Renamed - StellaLyra vs Ursa Major Dobsonian

[Paul_Sussex]

So, as the finance manager has okayed the expenditure, I am about to order my first telescope - a 6" Dobsonian*. (The laughter in the background is everybody who suggested this in the first place🤣) FLO currently have the Skywatcher and Ursa Major available for roughly the same price. I'm leaning towards the Ursa Major, which appears to have a GSO mirror cell or clone, for the Crayford focuser; however, I came across this - Fixing the wretched GSO 6" mirror cell - Reflectors - Cloudy Nights - criticising the collimation adjustment. Is this an actual problem or more something to be aware of?

*TL/DR - I was originally (before joining the Lounge) after a Dob, but was put off by a local "expert" who in hindsight was perhaps just after a quick sale.

[johninderby]

You. might also want to consider the Bresser 6” dob. A bit more upmarket than the SW or Ursa Major but of course a bit more expensive bit does include a solar filter.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/bresser-telescopes/bresser-messier-6-inch-planetary-dobsonian.html

Edited April 14, 2022 by johninderby

[doublevodka]

Good to see you've come to a decision 👍 The bresser has a very well thought of mount so certainly worth consideration. Realistically any one of the 3 is better than no scope at all

Again though I'd say check the second hand market, for the price of one of the three new, you may be able to get something with a slightly bigger mirror used? (I too have a finance manager, so stretch the pennies as far as I can  )

An 8 inch for example has nearly twice the light gathering capacity of a 6 inch, although there's a nice looking 10 inch truss dob on astro buy and sell.... 🤣

[AstroMuni]

1 minute ago, doublevodka said:

An 8 inch for example has nearly twice the light gathering capacity of a 6 inch, although there's a nice looking 10 inch truss dob on astro buy and sell....

Bear in mind the weight of these as well 🙂 Lugging them outside can get tricky esp if you have a dodgy back.

[Paul_Sussex]

I thought I'd stick with something I can manage easily. And with a light sack barrow, I can run this up the road to an open space with a better horizon than my garden.

[cajen2]

I don't suppose the financial controller could be cajoled into okaying a few more quid? That would enable you to get a StellaLyra 8". As above, it has much more light-gathering power than a 6" (I have both sizes of dob), but just as importantly, it's much better equipped. It has a two-speed Crayford focuser ( you don't appreciate a fine-focus capability till you have one!), both alt and az are butter smooth, it has a RACI finder, adjustable balance points and a cooling fan. All these would more than justify the difference in price.

Edited April 14, 2022 by cajen2

[cajen2]

Oh, and you'd find something like this much more stable than a sack trolley:

https://www.diy.com/departments/platform-trolley-150kg-capacity/1357682_BQ.prd

[Paul_Sussex]

30 minutes ago, cajen2 said:

I don't suppose the financial controller could be cajoled into okaying a few more quid? That would enable you to get a StellaLyra 8". As above, it has much more light-gathering power than a 6" (I have both sizes of dob), but just as importantly, it's much better equipped. It has a two-speed Crayford focuser ( you don't appreciate a fine-focus capability till you have one!), both alt and az are butter smooth, it has a RACI finder, adjustable balance points and a cooling fan. All these would more than justify the difference in price.

I'm not going down that rabbit hole...I'd end up just chasing my tail again! 🙂

I think I'll go for the Ursa Major. FLO seem pretty positive about them - 

- and I can't imagine they would put their name behind anything with an obvious flaw. 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, cajen2 said:

I don't suppose the financial controller could be cajoled into okaying a few more quid? That would enable you to get a StellaLyra 8". As above, it has much more light-gathering power than a 6" (I have both sizes of dob), but just as importantly, it's much better equipped. It has a two-speed Crayford focuser ( you don't appreciate a fine-focus capability till you have one!), both alt and az are butter smooth, it has a RACI finder, adjustable balance points and a cooling fan. All these would more than justify the difference in price.

This.....what he said.

[Guest]

You are going to want to upgrade the collimation screws on the secondary  and the springs on the adjustment for the primary.  Bob's Knobs will be able to help you out with that 

[Paul_Sussex]

Well...that's my pocket money spent! Just have to wait for delivery... 🙂

[Dr Strange]

Congratulations on your purchase! By the way this hobby will seem expensive BUT compared to other hobbies it is actually quite cheap. As I explain to She Who Must Be Obeyed it is rather cheap and best of all it keeps me out of the pubs so it is money well spent.

