Embarrassing Jupiters webcam clinic

[JB80]

Have you got the camera settings used they should be in the sharpcap folder along with the avi.

Yep, sorry about that I didn't transfer them from the laptop but have got them now.

Brightness=46

Contrast=58

Saturation=0

Gamma=0

ColorEnable=255

BacklightCompensation=255

Gain=51

Exposure=-9

Resolution=640x480

Frame Rate (fps)=10.00

Colour Space / Compression=I420

[DrRobin]

Hi Stargazer Jack,

Stuart is probably better placed than me to offer advice, but I have an SPC and went for the Microsoft Lifecam Studio. It was failry easy to convert (G Honis's website has the details) and offers 1200x768 resolution. They are also a true USB 2.0 interface so can deliver high frame rates.

Stuart will tell you that they lack some of the controls that the SPC has and they have a slight over sensitivity to red, but apart from that I think they are a good low cost alternative to the SPC. My picture above was with a Lifecam, actually it's first outing that night but I did take AVI's over a 2 hour period, only stopping the change barlow/focus/re-align, so I am pretty pleased with the results.

I am actually thinking of a DFK/DBK 21 or 31, but then they start from £240 so quite a big jump. Again Stuart has a DFK so I am sure he can let you and me know his thoughts.

[Stargazer Jack]

Thanks for the advice DrRobin, your images are very good so well done

[Space Cowboy]

Yep, sorry about that I didn't transfer them from the laptop but have got them now.

Brightness=46

Contrast=58

Saturation=0

Gamma=0

ColorEnable=255

BacklightCompensation=255

Gain=51

Exposure=-9

Resolution=640x480

Frame Rate (fps)=10.00

Colour Space / Compression=I420

Those settings are fine. Did you use a Barlow? Is your scope f5? If so then a 4 or 5x barlow or 3x with extension tube will give you a larger image and more detail (if seeing is reasonable). For Jupiter you need to be shooting between f25-30 to get the best results.

[Space Cowboy]

Hi Stargazer Jack,

Stuart is probably better placed than me to offer advice, but I have an SPC and went for the Microsoft Lifecam Studio. It was failry easy to convert (G Honis's website has the details) and offers 1200x768 resolution. They are also a true USB 2.0 interface so can deliver high frame rates.

Stuart will tell you that they lack some of the controls that the SPC has and they have a slight over sensitivity to red, but apart from that I think they are a good low cost alternative to the SPC. My picture above was with a Lifecam, actually it's first outing that night but I did take AVI's over a 2 hour period, only stopping the change barlow/focus/re-align, so I am pretty pleased with the results.

I am actually thinking of a DFK/DBK 21 or 31, but then they start from £240 so quite a big jump. Again Stuart has a DFK so I am sure he can let you and me know his thoughts.

It will be interesting to see your comparison Robin between the spc 900 and lifecam. Before splashing out on a DFK I did consider trying the lifecam for its higher frame rate but then the new 618 chipped DFK became available so I took the plunge.

I think the spc 880/900 is the best value for money cam anywhere and you would need to spend £200 more to see any real improvement.

Here is a comparison I did between spc and dfk :

http://stargazerslounge.com/imaging-planetary/159813-jupiter-oct-15th-2-scopes-2-cameras.html

Personally I think an experienced imager will produce a superior image with a spc webcam over an inexperienced person with dfk/dbk.

I've not seen a lifecam image anywhere that can match the spc.

[Space Cowboy]

Hi Stuart,

I think I have the latest version of Reg 6. I downloaded it and installed it anyway. What happens is it selects about 70 to 80 alignments points, goes through okay and then when it stacks the image at the end has black rectangles on it or just complete garbage. I don't seem to be able to get it to stack correctly, looking throught the release notes I am not sure if this has been raised or fixed.

I actually thought the seeing was best around 9pm. By 10pm I had swapped to the 5x Power Mate, but when I went back to the 3x TV it didn't look as clear as an hour previously.

I packed up soon after 10pm, but took the dog out for a walk later and noticed quite a haze (dew) in the air. That's up in Newcastle, it may have been different where you are?

Not sure about the Lifecam, you certainly don't get as many controls to fiddle with as an SPC900, I think next time I will try both and just to capture Jupiter and all the moons I think I will try the Atik as well.

I will send the results though for your seasoned eye. Great thread by the way, will/are you doing another for Saturn?

