Can you recommend a good 12.5mm (or thereabouts) eyepiece?

[Deadlake]

19 hours ago, jetstream said:

This eyepiece is one of the best values for the money there is IMHO, I use it all the time leaving my 21E gently cradled in the foam case to avoid damaging this uber expensive eyepiece.

When was the last time you used the 21E then? 😀

[Louis D]

22 hours ago, StuartT said:

I think I may be missing something here... are televue eyepieces very fancy then? Is that why @faulksy was warning against them?

Tele Vue designs their eyepiece in-house in the USA which leads to increased R&D costs to recapture.  They also manufacture them in dedicated factories in Japan and Taiwan to avoid design copying by Chinese firms.  TV designs their eyepieces to work well down to at least f/4.  They also tend to have higher levels of polish and better stray light control internal to the eyepiece, leading to less ghosting and light flooding with bright objects.  I believe they also test every eyepiece in-house before shipping them to retailers as a quality control check.  All of this attention to detail increases the cost of their eyepieces relative to Chinese made eyepieces.

Nikon, Pentax, and the late Docter/Noblex also had similar design, manufacturing, and marketing methodologies with prices to match.

[jetstream]

2 hours ago, Deadlake said:

When was the last time you used the 21E then? 😀

Its been a few months I think- I had it out once? something like that. I use the 10mm Delos a lot and with the VIP. That Nikon HW is vg with the17E also in its nest. I'm just glad I bought all these on sale and with money at par or near. The price of things these days makes me cringe.

[Deadlake]

The APM XWA are close to the Ethos line, but they do not have the QA process then. Just send them back?

[HollyHound]

1 hour ago, Deadlake said:

The APM XWA are close to the Ethos line, but they do not have the QA process then. Just send them back?

Having just recently tested the APM XWA 20 against the Ethos 21, I can confirm (at least for the samples I have) that the difference is very minor indeed... the only difference is that there was some noticeable astigmatism in the outer 15% (at most) with the APM.

On the other side, the Ethos is 50% heavier and significantly more expensive 😬

I have retained the Ethos 21 and sold on the APM 20, but that's just so I'm never going to ask myself "what if" in the future 🤣

[jetstream]

1 hour ago, Deadlake said:

The APM XWA are close to the Ethos line, but they do not have the QA process then. Just send them back?

I paid 700 odd bucks for my 21E in CDN dollars...

I have never heard of the APM 100s having issues. Dont know what to say except I really like the 20mm Lunt/APM I have.

[jetstream]

1 minute ago, HollyHound said:

the difference is very minor indeed.

Yes, agreed. And on somethings the APM bests my sample of the 21E ie sections of the Veil under dark skies. A lot of these differences show up under truly good conditions IMHO.

at first coma was masking the astig in the 20 APM, but a Paracorr II revealed it to me. The 21E is superb to the edge with the PCII at f4.1.

One thing is for sure- we don't need the most expensive glass to get top views IMHO.

[HollyHound]

5 minutes ago, jetstream said:

at first coma was masking the astig in the 20 APM, but a Paracorr II revealed it to me. The 21E is superb to the edge with the PCII at f4.1.

Same here, I would absolutely not have seen any of the outer edge aberrations on my newer eyepieces had coma been present, which it was for me on the 10" dob. The Paracorr II was revolutionary in that respect (for me anyway) 👍

Arguably, without it I'd just accept the coma, wouldn't have been bothered and saved some money 🤣

5 minutes ago, jetstream said:

One thing is for sure- we don't need the most expensive glass to get top views IMHO.

Absolutely, as I said before, I've had no really bad eyepieces really at all.

Edited March 8, 2021 by HollyHound

[jetstream]

1 minute ago, HollyHound said:

I've had no really bad eyepieces really at all.

Me neither but I've had a couple of letdowns including a 12.5mm Tak LE, that is softer than a 12.5mm Tak ortho and for me offers zero advantages. My 12.5m  Tak ortho is razor sharp and barlows very well.

[Deadlake]

30 minutes ago, jetstream said:

Me neither but I've had a couple of letdowns including a 12.5mm Tak LE, that is softer than a 12.5mm Tak ortho and for me offers zero advantages. My 12.5m  Tak ortho is razor sharp and barlows very well.

