WL Filters

[LDW1]

Has anyone did a comparison between a Thousand Oaks Solar Film filter (not glass) vs the Baader Solar Film filter ? I use an Altair Astro 2" wedge for my larger refractors but I want to get a small filter for my newly arrived 1.25" refractor. Cost is not a reason, only performance ! I have always used the Baader film but I would like a color, other than filters, change unless there is some important reason in performance not to.

[Elp]

The Seymour Solar provides a yellowish colour to the view but the baader is very slightly sharper.

[Franklin]

On 07/11/2022 at 17:49, LDW1 said:

I want to get a small filter for my newly arrived 1.25" refractor.

Just seen this. If it's for your new A62SS, I used a Seymour Solar with mine when I had it and it worked really well, nice yellow disk. I read posts not recommending the use of the little Vixen for WL solar because of the Petzval-like design. Apparently the rear element can heat up and cause damage. Mine worked fine but I did limit it to short sessions just to be on the safe side.

 

Edited December 31, 2022 by Franklin

[PeterW]

If you want quality of view then get a 1.25” wedge. I compared my wedge to several people with different white light filters and it provided a much more detailed view.

 

Peter

[LDW1]

50 minutes ago, Franklin said:

Just seen this. If it's for your new A62SS, I used a Seymour Solar with mine when I had it and it worked really well, nice yellow disk. I read posts not recommending the use of the little Vixen for WL solar because of the Petzval-like design. Apparently the rear element can heat up and cause damage. Mine worked fine but I did limit it to short sessions just to be on the safe side.

 

I WL with my NP101 all the time, its a Petzval as well, never had any issue using the filters.

[Steve Ward]

Thousand Oaks and Seymour polymer films are fit for little other than eclipse glasses , poor quality when detail is sought.

Baader film is marginally trumed by wedges but the difference is not as great as the price differential would suggest.

Edited December 31, 2022 by Steve Ward

[LDW1]

28 minutes ago, PeterW said:

If you want quality of view then get a 1.25” wedge. I compared my wedge to several people with different white light filters and it provided a much more detailed view.

 

Peter

I have a 2" Altair Astro wedge but the Vixen A62SS is only 1.25" and I don't want to spend $400 C on just that one scope, the Baader filter is a lot cheaper.

[Steve Ward]

14 minutes ago, LDW1 said:

I have a 2" Altair Astro wedge but the Vixen A62SS is only 1.25" and I don't want to spend $400 C on just that one scope, the Baader filter is a lot cheaper.

Why bother with the 62mm scope at all if you have larger refractors to play with ?

Stick with a 100mm-120mm unless you have better than average seeing generally when you can push it to 150mm , dropping to 62mm will negate any improvement a wedge might offer by virtue of the smaller aperture.

[Stu]

2 hours ago, Franklin said:

Just seen this. If it's for your new A62SS, I used a Seymour Solar with mine when I had it and it worked really well, nice yellow disk. I read posts not recommending the use of the little Vixen for WL solar because of the Petzval-like design. Apparently the rear element can heat up and cause damage. Mine worked fine but I did limit it to short sessions just to be on the safe side.

 

Shouldn’t be any issues at all with a full frontal filter, I can’t see any need to limit time on the Sun with this setup as the front filter protects the rear lens elements from overheating.

Apparently the advice to avoid wedges with Petzval designs is incorrect. @Merlin66 has info from a number of manufacturers saying that they are ok to use, perhaps Ken you could comment here to confirm?

I’ve found meaningful improvements in performance stepping between Astrosolar film and a Wedge, and between a 1.25” Lunt Wedge and a Baader CoolWedge. The differences really show up when using a well corrected scope ie a decent long focal length achro or an apo, and mainly at higher powers in good seeing when the finer details become visible.

Aperture definitely counts. Stepping between 60mm to 76mm then 100mm, as an example I find that the visibility of granulation increases from being ‘tricky’, through to ‘there but takes work’, and finally ‘in your face’ in the 100mm. I echo Steve’s comment about using larger scopes if available, unless portability is the prime factor affecting the decision.

