Does Imaging Have To Be Expensive?

[Carbon Brush]

A random muttering from me.
I have dabbled in imaging but never got further than tearing out hair in frustration and emptying my bank account.
No seriously I remember a long time back (2006ish?) struggling to find a digital camera with a sensitive sensor that I could afford.
Even now we see cameras, filters, computer control mounts, etc all very easily going into decent used car or kitchen refit money.
But we don't have spend big to get enjoyable pictures.

Right now in the classified there is a Skywatcher driven mount and a modded Canon DSLR.
I'm sure if look further there will be a Canon lens and a tripod.
I reckon for about £500 that would make a good widefield imaging rig, producing immediate results.
When I say immediate, I mean if the sky ever clears. But you get the idea.
Most of us have a computer in the house for the post processing part - so that is in effect free.

Similar money to the Dwarf & Seestar offerings, but with the option of using different camera lenses for differing FOV.

Imaging is affordable!

 

[Mandy D]

@Carbon Brush I totally agree that imaging can be done on a shoestring. I started my journey with a Nikon D3200 and Tamron 70-300 mm lens on a budget tripod that today could all be had for less than £200. I photographed a total eclipse of the Moon with this in France and was hooked. So, I bought a Skywatcher 250PX and got my first deep sky image, M42, without tracking. Today, small tracking mounts for DSLRs are so cheap and easy to use. There is some great software available at zero cost for processing the images, PIPP, Autostakkert and GIMP are often all you need.

Yes, it can be bottomless pit to throw money into, but it doesn't have to be. I've spent a fair bit of money on my kit, now, but don't regret it. I know that I can sell it when the point arrives that I have to give up, so it doesn't worry me.

I've often wondered why more use is not made of some of the great longer focal length lenses in this hobby when I look at the price of small refractors. My Nikon f/4 300 mm prime lens was not cheap, but it is extremely sharp and works very well for astro-imaging, coupled with a x2 teleconverter I can get decent sized images of the Moon, especially with a crop-sensor camera like the D3200 and I can still use it easily in daytime for nature photography. Another plus with camera lenses is the almost complete absence of chromatic aberration. That 300 mm f/4 is as free from it as any lens or refracting telescope I have ever seen.

[Elp]

If you've done it, you already know. I'm astounded by the quality of the Asahi Takumar lenses, over fifty years old but still work well for this sort of thing as long as you temper your expectations and can post process well.

The Samyang 135mm F2 is also one of the best optical pieces of equipment for astro, besting scopes many times it's price.

All you really need to start is a tripod and basic camera and will be able to capture the likes of M42 and M31 easily without tracking. If you do need tracking an Omegon LX, EQ wedge is a low point of entry.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Elp

[Clarkey]

I think imaging can be done relatively cheaply these days, especially with the lightweight trackers that are now available. It all depends on what you want to achieve. I have spent a fortune (for me) on my imaging kit - but that is largely by choice. I am now in a position where I have too many options and it is difficult to decide what to use!

However, a small telescope or long FL lens with a star tracker and give excellent results.

[vlaiv]

1 hour ago, Carbon Brush said:

I reckon for about £500 that would make a good widefield imaging rig, producing immediate results.

I think that this depends on how "out of the box" you want to think and how much are you willing to pay in other ways (your time / effort rather than money).

500 pounds for working rig is tall order if one is starting from scratch, but here is what I'd do.

Get second hand Eq3 / Eq5 type mount (later is obviously better) - manual of course - no motors

Get second hand old DSLR for cheap.

DIY stepper motor to drive RA axis of the mount at wanted rate (some micro controller programming required as well as soldering and fashioning some sort of bracket for the motor).

Get OTA like this:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/evostar/sky-watcher-evostar-90-660-az-pronto.html

(maybe even get it new and then sell all the bits except the OTA itself).

Get Wratten #8 yellow filter

and you are ready to go imaging ....

[carastro]

Depends on what sort of results you want really.  

I started out with a second hand CG5 GT mount and WO scope at £700 for both.  Plus a second hand DSLR around £320 l think it was plus an ST80 guide scope. Total £1100. 
 

More basic mounts don’t really guide that well and can’t do long enough exposures to get decent results.
 
The above kit served  me well for the first couple of years  

l can certainly recommend the Samyang 135mm camera lens.  
 

Carole

Edited August 5, 2023 by carastro

[tomato]

I'm think I have this correct but @ollypenrice's favourite Deep Sky image taken to date (so that is really saying something) was with a SamYang 135mm lens, and not a big Tak telescope or a Planewave 17" ODK.

