ZWO ASIair pro reviews please!

[Robculm]

Hi all,

I posted a while back asking thoughts on replacing my broken 'outdoor' laptop with a 'remote' setup and as seems to be the norm in this 'business', received many different opinions / options / preferences!

I don't feel my IT skills are up to the Raspberry PI approach, so I'm down to deciding between a budget laptop or the ZWO ASIair pro.

Wondering if there's anyone here using the ASIair pro with a similar set up to mine (Skywatcher HEQ5 pro mount (with a good helping of periodic error!), 200PDS, ASI120 / mini finder, Canon 800D) that can share experience / recommendation.

I had only just embarked on using guiding, started with the PHD-2 software & was still using the Synscan handset for alignment / targeting etc & manual polar alignment. So my point here is that I'm not 'attached' to any existing guide / control set-up & happy to embark on something new, but I had seen some complaints that with the ASIair you're specifically limited to that 'ecosystem', so mainly just wondering if it's up to the job compared with a laptop set-up and all the possible software options that allows!

ASIair certainly looks appealing from the perspecive of minimising equipment / hassle! But only if it gives good results!

Many thanks,

Rob

 

[Thorney]

I use the ASIair, I went straight to that when I started imaging so I have no experience with a laptop and unable to compare. However I find the ASIair easy to use for polar align, controlling the camera, target find and guiding.  
 

I connect to a heq5 pro with a EQMOD cable so you don’t need the hand controller.   The DSLR plugs in via usb and can be controlled easily. As mentioned earlier I cannot compare to a laptop but you’ll have your pros and cons but for me I would recommend. 
 

[powerlord]

I went straight to ASIAIR PRO, so again, can't do a compare. But for me, I love it. Yes, it limits you to ZWO cameras (though supports loads of DSLRs), ZWP filter wheels, ZWO focusers. It does support all mounts.

Up front: looked through first telescope when i got one in January, started imaging in March.. so I am no expert.

My view is for me, it's absolutely great. The AP is not quite as easy as synscan as not live adjust - but still can PA usually to  less than 1 second in about 8 mins.

The app is solid reliable and very well integrated - allowing guiding, dithering, etc. You setup autoruns for your targets, and fire it off. You can livestack too if you want, and the results are every bit as good as from APP in my eyes, though I tend not to, as I don't have a need for it unless I'm trying to impress mates.

I still use DLSR live view for focusing with a bahtinov mask.

It live stretches each shot it takes, so its really easy to see if you are actually where you want to be for a nebula, etc - whereas before I was shooting based on histrogram on DSLR and of course couldn't actually see anything bar a star or two on the DLSR while shooting - which was a pain.

My setup is an EQ5, manually updated by me with EQSTAR PRO goto. OTA is usually a 72ED, but sometimes make127 or DSLR lenses. I've got a 200p, but not used in anger yet with it.

I guide with a 120mm and main camera usually 6D or 1200D or ASI224.

My guiding usually under 1 sec rms with this crufty old EQ5. I get 600 sec exposure fine with the 72ED and 6d.

It all 'just works' frankly. any issues I've had have been due to slight quirks with the EQSTAR bit rather than ASIAIR.

Using it with a big samsung tablet is a pleasure - I spend about 30 mins now setting up in evening, then retire to my bed, and fart about looking at stuff, setup targets and let it get on with it. You can set it to park mount back home and turn everything off at the end of session.

It also can do video with ZWO cameras, but Ive not tried that yet.

So pretty much nothing but praise for it. I've posted a few times over the last few weeks about this, and realise I'm in danger of sounding like a fanboy/zwo shill - but imho if you are happy to pay 300 quid for a pi4, custom power board and a fancy case. But imho the work has gone into making the software integrated, easy to use and building a great mobile app. As a software architect I know how difficult that is - and I am impressed how well they have managed to pull everything together into an easy to use mobile app.

There are folk trying to hack other stuff into it, but general view is that its not using indi drivers for cameras/etc so can't extend to non-zwo stuff.

It will also let you control the cooling on ZWO cameras, control 12v dew heaters by output voltage, etc.

I have a 256gb very fast usb stick stuck in it, and I have it ethernet wired to a wifi extender -  all on the mount. So it's basically on my home network meaning I can access it anywhere in my home.

Also, it supports EQMOD with safari, meaning you can run safari on tablet too, and see where the mount is pointing and control if required easily - I use that to move targets a bit sometimes off a nebula 'centre' for artistic framing, etc.

Also, as you can only set targets based on the classified name (why ? wish they'd update this), I use safari to get that often. i.e. finding out elephant nebula is IC1396, and then search that in ASIAIR and goto.

stu

 

Edited June 16, 2021 by powerlord

[Clarkey]

As a laptop user I think the main issue is that you are limited to ZWO products and software. I did consider the ASIAIR but as I have some non-ZWO focusers it was a non-starter for me. I think in terms of functionality it is pretty we the same as a budget laptop. I set my rig up on the laptop and go to bed. I also have Chrome remote desktop so I can use my tablet anywhere in the house. Pay your money and make your choice.