[LDW1]

1 hour ago, Steve Ward said:

Why bother with the 62mm scope at all if you have larger refractors to play with ?

Stick with a 100mm-120mm unless you have better than average seeing generally when you can push it to 150mm , dropping to 62mm will negate any improvement a wedge might offer by virtue of the smaller aperture.

As you say 'to play with', its part of my enjoyment in this great hobby, its a great change of pace using that small scope. I don't find the solar views with my 127mm refractor as good as with my 90mm and now I want to try my newly gotten 62mm.

[LDW1]

6 minutes ago, Stu said:

Shouldn’t be any issues at all with a full frontal filter, I can’t see any need to limit time on the Sun with this setup as the front filter protects the rear lens elements from overheating.

Apparently the advice to avoid wedges with Petzval designs is incorrect. @Merlin66 has info from a number of manufacturers saying that they are ok to use, perhaps Ken you could comment here to confirm?

I’ve found meaningful improvements in performance stepping between Astrosolar film and a Wedge, and between a 1.25” Lunt Wedge and a Baader CoolWedge. The differences really show up when using a well corrected scope ie a decent long focal length achro or an apo, and mainly at higher powers in good seeing when the finer details become visible.

Aperture definitely counts. Stepping between 60mm to 76mm then 100mm, as an example I find that the visibility of granulation increases from being ‘tricky’, through to ‘there but takes work’, and finally ‘in your face’ in the 100mm. I echo Steve’s comment about using larger scopes if available, unless portability is the prime factor affecting the decision.

I bump up the granulation sometimes, depending on conditions, using various filters.

[Franklin]

4 minutes ago, Stu said:

Shouldn’t be any issues at all with a full frontal filter, I can’t see any need to limit time on the Sun with this setup as the front filter protects the rear lens elements from overheating.

Apparently the advice to avoid wedges with Petzval designs is incorrect. @Merlin66 has info from a number of manufacturers saying that they are ok to use,

That makes total sense, I'm getting mixed up, sorry and I do remember reading an article where Mr Nagler himself was asked about wedges in the TV scopes and he said it was fine.

[Stu]

50 minutes ago, LDW1 said:

I bump up the granulation sometimes, depending on conditions, using various filters.

The Baader Continuum filter is about the best there is for boosting granulation and faculae, but aperture, scope quality and a wedge all make a contribution.

[LDW1]

I started this thread to hear thoughts between the Baader Solar Filter and the Thousand Oaks Polymer Filter ie WL vs Orange Light if you will, because when I got my Vixen 62mm the only one available was the TO filter, everyone was sold out of that small size Baader. But unfortunately I haven't gotten much comparison. As to wedges I have a good handle on them.

[Peter Drew]

Baader film for me, you can use an orange filter if you want a coloured Sun.     🙂

[Stu]

19 minutes ago, LDW1 said:

I started this thread to hear thoughts between the Baader Solar Filter and the Thousand Oaks Polymer Filter ie WL vs Orange Light if you will, because when I got my Vixen 62mm the only one available was the TO filter, everyone was sold out of that small size Baader. But unfortunately I haven't gotten much comparison. As to wedges I have a good handle on them.

Apologies for not answering your question.

I’ve only used the Baader AstroSolar film and found it to be very good. Personally I prefer the white light view, rather than a somewhat artificial orange. I suspect the performance of a Continuum filter would be better with a white light filter rather than orange. I don’t have any data to back that up but assume that putting a full spectrum through the filter results in a brighter image.

[Highburymark]

15 hours ago, LDW1 said:

As you say 'to play with', its part of my enjoyment in this great hobby, its a great change of pace using that small scope. I don't find the solar views with my 127mm refractor as good as with my 90mm and now I want to try my newly gotten 62mm.

I am yet to be convinced that my 120mm refractor is better for white light than the 100mm frac it replaced. I think 90-100mm is the sweet spot for average seeing, though I will try and disprove this theory as often as possible in 2023.   

To answer your question, Baader film for me too, though I can’t claim to have used any other brand. I found it pretty sharp before I bought a wedge.