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long distance network

Robfal

By Robfal
in DIY Astronomer

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Robfal

Robfal

Posted
Posted

I've started to plan an observatory at the bottom of the garden. Not really planned much yet however I am getting a mini-digger next week to do some landscaping around the garden so this would be the time to get any cables to the right places. The Obsey will be approx 70m from the house

I shall run power to the obsey site however what are peoples views on networking?

Because of the distance cost does become a factor however these are the options

  • Don't bother
  • Run normal CAT5 cable (I already have this) in a trench alongside the power. I guess this should be in a conduit however that alone would add another £80 on the cost
  • Run outdoor CAT5 cable; not sure what this is but I guess it won't be cheap
  • Use homeplugs (ie network over the mains). I've used this successfully in the house however not sure whether it would work over the distance
  • Stick to wireless; possibly putting in a wireless booster

None of these options are likely to be cheap however which do you think would be the best and most cost effective?

Cheers

Rob

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Beyond_Vision

Beyond_Vision

Posted
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I would use ordinary cat5 in plastic conduit this will give you guaranteed comms with no worries about signal strength of a wireless or mains based network. I put in a mains connection to my pier and ran cat5 and also a spare multistrand cable for future use and a low voltage twin wire cable feed (for 12V). It's better to put more than you need in as once it's buried it more hassle to add stuff later.

Regards

Kevin

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Robfal

Robfal

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Thanks for the advice. I just found a relatively cheap source of flexible conduit (£40 for 100m) , not technically rated for underground use but should probably do. My next question is

What type of CAT5e cable should I be using? Does it matter whether it is shielded or not?

Rob

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SpookyKatt

SpookyKatt

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Hmmmn well I'm not sure of your configuration but even if your running the cat 5e next to an average power line I can't imagine you'd get enough EM interference to make it worth using shielded cable.

Maybe someone who has done this before can offer more advice.

Kathleen

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Robfal

Robfal

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I currently use homeplugs (network over power) in the house very effectively however I am a little worried whether they would work over the distance and across a fuse box (RCD).

I've decided to run a buried outdoor CAT5 cable (£40 for 100m). I'm supposed to put it in a duct however that doubles the cost. This still leaves me with the option Homeplugs or wireless.

Rob

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callump

callump

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You could also bury the cable in a garden hose - doesn't give protection against a spade, but will stop water.

Networking guy at work suggested keeping the mains some distance from the network cable - a few inches at least.

If you want to use wireless, you can add a directional arial to some access points. You can make a small yagi easily, that will extend the range.

/callump

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profees

profees

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Cat 5 is good but i would only run this in a trench if ITS DRY, cold wether can also cause potential issues.

Personally i would use a wireless N router the range is great - dont forget that you may also need a usb dongle for the Computer. Network Plugs will sometimes have issue with certain (POWER PROTECTION) extention leads etc.. as the frequencys will interfere.

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arad85

arad85

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Personally, for a run that long, I'd go cat6 (5e should do, but you never know with that length of run). As soon as you start moving large amounts of data around, gigabit ethernet is the business (I can get 20+Mbytes/sec to/from my remote machines disks)

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PhillyDee

PhillyDee

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Hate to say this, but that transfer rate is pretty poor . . . . With dedicated Intel PRO1000 cards you should be maxing out the disk transfer rate really (Minus overheads of course!) On a 20m Cat5e I get around 60-75mb/s to my Home Server.

Anyway,

Personally, I would go for a twin pair of cables under the ground.

It will probably cost less than Wireless-N for a start!

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SpookyKatt

SpookyKatt

Posted
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and if you have room in the conduit, put in a run of thin rope so that you can pull a cable through at a later date should you need to. :)

Great point Ringz, imagine deciding to try and stick another cable down once the pipe's been laid, you just know it would go halfway before getting snagged.

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arad85

arad85

Posted
Posted
So,

Let me get this straight. I should run a Cat 5 cable, a Cat6 cable a Homeplug system and a Wireless N

Glad to see there is a consensus of opinion!!!!!!

:):icon_confused::D:)

Rob

No, no... You don't need to run the wireless N cable - you have the cat5e and cat6 to take care of it :p
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arad85

arad85

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Ouch . . . . :)
Its' OK.. the ones on my main system are RID 0 300Mbits/sec and I can get ridiculously high write rates as they have 32M cache each :D (think I peak at >100Mbytes/sec for an avi...)
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Semlohnhoj

Semlohnhoj

Posted
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Oh well, everyone else has had their 10 pence worth so I may as well :)

The most obvious guide here is the distance (70M !) so:

1. Wireless G (54Mb) Don't bother at that range unless you're willing to invest in a high gain aerials (commercial or something like a Cantenna). Also from a future proofing point of view, 54Mb isn't a good bet.

2. Wirless N (upto 300Mb, yeah right!) Much better range but currently considerably more expensive and you're not going to get the 300Mb at that distance anyway. Also, same issue with the Aerials.

3. Wireless in general (although I'm sure people can give very good reasons why I'm wrong) isn't all it's cracked up to be. If you're in a built up area you are going to get some congestion as there are limited channels available (theroetically 11 however these overlap so realistically you have 3). At 70M you are much more likely to suffer from this issue. The congestion is only going to get worse in the future. Congestion will also reduce your bandwidth. Incidentally, the 54Mb and 300Mb are 'Half Duplex' figures (i.e. total bandwidth in both directions) whereas the 100Mb of standard ethernet is 'Full Duplex' (as in 100Mb in each direction). Security is also an issue, WEP encryption has been cracked, WPA is now also been superceeded by WPA2 for similar reasons (you see where I'm going).

Sorry, I'm rambling...

4. Homeplugs are great but are limited to (I believe) 85Mb or less dependant on distance and interferance.

5. Unscreened Ethernet (Cat5) - This is rated at 100Mb at 100M so you should be fine at 70M.

6. Unscreened Ethernet (Cat5e or Cat6) - This is rated to 1000Mb at 100M so you get a good bit of future proofing. Cat6 is a higher spec. cable than Cat5e but not much of a difference.

7. Shielded Ethernet (Cat5, Cat5e or Cat6) Don't bother, these are for noisy environments such as factories with issues of EM interferance. I assume this doesn't affect you!

My personal opinion is go for Option 6. It's probably the cheapest, will give you the best bandwidth and is future proofing you (especially if you go for the Cat6).

One other point, 70M is a long way for the mains cable. I assume you have this rated for the distance and also the forseeable loads. Also If the cable is armoured (as it should be) then this will reduce any EM interference to the network cable anyway.

Good luck..

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Robfal

Robfal

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I'm glad someone agrees with me.

I've gone for outdoor unshielded Cat5e cable. I've also put a normal indoor cable in at the same time, as I happened to have some. Then I will potentially have a backup should the outdoor cable have a problem. As to the mains it is armoured and rated for the distance/load.

The first bit is now laid (I'm currently doing the walled garden) with the rest to be put in later this week. The Cat cable and the mains will be separated by a couple of inches of sand so that should help with any interference.

Lets hope it works otherwise it will be homeplugs

Rob

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Semlohnhoj

Semlohnhoj

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Would love to see some pictures of the building work / setup Rob.

I'm rather limited for space in my garden and my partner being a keen gardener wouldn't be best pleased about an observatory!

I'll have to settle for a pier in the garden for now.

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