Deep sky imaging from scratch??

[Craigb350]

Like i said i am new to this,

I have been blown away with some of the images of nebula, and just astronomy in general, it has always been a slight interest, but i have been reading a book on the big bang relative theory and im hooked,

I have always been into the photography, and would love to combine the 2,

I appreciate to get images, alot comes into it, i.e correct rig and scope etc, but i even if i can photo something in the sky more than a bright spec of a star would be an acheivement to me.

Thanks

Craig

[Alien 13]

Obviously with this though, you will end up with star trails as the camera is not tracking?

If you used a fast 18mm lens you can do exposures of around 30 seconds without star trails being too bad as a general rule of thumb i use the 400/FL rule so 400mm FL would be 1 second 40mm would be 10 seconds etc.

This does limit you to a handful of targets however but costs nothing if you already have the kit.

Alan

[johnrt]

Do people used the dedicated CCD cameras or there DSLRs?

Both, it all boils down to what Sara said above - how far do you want to take your imaging, striving for the absolute best quality image you can means a mono ccd and filters, an imaging scope of quality and long exposures achieved with a robust accurate mount and guiding set up.

This is something you can work up to, a DSLR lens and astrotrack mount is a great way to start, oh and Steve Richard's book.

[PhotoGav]

Oh Craig, you've asked the perennial question! All the answers so far are spot on. Read the book and look at images in the imaging section of the forum, taking note of the equipment used to make the ones that you like.

You need to come up with a realistic starting budget for yourself. What do you have in the bank that you can spend on this hobby straight away? Is that a couple of hundred quid or fifteen hundred pounds or more? That will determine where you can jump on to the ladder. By the way, from my experience, there is no last rung on the ladder - it stretches right up to that dark night sky and beyond!!

I started with a Skywatcher HEQ5 and ED80 kit from FLO, plus some bits and bobs to make it work with my Canon 60D. I had great fun with that set up and even managed to make some images that I was really proud of. I have built up to the current kit in my sig and only now do I feel like I'm starting to make the kind of images that I set out to make. That's approaching £9k later!! Be warned!

The other factor in all of this is the post processing set up. You need a good grasp of Photoshop to make something of the data you gather.

Finally, this hobby takes a great deal of time and patience. The frustrations are immense. However, when you manage to overcome all the obstacles and make an image you really like, the buzz is stupidly addictive!

Good luck and enjoy.

[DaveS]

I will add that where a CCD really scores is with our rubbish weather you have to take any oppertunity you can, and a CCD with NB filters will enable you to shoot through the moonlight that seems to afflict every clear night we get. It's also a sure-fire weapon against the omnipresent light pollution.

[Marky1973]

Hi Craig, you are where I was a few months ago and have been slowly edging towards budget imaging - and it can be done on a budget. The equipment I have is the very basic, and will not achieve the glorious pictures you see on these very pages, but it is a good starting point for me. I didn't want to spend out a lot and find I was rubbish at it and find myself stuck with equipment I wasn't using. Obviously, as some have said, the flip side to this is that you get the bug and then want to upgrade quickly.

This is what I use for imaging (too had the camera to start with so have not factored that in):

(actually I sort of had the scope as well, as I bought it for a Lapland Trip this Christmas, but if you need the scope, you need the scope!)

1. EQ3-2 - clearance special £120 (this was a "new" clearance item, but you can find them for similar prices on Ebay)
2. RA Motor - £70
3. Starwave ED70 refractor (£400 - came with red-dot finder, eyepice and diagonal in a carry case, so a useable scope whether imaging or not - you can get the scope alone for £300)
4. Making Every Photon Count
5. Extension tube (to achieve focus with the camera) £25
6. T-Ring adapter - to fit the extension tube to the camera £15 (there are cheaper on Ebay, but I went for a brand I knew)
7. Bhatinov Mask to help with focus £10 (optional, but it does help)
8. EQ3-2 Polar Scope £32 (possibly pointless as you can't see any of the calibration marks, so looking to modify it with a red LED - or buy an illuminated version)
9. Remote shutter control for the Camera £5 from ebay

It also helps to have a laptop with the Canon EOS software on to set up imaging runs, DSS (which I think you mentioned) and GIMP for procesing the images if you don't have Paintshop - GIMP is free!

Even all that is heading to £700, not including the stuff I had lying around. Need to get a spare battery as well, so the costs will always keep going up. Oh and the RA motor takes 4 D-Cells, so you can add a few quid for that!

And obviously check out the classifieds on here and AstroBuyAndSell for bargains scopes/tripods/mounts - there are some great second hand items out there!

I will probably aim for a field flattener as an upgrade in the new year, which is another £75, and will make the extension tube redundant. I am also looking into Light Pollution filters, which seem to range upwards of £50 for a decent one.