Ok, to be fair, it was took with a high end camera from a great site and by folks who really know what they are doing, but the point I'm trying to make is you definitely do not have to start off purchasing loads of high end expensive kit. There are a couple of folks on SGL since I have been a member who have done just that and sadly got very frustrated very quickly with trying to achieve spectacular results straight away and their entire setups have ended up in the classifieds section.

Back in the pre-digital era when I would venture AP was somewhat harder, I went the "buy all the kit straight away" route and suffered endless frustrations. For a long time my best results were captured with a 50mm lens.

[ONIKKINEN]

Certain types of imaging can be cheap, or at the very least not too expensive. Planetary and lunar for example, tracking is optional and if you have that then it doesn't have to be amazing like for DSO imaging - just good enough to keep the target in the chip. Planetary cameras are very affordable too, as opposed to larger sensors.

Widefield with something like the samyang 135 can be "cheap" too, but the lens itself actually costs a fair bit of money. Cheap trackers probably ok with a lens so wide, but even with the price of just the lens, a cheap tracker and a second hand DSLR we are crossing the 1000 mark in cost easily. So is that cheap? Astrophotography has twisted my view of money so i would still call that cheap, others may disagree.

Now a type of imaging that i think cant really be done cheaply would be distant DSO imaging, so not the Orion nebulas and cygnus loop type targets, but the galaxies that are measured in arcminutes instead of degrees, the galaxy clusters with dozens of small galaxies and so on. I really dont see that type of imaging done affordably at the moment because you need a large aperture, which means a heavy scope that needs a sturdy mount, and then ideally you need a sensitive modern cooled camera to make the best out of the handful of photons that actually are from the target object. So this type of imaging even in a budget sense will be several thousand £/€/$ easily.

[vlaiv]

While we are on the subject - for example Samyang 135mm lens - can someone quote sub 500 list of gear that is needed to capture image with said lens?

I think that, since we are discussing the subject - we might as well give some sort of recommendation as option for people to follow.

[Ratlet]

I wouldn't recommend getting the samyang if you were going for sub £500.  If you were looking for sub £500 the ashai super takumar is the place to go at 135mm and 200mm.  That's £15-£40 depending on ebay for them.  You're not going to be winning apod, but it'll punt out images that will bring a big ol' smile to your face.

[Tomatobro]

A member of my Astro club had an old film camera and a bag of lenses. They looked to be in good condition and I offered to adapt the lenses to a ZWO camera provided it was ok for me to take the camera mounting off the old camera to make up an adapter. It was not too difficult to do and the imaging results were very good. At least I saved the contents of the camera bag going to the skip and helped a budding astro photographer.

I have some pictures somewhere and if I find them will attach to this post.

 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Tomatobro

[Elp]

1 hour ago, vlaiv said:

While we are on the subject - for example Samyang 135mm lens - can someone quote sub 500 list of gear that is needed to capture image with said lens?

Likely it won't fall within budget but not too much more, and the SY is a keeper piece of equipment not one you're likely to sell on, both my Samyangs were around 250, if you're patient they do crop up, both of mine are also the video version so they're cheaper as most people always go for the photo version not knowing they're practically identical, other than infinity stop can't be adjusted like the photo version. Takumars are available much cheaper.

Other items needed:

B. Astro modded dslr or if you don't want the above and the dslr use a compact digital camera which allows long exposure but bear in mind the edges will likely suffer from distortion and CA,

C. DIY barn door tracker or Omegon LX tracker,

D. EQ wedge, make one or the general cheapest one I'd recommend is the ioptron one,

E. A provision for hardware, you'll need a ball head to mount the camera onto, a wedge and bolt to attach the EQ wedge to the LX.

F. Tripod to mount the EQ wedge onto.

G. Memory card for camera.

H. Intervalometer if the camera doesn't have one built in.

Or just use a compact camera on a tripod like how I did when I started, no tracking, just wide angle milky way images, likely this equipment is already at hand. Works well for meteor shower imaging too. If you want to simplify further use a Google Pixel with astro mode on a tripod, 4 minute photos taken with next to no effort.

Another option, a Dwarf2 or Seestar.

Another option, buy no equipment and rent time with exceptionally excellent equipment managed by professionals.

It's easier than ever to get an image nowadays, doing it well however will plunge you into a forever deepening sinkhole.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Elp

[tomato]

A used SY135 f2 sony mount and Sony Alpha A700 DSLR camera body can be had for £333, that leaves £167 for the mount.🥴

Looks like a cheaper lens would be needed, or just buy a Seestar and see if Astro imaging is your thing. That would easily sell on if you decide that it is not for you.