[Davey-T]

I've been using the Asiair Pro for a while albeit with all ZWO equipment, it generally works very well but has had it's moments like freezing when trying to update and refusing to unfreeze even when switched off and rebooted, eventually managed to update using iPhone.

A couple of nights ago it kept dithering in the middle of an image but it was OK last night.

It's worth buying a ZWO EAF focuser as the auto focus routine works really well

The functionality is constantly being added to.

The only fly in the ointment as far as I'm concerned is the poor WiFi, if I accidently stand between the scope and the iPad it looses the signal.

Dave

[powerlord]

That's why I did what I did Dave. Maybe I should do a video on it, as it's maybe not easy for the non techies ? basically I don't use the asiair wifi at all, but can access it anywhere from my home wifi. Stuff like converting the extender to 12v from 240v for example is actually pretty easy I think for anyone who can solder a bit.

And yeh, I think it's easier if you are at the start of the AP journey and not bought stuff yet - then it's not a big deal to stick to zwo stuff. If you have already invested in other gear I can see why it's not a good match.

I'm kinda waiting for news at work - if it's good news, I plan to splash out on asi1600, zwo 8 filter wheel, full set of filters and zwo focuser - which will really let the asiair shine. Problem is I'm not sure I want to part with the vast number of DSLR lenses and my DSLRs I've accumulated in the last 4 months.

This is how it starts isn't it ? I am going to have a fecking house full of AP stuff by the end of the year. I'm alread into regular photography and video and must have around 10 4k video cameras.

stu

[Davey-T]

37 minutes ago, powerlord said:

I'm not sure I want to part with the vast number of DSLR lenses

You can attach DSLR lenses to ZWO cameras.

I'm waiting for my Asiair warranty to expire to fit an external WiFi aerial.

Another annoying thing is only being able to take flats, darks and bias calibration frames but a lot of folk are taking dark flats.

Dave

Edited June 16, 2021 by Davey-T

[Davey-T]

Another strange thing from last night when plate solving, it says it's on target but then tries to validate it indefinitely, not a problem as just cancel it and carry on.

Dave

Edited June 16, 2021 by Davey-T

[Robculm]

Many thanks for the feedback. So generally positive, but mixed & some negatives, even from those who appear to like it!!! 🤔

Am I correct in thinking that as long as your home WIFI is strong enough for the ASIair pro to connect to it, you can just connect the tablet to that home WIFI too and work like that? There's no to use the ASI's WIFI transmitter?

Also, it's possible to use either the Synscan handset + ASIair pro, or bypass the handset & control everything from the ASIair pro. In the latter case, can you make minor ALT / DEC adjustments to frame the image? Don't understand why you would need to use EQMOD/safari in this case?

Cheers,

Rob

[powerlord]

 Because safari shows you graphically where it is in the sky. Asiair doesn't.

WiFi wise, all u need is a 15 quid extender with ethernet. You set up extender on mount, plug in to asiair with ethernet cable and now your asiair is wired into your home network. The extender has big external antennas so has no probs extending/connecting to your main WiFi.

Now power wise, you want it to run of 12v right? Well all extenders I've taken apart have a 240v circuit board separate, that outputs either 3.3v or 5v dc. So all you do is bin the 240v board, and replace with a wee 12v to 5/3.3v buck regulator (see ebay for about 2 quid). End result is a WiFi extender which can be powered by 12v from asiair.

 

AND if travelling, you just flip the extender to Ap mode in the field, and you can now directly connect to your asiair from yer tent, motorhome, whatever.

Simples.

Stu

[Robculm]

Thanks Stu.

I think I'm pretty well convinced & ready to give it a go...

Will report back how I get on!

Cheers,

Rob

[rnobleeddy]

On 16/06/2021 at 14:09, Davey-T said:

You can attach DSLR lenses to ZWO cameras.

I'm waiting for my Asiair warranty to expire to fit an external WiFi aerial.

Another annoying thing is only being able to take flats, darks and bias calibration frames but a lot of folk are taking dark flats.

Dave

Assuming you mean the drop down is missing dark flats then that's the same as astroberry and is a little annoying. 

 

Fortunately I don't take fresh darks each session, so I can label the dark flats as darks without fear of getting mixed up!

[iapa]

On 16/06/2021 at 14:09, Davey-T said:

You can attach DSLR lenses to ZWO cameras.

I'm waiting for my Asiair warranty to expire to fit an external WiFi aerial.

Another annoying thing is only being able to take flats, darks and bias calibration frames but a lot of folk are taking dark flats.

Dave

I take darks, and flat-darks using the ASIAir Por.

• Take FLATS, note the exposure,
• Create a schedule for DARKS and set the exposure to that used for your FLATS - remembering to cover the lens oops 😳
• Copy all the data to the machine used for processing,
• Create a new folder, called FLAT-DARKS
• move the FLAT-DARKS to the new folder.

My preference is to keep FLATS and FLAT-DARKS under the lights folder for that session, although I date/time stamp file names any way.