All I can suggest Robin is using just a couple of alignment points in Reg 6. I usually do this as it takes so long to process with multiple points and there is not much difference in the final result (if any).

Glad you like the thread concept

Saturn is pretty much the same principle except using higher gain and 6 min avis

[JB80]

Those settings are fine. Did you use a Barlow? Is your scope f5? If so then a 4 or 5x barlow or 3x with extension tube will give you a larger image and more detail (if seeing is reasonable). For Jupiter you need to be shooting between f25-30 to get the best results.

It's good to know my settings are OK. But no I didn't use a barlow this time, the 150PL is f/8 and I do have a tal x3 I can use, I was going to step up to a x2 then a x3 I didn't know the higher ratio was better. Plus I think my focus wasn't perfect as I forgot to reset the focus after I did the webcam settings.

I want to give it another go asap but I just got a new scope and predictably the weather has turned for the week.

Also I ran one avi through castrator as I had lost tracking at that point and the end result after stacking was this pixelated effort.

Any clue as to what went wrong there.

[mindburner]

though I would have a go with the ETX90 and the philips 900 webcam

results below. Needed a bit more exposure compared to the 12 inch dob

etx90 jupiter1.tif

[mindburner]

[mindburner]

ETX90 with 2x barlow - not so great

[Space Cowboy]

It's good to know my settings are OK. But no I didn't use a barlow this time, the 150PL is f/8 and I do have a tal x3 I can use, I was going to step up to a x2 then a x3 I didn't know the higher ratio was better. Plus I think my focus wasn't perfect as I forgot to reset the focus after I did the webcam settings.

I want to give it another go asap but I just got a new scope and predictably the weather has turned for the week.

Also I ran one avi through castrator as I had lost tracking at that point and the end result after stacking was this pixelated effort.

Any clue as to what went wrong there.

3X tal is excellent! I've not come across the Castrator trouble you describe. I had more success using Craterlet than vxastrocapture for Jupiter.

[Space Cowboy]

though I would have a go with the ETX90 and the philips 900 webcam

results below. Needed a bit more exposure compared to the 12 inch dob

Aperture is king. That Dob is the way to go for sure

[DrRobin]

Hi Stuart,

Thanks for the advice. Looking at your pictures of the DFK and the SPC there isn't that much difference but I can see a little more detail in the DFK. You could argue that the DFK isn't worth the extra money, but then if I sum up all the cash I have spent on my scopes, eyepieces and cameras the extra couple of hundred quid for the DFK is easily justifiable.

Given the number of good clear nights when it isn't blowing a gale, I am not going out or have got back from a work trip I need to maximise my time that I can get and 200-300 quid then looks good value for money.

Next chance I get I am going to try the SPC v the Lifecam v my Atik to see the difference. The Atik will of course only delivery about a frame ever 3-4 seconds, but the quality should be much better than either of the webcams. I reckon the Lifecam is going to outperform the SPC, but it's just a guess and I am open to any result.

My imaging session on on Tuesday night produced 18GB of AVIs and processing them with different settings just takes ages. The image I processed came from a 2GB file, I have processed a 3GB file from about 20 mins earlier and is slightly better, but not really significantly different from the one printed here earlier.

[drewk1]

There is my first attempt with the modded SPC880.

Only a short capture as I had problems with the mount.

Captured with Sharpcap, Processed with Registax 5.1 and resized in PS CS4

[DrRobin]

Hi,

Good first effort, much better than mine. Hopefully Space Cowboy will be able to give you a few tips, he appears to be the expert. What size scope did you use and did you use a Barlow?

Stuart, I am not surprised that the DFK and SPC produce similar results, I believe they use the same chip, the only difference is better control on the DFK and the much faster frame rate using true USB 2.0.

I have decided to buy a DFK31 second hand, currently in final stages of negotiation, that will be interesting to compare against the Lifecam and SPC.

[drewk1]

Scope is a Celestron 114 EQ

No Barlow

I have a tal x3 but not yet used it.

Not my best attempt as I seemed to get better results with my quickcam.

I think I have to get more time in with the spc and sharpcap.

[DrRobin]

Hi,

I played with my SPC and 127 Mak in the daylight, focusing on a farmer fixing his tractor. Like you I use Sharpcap, the trick seems to be to get the brightness and Gamma right. Space Cowboy is the best source of advice on settings.