I have a few recommendations to make your experience much better. First and foremost a comfortable adjustable chair is critical! It isn't for your rear end it is for your eyes. If you are comfortably seated you will see more. Second, do yourself and your neck a favor and replace the findersope that comes with it. Get a right angle corrected image finder (RACI). It makes life much easier when star hopping! Add a Telrad to the scope. This will also make star hopping much easier! Get yourself a red colored lamp. For me I use an adjustable music stand with lip, a flexible LED light that I covered with red colored tape. That way my star atlas and other things are lit but I am not injuring my night vision. And lastly get a good star atlas. This will be your road map to the sky. Interstellarum Deep Sky Atlas is the gold standard for this but is a bit pricy. It will be a buy once cry once purchase though. Another nice option is the Night Sky Observer's Guide. It is 3 volumes. It breaks things out by season. You will want 1,2 and 4. 

Lastly a method you find things is to take your smartphone, load something like Sky Safari or Luminos on it, put the phone so the back faces the sky, select target an object so it gives you directions on how to get to the object and move the scope in conjunction with the phone so you can get in the ball park of the object you want to see.

Links for what I mentioned above:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/astronomy-observing-chairs/berlebach-charon-observers-chair.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/stellalyra-8x50-right-angled-correct-image-raci-finder-scope-with-bracket.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/telrad-finder-astronomy.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/interstellarum-deep-sky-atlas-desk-edition.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/the-night-sky-observers-guide-volumes-1-2-3-and-4-book.html

 

Edited April 14, 2022 by Dr Strange

[Paul_Sussex]

On 14/04/2022 at 18:57, Dr Strange said:

Congratulations on your purchase! By the way this hobby will seem expensive BUT compared to other hobbies it is actually quite cheap. As I explain to She Who Must Be Obeyed it is rather cheap and best of all it keeps me out of the pubs so it is money well spent.

My other hobbies involve spending somewhat more money.! In comparison, this is looking quite...reasonable! Not sure about the pubs tho...

Edited April 16, 2022 by Paul_Sussex

[Roy Challen]

1 hour ago, Dr Strange said:

Congratulations on your purchase! By the way this hobby will seem expensive BUT compared to other hobbies it is actually quite cheap. As I explain to She Who Must Be Obeyed it is rather cheap and best of all it keeps me out of the pubs so it is money well spent.

I have a few recommendations to make your experience much better. First and foremost a comfortable adjustable chair is critical! It isn't for your rear end it is for your eyes. If you are comfortably seated you will see more. Second, do yourself and your neck a favor and replace the findersope that comes with it. Get a right angle corrected image finder (RACI). It makes life much easier when star hopping! Add a Telrad to the scope. This will also make star hopping much easier! Get yourself a red colored lamp. For me I use an adjustable music stand with lip, a flexible LED light that I covered with red colored tape. That way my star atlas and other things are lit but I am not injuring my night vision. And lastly get a good star atlas. This will be your road map to the sky. Interstellarum Deep Sky Atlas is the gold standard for this but is a bit pricy. It will be a buy once cry once purchase though. Another nice option is the Night Sky Observer's Guide. It is 3 volumes. It breaks things out by season. You will want 1,2 and 4. 

Lastly a method you find things is to take your smartphone, load something like Sky Safari or Luminos on it, put the phone so the back faces the sky, select target an object so it gives you directions on how to get to the object and move the scope in conjunction with the phone so you can get in the ball park of the object you want to see.

Links for what I mentioned above:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/astronomy-observing-chairs/berlebach-charon-observers-chair.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/stellalyra-8x50-right-angled-correct-image-raci-finder-scope-with-bracket.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/telrad-finder-astronomy.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/interstellarum-deep-sky-atlas-desk-edition.html

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/the-night-sky-observers-guide-volumes-1-2-3-and-4-book.html

 

I have a few recommendations to make your experience much better.

First and foremost a comfortable adjustable chair is critical! - Spend more money!

Second, do yourself and your neck a favor and replace the findersope that comes with it. Get a right angle corrected image finder (RACI).  - Spend more money!

Add a Telrad to the scope - Spend more money!

