't produce them for their telescopes

[Sp@ce_d]

Hmm well I tried turning the "capstan" yesterday and felt that any more excursion on them and they might snap off so retreated..  I guess I can try the "Boa" on it. I've tried the other method tonight and the locking ring does work but you have to allow for some slack to tighten into position.

I think I've sorted the focuser, part of the problem seemed to be the locking lever and I also think some of it is temperature related. It looks like the lock wasn't releasing properly and actually being a bit forceful by locking it right over ( I only pushed it to resistance before) & releasing a few times has done the trick. This also seems to have cured the focus shift too.. which I'm very impressed with now 

Even before I sorted the lock out I noticed it had eased off a bit better in that it wasn't so bad getting to a high point and making a noise any more. I think thats because it has now spent 2 days in the obsy & its cold.. been icy & pretty frosty here last 2 nights. Anyway, winding it in and out a lot and sorting the lock out has made a difference.

Oh and the focus point is almost at the end of travel too at 5 and a half only 2 notches left!

I got 15x300 each of LRGB on M81/2 last night (and 4 hours Ha on the ED80 ) but I haven't had time process it properly. I can make the data available on dropbox if anyone wants to take a look.

Got the triple shooter running tonight on the Elephant but the seeing is starting to degrade. I'm also trying out OAG for the first time.. (The SX FW/OAG) bit of a different looking graph to the finder/guider..

[JohnC64]

Glad to hear that the focuser and focus lock is sorted. I'm going to take a look at the rotator on mine tomorrow as its stiff and "lumpy" when rotating. think it should be easy enough to resolve though.

Like you i didn't want to push the capstan too hard and it took a bit of welly to loosen it.

Good luck with the Elephant - looking forward to seeing your M81/82

Cheers John

[Sp@ce_d]

It looks like my spacing was just under 54mm for last nights subs. I'll put that down to building it indoors and not allowing for re tightening after cooling down in the obsy.

Clouds put an end to tonight a while ago so I had a quick play with the M81 data. Doubt I'll have chance to spend processing time on it for a bit so I might as well post up what I've got..

LRGB - 300 x 15 Each - No calibration

[jezhughes]

I've been reading the flattener nightmares around the boards, and getting frustrated tonight after a dry run with my OAG. I have a 13mm focus difference with my guidecam / 460ex now, meaning i have to ADD 13mm back behind the OAG.

With this flattener it seems impossible to even use an OAG now.

This is turning out to be the biggest anti climax scope i've owned so far. And i haven't even put a pixel through it yet 

[Sp@ce_d]

Yeah fussiest spacing I've had to deal with & I'm only using a 285 chip! I keep meaning to dig out the 1000d & see what it looks like with that. I've been trying to get it integrated into the triple shooter setup too so only just starting to get some results but they are starting to look promising

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sp@ce_d]

This is a 30min per channel test run just with the Esprit.. cropped as corners were a bit out with the spacing & shot through thin cloud/moisture..

[Sp@ce_d]

I've been reading the flattener nightmares around the boards, and getting frustrated tonight after a dry run with my OAG. I have a 13mm focus difference with my guidecam / 460ex now, meaning i have to ADD 13mm back behind the OAG.

With this flattener it seems impossible to even use an OAG now.

This is turning out to be the biggest anti climax scope i've owned so far. And i haven't even put a pixel through it yet 

You could try an integrated FW/OAG. I have the SX USB Mini FW/OAG & it works well on my other scopes, although I haven't tried it with the Esprit as I put the EFW2 on it, but the spacing should be ok.

[Gina]

As discussed in another thread, FLO will be producing a custom adapter to use the EFW2 and 460EX on the Esprit 80ED with field flattener.  In fact they've already produced a prototype which I shall be testing.  I shall be reporting results in that thread as I get them.  Don't worry - between us FOL and I will be getting this sorted out   FLO will be producing adapters for other imaging rigs too - other cameras and filter wheels, I gather.  Steve from FLO is bringing the replacement scope plus the prototype adapter this afternoon   I'm hoping to do some testing this evening as the weather forecast is good.

[FLO]

I am surprised people are having so much trouble because at 55mm the spacing requirements are no different to the majority of other flattener/reducers.