The best advice I can suggest other than correct settings, is get your mount tracking correctly and make sure your scope is balanced. The number of times I have lost Jupiter or Saturn because the mount wasn't tracking correctly and spent most of my imaging time fiddling with the mount rather than the camera, I have lost count.

My Mak was very sensitive to focus, not sure what your Celestron is like, I had to get a motor focus in the end, otherwise Juptier was lost out of the FoV every time I went near the focus control. Once you have got the mount tracking your Tal should work pretty well, they are supposed to be good quality and many reckon they are as good as Televues.

My 10" dob has a 10:1 focus which is much better and more stable. BTW Space Cowboy, I find an article on another site with a design for a USB focus control with manual control as well. It's built using a stepper motor for about £40. I now have all of the parts (sourced fro China via eBay) and will start the build next week.

[Space Cowboy]

There is my first attempt with the modded SPC880.

Only a short capture as I had problems with the mount.

Captured with Sharpcap, Processed with Registax 5.1 and resized in PS CS4

Good effort considering the size of your scope. I would go easy on the wavelet processing, too much and the image takes on a crayon look. As Robin says you need to have a steady mount to maximize your scopes potential. As long as you can keep Jupiter on screen for 3-4 mins then you are in the ball park.

That auto focusser sounds very interesting Robin. I have considered an auto setup but seem to be managing ok with my humble fingers for now lol. My DFK is the new version with the more sensitive 618 chip, as you say the old DBK/DFK has same chip as spc.

Interesting choice the DFK 31....not sure how they are for planetary imaging, very good for lunar I believe.

[DrRobin]

Hi,

The auto focus is called Sharpsky (SharpSky) and looks really good. It is now fully integrated in to Sharpcap, but I especially like the little manual control, which I think will be great for planets with a big Barlow.

I am guessing the DFK31 is going to be a much better version of the Lifecam (CCD rather than CMOS and faster, with long exposure options) whereas you DFK is a better version of the SPC for some of the same reasons. I now note from your signature that your DFK is the newer model.

Anyway, the 31 came along and I decided to give it a try.

Looks likes it is going to be a really clear night here tonight, trouble is i am decorating and have to put the bedroom back together before night, so I might not get chance to look at anything.

[Kevdan]

Ok So heres probably one of my better pics of jupiter, and its not good,

kit = skywatcher 150p eq3-2 with 2x barlow, no filters, spc 880 modded

1200 frames of 5 per second.

so F5 focal ratio and roughly 250x magnification if im correct in saying that the spc880 is about a 6mm eyepiece and then a 2x barlow.

please please advise,

Kev.

[Space Cowboy]

That auto focuser looks very cool Robin. Looks like the one I saw on youtube a while ago. For sure the DFK 31 will out perform a lifecam. Will be interesting to see a comparison of your various cams and how they perform.

That's a nice little Jupiter image Kevin. You need to adjust white balance during capture.You can try auto RGB balance on the wavelet page of Registax to reduce the redness. What capture software did you use?

[mindburner]

Aperture is king. That Dob is the way to go for sure

for sure. I must say this thread has got me onto imaging. Just bough a video camera and looking at a 190 astrograph. Depends if I can sell some stuff first though.

Maybe have an embarrasing shot at mars too

[Rapallokid]

Hi,

there is a huge amount of information within this thred and i will work my way through the various posts and see if i can piece together enough to get me started. I took some images ( towards the beginner end of the scale) last week and have a lot of work to do. I was using sharpcap and took still images, ok but when i tried using the start capture all i recorded was a bright green screen, split in two with a mirrored image?

Any suggestions welcome, and thanks for a great thred.

Rapallokid.

[Rapallokid]

Sorry i forgot to attach a copy of my first attempt at imaging.

Rapallokid

[DrRobin]

Hi Kev,

Did you use an IR filter on your SPC880? That and a dusting the colour balance in Registax should help tone down the red and give a little more detail.

Your picture is much better than my first few attempts at Jupiter, it's only just recently that I have managed to get a decent picture.

Stuart, the auto focus was on you tube so it might well be the same one. I just need to find a little bit of time at work to build it and then test.

Rapallokid, your green screen sounds very strange. I have noticed that the gain/exposure often needs slight adjustment as it looks over exposed. I might suggest un-installing and re-install Sharpcap.