Returning to the hobby - full new setup advice please

[Simon M]

After about 12 years away (I think) from astronomy, I have a chance now to rebuild and get back into Astrophotography. I am building a garden office, that can have a permanent pier at the back of it with a south facing aspect - fairly clear for a edge of Sheffield Suburb.  

 

I would like guidance on your "ideal" setup - for remote viewing and astrophotography from the adjacent office. In the past I've had several setups -Skywatcher mounts, Vixen VC200L, a small 80ED refractor (Still have that from Williams on the Skywatcher mount) Celestron Nexstar 6.

 

Ive lost touch with what's out there now, what works without forever fath or big tracking issues, i'm totally out of touch with the state of CCD camera technology 

 

I have a really good budget, of around £8000, maybe £10,000 for mount, guide scope (or other method), Refractor and camera. Need full goto, GPS alignment etc for speed of setup. It needs to be a semi permanent setup - pier is permanent but will not stay on the pier. What would you spend your money on? 

 

many thanks.

[newbie alert]

What did you enjoy last time, deep sky, planetary,  solar  ?  

I take it the pier is fixed and you want a setup to be taken on and off when we finally get clear skies

Well you have a vast choice on a fantastic budget 

[vlaiv]

1. Mesu200 mount

2. RC type large aperture scope - like 12" RC

3. Full frame CMOS type camera

Although you have excellent budget - I would actually exceed it with my "dream" combination - which is the same as above - except 16" RC and mono full frame CMOS camera - ASI6200 + 2" Filters and filter wheel and OAG.

[Simon M]

On 26/10/2021 at 22:51, newbie alert said:

What did you enjoy last time, deep sky, planetary,  solar  ?  

I take it the pier is fixed and you want a setup to be taken on and off when we finally get clear skies

Well you have a vast choice on a fantastic budget 

Hi there - yes deep sky and fixed pier to pop the scope on when viewing is good

[Simon M]

On 26/10/2021 at 23:09, vlaiv said:

1. Mesu200 mount

2. RC type large aperture scope - like 12" RC

3. Full frame CMOS type camera

Although you have excellent budget - I would actually exceed it with my "dream" combination - which is the same as above - except 16" RC and mono full frame CMOS camera - ASI6200 + 2" Filters and filter wheel and OAG.

Thanks for advice.  That’s an amazing list. However, 25kg mount - my pier is fixed but not a permanent shelter over it 

br Simon 

[newbie alert]

6 hours ago, Simon M said:

Thanks for advice.  That’s an amazing list. However, 25kg mount - my pier is fixed but not a permanent shelter over it 

br Simon 

Plus a mesu is now around £6300

Add that to a 12 inch RC which a quick Google is £3700

Add that to a full frame cmos say a zwo 6200 which are £4000

So a great budget got obliterated!

[tomato]

@newbie alert, you beat me to it, £10k is a fantastic budget, but will easily get swallowed up if you go for high end kit. 
 

I would still recommend the Mesu 200, that will future proof you for where ever you go with imaging, but I would like it to have some decent weather protection. 
Could you have a roll off sentry box over your pier?

[vlaiv]

10 hours ago, Simon M said:

Thanks for advice.  That’s an amazing list. However, 25kg mount - my pier is fixed but not a permanent shelter over it 

br Simon 

Well, you did say dream setup

You can scale that down to fit your budget. I'm looking to replace my mount as well and so far my goal has been Mesu, but there seems to be new mount that is equally good in performance but lighter.

Take a look at E.Fric by Gemini Telescope Design. It is replacement for their G53f.

18Kg mount with 30Kg payload. Add to that 10-12" RC and ASI2600 camera - either mono or color, your choice. That is APS-C sized chip.

[pete_l]

On 26/10/2021 at 23:28, Simon M said:

What would you spend your money on? 

Well, what I would spend your money on would be:

EQ8 head (4k), PrimaLuce C120 pier (1k), 100mm photoline refractor (2k), ASI183 colour camera (1k) or ASI183 mono + filters (2.5k), and another 1k or thereabouts for a computer, off-axis guider+cam and other bits'n'bobs.

The cheaper version would swap the EQ8 for a CEM70 (3k), the C120 pier for a C82 (500) and stay with an OSC camera.

Edited October 29, 2021 by pete_l

[AbsolutelyN]

What a nice thought exercise. If I was just starting a new setup on that kind of budget I'd probably go with a high end mount and relatively cheap Newtonian. 

Mount:
CEM120/EQ8 + tripod or pier - £4-5k

Scope:
Quattro 8" or 10" Newtonian - £600/700 or 200/250pds for £400/500ish
Replace dovetail with a big losmandy one - £100
f4 Aplanatic Coma Corrector if quattro - £260 / standard if not (£150ish) 
ZWO AEF for autofocus - - £190
Upgrade focuser to Baader Steeltrack - £240 

Camera:
ZWO ASI 2600MC-PRO - £1.9k
L-eNhance (or similar) for narrowband - £160
Guidecam - £150
Evo Guidescope (or cheap 80mm refractor) - £100 to £200

Others:
Mini-PC to control it all from or ASIAir - £200?
Lots of cables + good power supply £?
Dewheater for guidescope
Dewcontroller
Pixinsight - £?