At f5 the spacing will be more critical (near enough isn't good enough) than the more commonly available f6 and f7 refractors, but again that is not unique to the Esprit-80. The same can be said of any other f5 triplet.

I am swopping Gina's Esprit-80 this afternoon and will use hers with a Atik 460EX and EFW2 for my own imaging so will have firsthand experience soon. 

Regarding the Starlight Xpress Mini Filter Wheel with OAG, it is set-up for use with Starlight Xpress cameras. SX cameras have 17.5mm(isn) sensor to flange distance whereas Atik cameras typically have 13.5mm. If using an Atik camera with a SX wheel/oag the camera would need to be mounted approx 4mm further back (to achieve the same effective position as the OAG pick-up prism). Finding a spacer to achieve this would be a challenge. 

Spacing shenanigans like these are a nuisance but we are doing our best to find and make the information available. We are also having custom adapters made. 

HTH, 

Steve 

[FLO]

PS: I was called away half-way through posting so didn't notice Gina's post saying the same  

[Sp@ce_d]

I am surprised people are having so much trouble because at 55mm the spacing requirements are no different to the majority of other flattener/reducers.

At f5 the spacing will be more critical (near enough isn't good enough) than the more commonly available f6 and f7 refractors, but again that is not unique to the Esprit-80. The same can be said of any other f5 triplet.

I am swopping Gina's Esprit-80 this afternoon and will use hers with a Atik 460EX and EFW2 for my own imaging so will have firsthand experience soon. 

Regarding the Starlight Xpress Mini Filter Wheel with OAG, it is set-up for use with Starlight Xpress cameras. SX cameras have 17.5mm(isn) sensor to flange distance whereas Atik cameras typically have 13.5mm. If using an Atik camera with a SX wheel/oag the camera would need to be mounted approx 4mm further back (to achieve the same effective position as the OAG pick-up prism). Finding a spacer to achieve this would be a challenge. 

Spacing shenanigans like these are a nuisance but we are doing our best to find and make the information available. We are also having custom adapters made. 

HTH, 

Steve 

I've noticed less tolerance of incorrect spacing showing more readily on the Esprit as opposed to my 2 WO scope's & the SW80ED. I normally get away with a fair bit with the WO's & 314L+'s. With the Esprit I've had to add delrin spacers in several places to fine tune & get it back further. I still don't think I have the right spacing for a bigger chip though. Unfortunately at the moment there's not a safe enough thread length left anywhere to add more.

One thing about the FLO adapter/spacer Steve. Will it allow the use of a 2" LDAS ( or any other) in the light train, as the 80ED one does? A lot of people leave one in there, myself included.

I haven't tried the SX FW/OAG on it yet but it work   s fine with the 80ED & currently on the ZS71. I have a varied selection of spacers I've cannibalised from TS & MA (shame you don't stock more fiddly bits Steve) that I can normally tweak things with. Not sure what I've used now (at work) for the extra back focus between the 314 & FW but I think it does involve more delrin spacers.

The FW itself (from FLO) is neat. First time I've used an OAG & once I'd worked out how you adjust the camera position ( no instructions as they only cover the bigger FW!) I was away. The only thing I'm missing is not having 7 slots.. but as I got it to use with the triple setup I'm really tight for space squeezing it all together anyway. Its a neat solution I recommend it. Oh, & no signs of the flex issues from previous SX OAG's it's nice & solid.

[jezhughes]

You could try an integrated FW/OAG. I have the SX USB Mini FW/OAG & it works well on my other scopes, although I haven't tried it with the Esprit as I put the EFW2 on it, but the spacing should be ok.

I am surprised people are having so much trouble because at 55mm the spacing requirements are no different to the majority of other flattener/reducers.

At f5 the spacing will be more critical (near enough isn't good enough) than the more commonly available f6 and f7 refractors, but again that is not unique to the Esprit-80. The same can be said of any other f5 triplet.

I am swopping Gina's Esprit-80 this afternoon and will use hers with a Atik 460EX and EFW2 for my own imaging so will have firsthand experience soon. 