For BIAS and DARKS I just maintain a library.

Because the new CMOS cameras do not produce a lot of heat during flats due to the short exposure, an alternative is to use a master BIAS as your FLAT-DARK.

 

 

[SiD the Turtle]

Putting in my 2p and advocating the Raspberry Pi route:

• It's expensive compared to a Pi.
• It relies on the support of ZWO. If it doesn't work there's no enthusiasts picking through the code, fixing it and releasing a fix for you.
• (In theory) it will get replaced/fall out of support, like when they replaced the original ASI Air (though to be fair they did a discount deal for those early adopters).
• It's not extendible. I now have my Pi running my full image capture cycle, running the Polemaster and soon controlling the roof on my shed, weather station and so on.

Don't get me wrong- it's a marvellous bit of kit. The Pi has downsides- can be clunky, learning curve is steep, mobile app isn't really an option. But alternative proposition: get a Pi and try Astroberry. If it doesn't work out you're out maybe £50 on the Pi, cables and so on, that you could recycle for one of a thousand other Raspberry Pi projects.

[The Admiral]

On 16/06/2021 at 14:09, Davey-T said:

I'm waiting for my Asiair warranty to expire to fit an external WiFi aerial.

What about this?

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/zwo-accessories/zwo-wifi-extender-for-asiair-pro.html

Ian

[iapa]

ASIAir Pro also provides power distribution in the same case.

Just saying 

[Davey-T]

1 hour ago, The Admiral said:

What about this?

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/zwo-accessories/zwo-wifi-extender-for-asiair-pro.html

Ian

A few folks on the Asiair Pro Facebook site still having problems even using that.

Dave

[Davey-T]

2 hours ago, iapa said:

I take darks, and flat-darks using the ASIAir Por.

• Take FLATS, note the exposure,
• Create a schedule for DARKS and set the exposure to that used for your FLATS - remembering to cover the lens oops 😳
• Copy all the data to the machine used for processing,
• Create a new folder, called FLAT-DARKS
• move the FLAT-DARKS to the new folder.

My preference is to keep FLATS and FLAT-DARKS under the lights folder for that session, although I date/time stamp file names any way.

For BIAS and DARKS I just maintain a library.

Because the new CMOS cameras do not produce a lot of heat during flats due to the short exposure, an alternative is to use a master BIAS as your FLAT-DARK.

 

 

That's what I do but would be easier if they implemented it in the App, wouldn't take a lot of effort.

Dave

[Davey-T]

One more point of annoyance, they keep introducing new features but never update the manual, seem to rely on someone posting a YT how to video.

Dave

[iapa]

31 minutes ago, Davey-T said:

That's what I do but would be easier if they implemented it in the App, wouldn't take a lot of effort.

Dave

It was more an aide memoire to those who’ve not don’t dark flats yet.

Agreed, would be nice to have.

[david_taurus83]

For the money I'd consider a mini PC especially if your going to be mainly using it from home and are in range of your home WiFi. Can use any kit you like and any capture program. I have NINA, APT, Stellarium, Sharpcap, Carte du Ciel, even Pixinsight on mine. I control it via VNC on my phone mainly. Can be away from home and control everything if needed. 

[iapa]

Until I got my 1st ASIAir PRO, I had a stick PC running SGPro, Stellarium etc. etc.

Image and guide cameras plus focuser on each OTA.

Worked well. Still does.

[Robculm]

Ha, I'm going to ignore all the nagative or PI fan comments 🙉 now as I've already ordered the ASIair pro, hopefully arriving tomorrow!

I do have a quick question regarding DSLR camera connection though if anyone can help please as it's not clear to me from the manual...

I'm planning to use my Canon 800D as the 'main camera'.

Looks like I need to connect from the camera data cable connection (looks like USB type 2 mini?) to the USB3.0 port.

Do I also need to use the shutter release cable (2.5mm jack) or this is handled through the data connection?

When taking images, are these then stored on the ASIair pro memory card, rather than the Camera's memory card? or both?

I also note there's a comment in the ASIair pro manual saying to turn off the shutter lock up function? Does this mean that shutter lock up is covered within the ASIair pro software, or that this (important) feature is lost?

Many thanks,

Rob

[Davey-T]

Don't need the shutter release cable, images are saved to camera SD card, don't think it locks shutter before taking image.

Dave

[powerlord]

images can be saved to sdcard. they are always saved to asiair (get a fast usb stick - the 64gb it comes with is very slow).

it doesn't seem to work control wise if you have the shutter lock on. So yeh, you can't have that on.

sorry for my ignorance, buy why is it important feature ?

DSLR wise - yeh mini USB cable. no point plugging in tyo usb3 port on asiair as canons are all usb2, but if there's one spare it will of course work fine.

I use liveview still to focus as its a PITA using the focus on the app. But then remember to turn off live view so you don't get amp glow.

After trying android apps to control DSLR and finding them flaky as a flaky thing, I was pleased to find I've never had an issue with control on the ASIAIR, just make sure you are in bulb mode, RAW only (not plus jpg), and no mirror lock.