Scope covers + some kind of heater to put under cover like a pet blanket.
I'm assuming at least semi-permanent setup.

 

Edited November 5, 2021 by AbsolutelyN

[Simon M]

Lots of great ideas chaps - thanks.  It’s sounds a bit obscene !  But I don’t want to end up with lots of purchases that fail then resale wasting time this time round.  Jump straight in with a setup that works for me right away 

 

cheers 

[kirkster501]

Simon, are you in the UK?    My 2 penneth with the weather being what it is in the UK - hopeless for astrophotography.  I am afraid in the UK this has to be taken into consideration since the weather is so poorly orientated to astronomy.  It is a great pity but that isn't going to change and if anything is going to get even worse with global warming.

If I were to get into this again with the benefit of 20 years of hindsight, for AP I would go the route of wide-field with premium lenses/scopes such as a 200mm Askar, a  Redcat 51mm and a quality CMOS camera such as QHY268C or the mono version. or even a full frame!  All on top of a portable, light weight mount.  This rig can be up and running quickly and will produce spectacular results.

For visual I would go for a large pair of quality binoculars of 100mm+ aperture with a premium parallelogram mount and a 200mm Dob with Baader Hyperion EP's.

[DaveS]

A Telegizmos 365 cover will keep your kit dry unless we get a hurricane, and a pet bed under it will keep damp off.

[Concordia000]

I don't know a lot about observatory-grade mounts but if I am to list my list of dream scopes...

- Takahashi Mewlon 180C - for visual and planetary. 180C not the 210 for faster cool down and less seeing issues, which is important in the UK

- APM-LZOS 105 or 130 F6 - basically as good as triplets go

- Takahashi FSQ-85EDP - dream wide field setup

- Celestron Edge 8 HD - versatile scope that can be used at F/2, F/6.3, and F/10

Those go on your observatory class mount. Additionally:

- 8/10-inch Dobsonian - self-explanatory

- Skywatcher 127 Mak - outreach scope

- Borg 72FL F4 set - best grab and go and travel scope; Borg 90FL/107FL in F3.9 configurations are also possible

- RST-135E - best lightweight mount available, period. It can also be used to carry any of the stuff above.

- Vixen Polarie U + DSLR - wide angle star tracker setup

- Questar 3.5 - come on, you dreamed owning one of those at least once.

 

You will notice my list of scopes have a lot of overlaps so it's not really a recommendation, just a list of things I am drooling over. I wonder how much money will I need to buy them all...

[newbie alert]

On 29/10/2021 at 09:53, vlaiv said:

Well, you did say dream setup

You can scale that down to fit your budget. I'm looking to replace my mount as well and so far my goal has been Mesu, but there seems to be new mount that is equally good in performance but lighter.

Take a look at E.Fric by Gemini Telescope Design. It is replacement for their G53f.

18Kg mount with 30Kg payload. Add to that 10-12" RC and ASI2600 camera - either mono or color, your choice. That is APS-C sized chip.

As it happens, there's one in the for sale section..brand new/ unused

And on ABS ( cheaper)

https://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/propview.php?view=179858

Edited November 2, 2021 by newbie alert
Added info

[vlaiv]

2 hours ago, newbie alert said:

As it happens, there's one in the for sale section..brand new/ unused

And on ABS ( cheaper)

https://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/propview.php?view=179858

Seen that, but I still don't have the funds for it - that purchase is going to have to wait another year or two.

[dan_adi]

I would go for a Mesu 200 or a 10 micron 2000hps mount. Both track, guide very well. For the Mesu you need to auto guide, for the 10 micron you need sky models. In terms of tracking RMS they both provide sub 0.5 " performance, so it's a difficult decision. The 10 micron will be sensitive to what scope you choose to put on it. Best results are with refractors or high quality mirror scope. From personal experience, avoid SCTs.

Regarding scopes, I would choose a refractor, even if they have smaller aperture, the build quality is better. With smaller aperture you simply need more subs, more integration time. A bigger mirror scope will get to your desired SNR faster, but remember the overall build quality is important. CFF and Lzos make top notch refractors with reasonable waiting time. CFF also makes very good RCs.

Regarding cameras, a CMOS will be fine.

When you decide, remember to choose an appropriate image scale. Seeing will limit the resolution.

Sorry for the long rambling but it is a difficult decision and astrophotography is complicated. For me the best combo was a Mesu with a refractor. I finished assembling the gear last summer, and it works with no headaches or troubleshooting.