And lastly get a good star atlas - Spend more money!

 Interstellarum Deep Sky Atlas is the gold standard for this but is a bit pricy. It will be a buy once cry once purchase though - Spend more money!

Another nice option is the Night Sky Observer's Guide. It is 3 volumes. It breaks things out by season. You will want 1,2 and 4. - Umm......

 

I agree with the above! 

What hobby is cheap?

 

Doesn't mean you need to buy everything new...second hand is good.

Edited April 14, 2022 by Roy Challen

[doublevodka]

Congratulations 👍 

I was just reading this article and it brought me back to this thread, looks like you've made a good choice https://astronomy.com/magazine/glenn-chaple/2022/04/your-perfect-first-and-last-telescope

Now begins a lifetime of cursing clouds and pondering your next eyepiece / finder / insert astro equipment here 😂

Hope you get some clear skies when it arrives so you can get out and enjoy it 👍

 

[Paul_Sussex]

13 hours ago, doublevodka said:

Congratulations 👍 

I was just reading this article and it brought me back to this thread, looks like you've made a good choice https://astronomy.com/magazine/glenn-chaple/2022/04/your-perfect-first-and-last-telescope

Now begins a lifetime of cursing clouds and pondering your next eyepiece / finder / insert astro equipment here 😂

Hope you get some clear skies when it arrives so you can get out and enjoy it 👍

Apart from all the advice here, it was things like that article and Ed Ting's Youtube about 6" Dobsonians - that finally persuaded me!

 

[Paul_Sussex]

On a side note, one of the sites I may be using has (variable length) grass - a small green space just up the road. I've seen some people suggest a groundsheet/tarp to protect a Dobsonian mount, but I wondered whether a sacrificial ground board would work? Something cheap like MDF or OSB, cut slightly larger than the base with holes to take the feet. Could be painted or epoxied for additional protection. Has anyone done this before?

[Ricochet]

How variable is the grass length? Would taller feet on the base board suffice?

[johninderby]

Lots of suitable short table legs on Amazon. Range from a couple of inches to a foot or more. Just screw or bolt three pf them to the base.

Edited April 15, 2022 by johninderby

[Paul_Sussex]

Grass can be 6-8", depending on when the council have been round. Those table legs look like a good option!

[doublevodka]

5 hours ago, Paul_Sussex said:

Apart from all the advice here, it was things like that article and Ed Ting's Youtube about 6" Dobsonians - that finally persuaded me!

 

Can't really go far wrong listening to Ed Ting, love his videos although I would like a Takahashi now which I blame on him 😂

[Paul_Sussex]

On 14/04/2022 at 10:43, Mike Q said:

You are going to want to upgrade the collimation screws on the secondary  and the springs on the adjustment for the primary.  Bob's Knobs will be able to help you out with that 

@Mike Q Can you elaborate on that? I won't be doing anything immediately, but what should I be looking at?

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Paul_Sussex said:

@Mike Q Can you elaborate on that? I won't be doing anything immediately, but what should I be looking at?

The collimation screws on the secondary will be Philips or Allen head screws.  Replace those with thumbscrews and you can adjust them tools.  The springs on the primary adjustment or weak.  They provide some tension but the mirror will sag some.  I ordered all the replacement pieces from Bob's Knobs in Indiana.  I collimated it when I installed them and have not had to do it since.  Money well spent.  Here is the link to the website

http://bobsknobs.com/

 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Guest

[bosun21]

5 hours ago, Mike Q said:

The collimation screws on the secondary will be Philips or Allen head screws.  Replace those with thumbscrews and you can adjust them tools.  The springs on the primary adjustment or weak.  They provide some tension but the mirror will sag some.  I ordered all the replacement pieces from Bob's Knobs in Indiana.  I collimated it when I installed them and have not had to do it since.  Money well spent.  Here is the link to the website

http://bobsknobs.com/

 

 

My 8” Stella Lyra Dobsonian holds its collimation pretty well as is. I have already fitted the bobs knobs screws on my secondary mirror and they are holding collimation pretty well also. I am thinking that it would be a good idea to upgrade the springs on my primary mirror and was wondering how long it took them to arrive from America?

[Paul_Sussex]

FLO are listed as a UK supplier, but don't don't appear to stock the springs. RVO list them but whether they have them in stock...?