Having said that, I built it up over time and have been using the scope for visual, alongside my 8" Dob at the same time, taking my time to get used to the scope.

I've had two goes at imaging and, while I am not going to be winning competitions, you can see what I managed to get from Andromeda on my second run with just half an hour of data in a moon-lit sky (20x90sec exposures) in my other post HERE. It isn't a stunning image, but I was very happy when it popped up!

Taking time with polar alignment and setting up the tripod, mount and scope, I am hopeful that I can get up to 120 second exposures, but we will see.

So, if you want to try your hand at imaging as cheaply as possibly (and beyond wide-field/star trail images) you can do it with the basic tools, but you will be limited in what you can achieve - you won't be on the front cover of Sky at Night Magazine most likely, but it is a hell of a lot of fun playing around. Astrophotography is a steep learning curve (very steep) and (for me) it was better to start cheap and experiment, than splurge and go for broke, only to find I didn't enjoy it, or couldn't do it.

Of course, the problem with this is that I seem to be able to do it and am enjoying learning (even when 3 hours of procesing in DSS just results in a crashed laptop) so I am sure that I will be looking to upgrade in the new year! :-)

Good luck, whatever you decide to do!

[pyrasanth]

I have got totally hooked on deep sky photography. My results are still not good but getting better. It really is a money pit if you get hooked & I've spent nearly £20K on the equipment I have but have all angles covered with what I'm trying to achieve. I believe that you should invest in the best equipment your budget allows and spend at least half of that budget on a good mount. Guiding is everything & the guiding difficulties increase as you pursue longer exposures at longer focal lengths.

Small refractors can produce stunning images and as there focal length is typically smaller guiding errors can be more forgiving but again this is not an excuse to have a poor mount and always expect stunning results.

I very rarely put a visual eyepiece in the telescope now as I find CCD more gratifying.

Good luck to you & I hope to see your first images on the forum.

[Craigb350]

Thanks for the replies,

I think looking at it, its going to be abit out of my reach at this particular point in my life haha,

Got a 17 month and house etc, so i have alot of outgoings, but im sure in the future when its calmed down...if ever haha

I will invest some money into it, i was thinking i could virtually go for the likes of a 300-400 scope with goto mount as a package, but i can appreciate you need a good smooth mount, as i have used a family members celestron nexstar slt60 and this has the goto function, but i dont think it would be much good with my canon body attatched too it,

Probably would be good for pics of the moon, but thats probably it.

Thanks for your advice and time,

P.S. im still interested in astronomy and will probably keep my eye out for anyone willing to show us more 

[PhotoGav]

Craig, there's still an awful lot that can be achieved on a tight budget. I think this thread has all been about ensuring that your expectations are in line with your budget. The amazingly detailed and rich images of faint nebulae come at a price, that's all!

Keep an eye on the second hand market, there's always plenty of movement there as people upgrade their kit.

Finally, don't underestimate the power of the standard camera lens... The winning picture in this year's Astronomy Photographer Of The Year was taken at 33mm!

Above all, enjoy the night sky, it is the most beautiful thing we have and as the mad Maggie says "Get outside and get looking up!".

[Marky1973]

What Gav says! Don't give up - you can always start with wide-field as you have the camera - get yourself a fairly robust tripod and away you go.

You could aso try your hand with a barn door tracker which some people have used to great effect. If you search this site or google it, there will be loads of guides and instructions on how to make one. Mine probably cost about £60 all told, and most of that cost was in the ball head as I didn't have a spare one. I had to buy the metal rod, but had some of the other bits and pieces lying around.

To be honest, i haven't really used it - I did manage to get some images from it, but was planning to motorise it as I just didn't have a stady enough hand, and the tripod was a bit shaky, so longer exposures were a nightmare. But they can be effective.

Then build the other stuff off slowly. Get a mount second hand, use that with your camera for a while, then get the motors....etc.etc

I spent £190 on my mount and motors and, a week later, was kicking myself after a full Goto EQ3-2 turned up on AstroBuyAndSell for £250! So keep your eyes peeled!

[Craigb350]

I will check the the barn door method out i have a giottos tripod which is very stable,

i will also check that website out!

[Astrosurf]

Whatever you decide, following these excellent people's advice, have a look for second-hand kit. Astro Buy and Sell are very good:

http://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/

Be careful with eBay but don't dismiss it. I've got stuff off there with no problems.

Good luck!

Alexxx

[Zakalwe]

Have a look at this site to see what can be done with a DSLR, a wide-angle lens and a standard tripod.

http://www.lonelyspeck.com/

As others have said, it all depends on budget, time willing to be invested and a certain level of masochism (try DSO imaging on the Lancashire coast!). To get images of the level that can be seen in forums costs, both in time invested and in £££s.

[Liquid360]

I perhaps oversimplified, but I looked around and picked the images I wanted to take, then looked at what equipment was used for said photos, and bought that equipment.