Regarding the Starlight Xpress Mini Filter Wheel with OAG, it is set-up for use with Starlight Xpress cameras. SX cameras have 17.5mm(isn) sensor to flange distance whereas Atik cameras typically have 13.5mm. If using an Atik camera with a SX wheel/oag the camera would need to be mounted approx 4mm further back (to achieve the same effective position as the OAG pick-up prism). Finding a spacer to achieve this would be a challenge. 

Spacing shenanigans like these are a nuisance but we are doing our best to find and make the information available. We are also having custom adapters made. 

HTH, 

Steve 

Have seen the other thread, i appreciate what's going on and the work going in for the right spacer. To my understanding and tinkering, getting the distance right between for a FF/FW/CCD isn't an issue here, it can mathematically be achieved. My point is, add a 9mm OAG in there and it becomes impossible. Add another 3mm in there to align the CCD and guide cam focus distances and it seems to become full on impossible.

Maybe I have made an error somewhere along the way, but i've shaved off every mm i can on the OAG and I can't imagine there's an OAG slimmer than 9mm out there.

It seems the only solution for me is to either go for a filter wheel/OAG combo, or give up on OAGs and get a small guide scope ( ). 

Sorry for hijacking the thread a bit. It's a bit frustrating it being a clear moonless night forecast here and i can't do much about it because of a cheeky 3mm in the rig, that's all 

[Sp@ce_d]

... snip

Sorry for hijacking the thread a bit. It's a bit frustrating it being a clear moonless night forecast here and i can't do much about it because of a cheeky 3mm in the rig, that's all 

Hey no problem.. it's still relevant to the topic anyway.

Squeezing in an OAG & FW into 55mm is still a problem with other scopes though.. not just the Esprit. This is one of the reasons i held off going down the OAG route until an integrated solution came along. ie. even Atiks OAG added to the EFW2 would be too much for any of my scopes.

[FLO]

One thing about the FLO adapter/spacer Steve. Will it allow the use of a 2" LDAS ( or any other) in the light train, as the 80ED one does? A lot of people leave one in there, myself included.

(shame you don't stock more fiddly bits Steve)

Unfortunately not (at least not atm) because the adapter threads directly to the flattener at one end and the EFW2 filter wheel at the other. Our FLO adapter for Skywatcher focal reducers has a 2" push-fit nosepiece so it was a simple matter to include a filter thread. 

I know what you mean about lack of fiddly bits but we will be reorganising our adapters section and will add more, including some that won't be available anywhere else

Squeezing in an OAG & FW into 55mm is still a problem with other scopes though.. not just the Esprit. 

That's what I was trying to say

Steve 

[Sp@ce_d]

Unfortunately not (at least not atm) because the adapter threads directly to the flattener at one end and the EFW2 filter wheel at the other. Our FLO adapter for Skywatcher focal reducers has a 2" push-fit nosepiece so it was a simple matter to include a filter thread. 

... snip

Steve 

I meant to add that the current adapter supplied has a M48 thread inside for a filter.. which I'm using.. hence pushing the backfocus out a bit more..

[jezhughes]

Hey no problem.. it's still relevant to the topic anyway.

Squeezing in an OAG & FW into 55mm is still a problem with other scopes though.. not just the Esprit. This is one of the reasons i held off going down the OAG route until an integrated solution came along. ie. even Atiks OAG added to the EFW2 would be too much for any of my scopes.

Appreciate that. It does lead to the question of why an OAG even exists then - one i hadn't even thought of before. If you're using an OAG, you're clearly sensitive about your imaging, so you'd clearly always use a flattener/reducer; but if the two don't play ball the whole endeavor becomes redundant. Another bank breaking lesson learnt. I'm off to re-purchase a guide scope, can't wait for the flex! 

[FLO]

Appreciate that. It does lead to the question of why an OAG even exists then - one i hadn't even thought of before. 

There isn't a strong argument in favour of using an OAG with short-tube refractors because, as Olly often reminds us, they can be setup and locked nice and solid. Your 250 PDS, on the other hand, with it's large rolled-steel tube is prone to differential flexure (the telescope body flexes more than your guidescope).  An OAG solves this problem. Your C11 SCT, with it's long 2800mm focal length, would also benefit from an OAG. 

HTH