How does the XWA compare with 21E in your TSA120?

[jetstream]

Very well.

[Spile]

On 07/03/2021 at 20:20, jetstream said:

This eyepiece is one of the best values for the money there is

It is easy to find suggestions and opinions for the "best" eyepiece.

I find far more useful, recommendations for the "best value for money".

[jetstream]

1 minute ago, Spile said:

It is easy to find suggestions and opinions for the "best" eyepiece.

I find far more useful, recommendations for the "best value for money".

Yes, I like this comparison too and in this case the APM 20mm 100 is so good that any negatives attached to the phrase doesn't apply IMHO. I use a filter slide on my dobs to compare the performance of this eyepiece to the other mentioned.

[jetstream]

Off the 12.5mm mark but if anyone finds a used Zeiss 12.8mm part # 52 80 59- I would consider it, No longer made I missed buying this eyepiece. It will need the Zeiss adapter though. Also known as the 30/40 Diascope eyepiece.

[John]

1 hour ago, Spile said:

It is easy to find suggestions and opinions for the "best" eyepiece.

I find far more useful, recommendations for the "best value for money".

I think "best eyepiece" is the question that is often asked by folks before they realise just how much some of them cost !

 

[StuartT]

my new 12.5mm Morpheus has just arrived. It's HUGE! Never seen an eyepiece that big before!

[Louis D]

35 minutes ago, StuartT said:

my new 12.5mm Morpheus has just arrived. It's HUGE! Never seen an eyepiece that big before!

If you think the 12.5mm Morpheus is big, you'd better stay well away from the 12mm ES-92 shown below on the far left.  Your Morpheus is similar in size to the 12mm Nagler T4 or 13mm AstroTech AF70 below:

Edited March 9, 2021 by Louis D

[Barry-W-Fenner]

41 minutes ago, StuartT said:

my new 12.5mm Morpheus has just arrived. It's HUGE! Never seen an eyepiece that big before!

I am seriously tempted by the 12mm Morph. But I already have the 14mm - I dont know if I can justify it.

The 4.5mm Morph however!! 🙂

Baz

[StuartT]

4 minutes ago, Barry-W-Fenner said:

I am seriously tempted by the 12mm Morph. But I already have the 14mm - I dont know if I can justify it.

The 4.5mm Morph however!! 🙂

Baz

I doubt there would be a lot of point in having a 12.4 and a 14 surely? Hardly any diff in power

[KP82]

31 minutes ago, Barry-W-Fenner said:

I am seriously tempted by the 12mm Morph. But I already have the 14mm - I dont know if I can justify it.

The 4.5mm Morph however!! 🙂

Baz

A 9mm Morpheus would make more sense. An 1.4x-ish difference in focal length is often used when choosing eyepieces.

Edited March 9, 2021 by KP82

[Louis D]

21 minutes ago, KP82 said:

A 9mm Morpheus would make more sense. An 1.4x-ish difference in focal length is often used when choosing eyepieces.

I have the 14mm and 9mm Morpheus.  The 9mm is world class sharp.  It's very close to my 10mm Delos.

The 14mm is very nice in the central 85%.  The outer 15% tends to fall off in sharpness slightly due to astigmatism and field curvature.

50 minutes ago, StuartT said:

I doubt there would be a lot of point in having a 12.4 and a 14 surely? Hardly any diff in power

I wouldn't get a 12.5mm Morpheus if I already had a 14mm Morpheus.  My 12mm ES-92 views entirely differently and is 2-inch only.

If that new APM wonder-zoom pans out, I may get it next.  It would cover my most used focal lengths.

[Barry-W-Fenner]

43 minutes ago, KP82 said:

A 9mm Morpheus would make more sense. An 1.4x-ish difference in focal length is often used when choosing eyepieces.

I have the 9mm Morpheus, it is a fantastic EP. My go to and joint  favourite with the 17.5mm Morpheus.

The 14mm is also great a Louis has mentioned. I have the 6.5 aswell but it doesn't get a huge amount of use in my dob. I'm hoping to use it more in my new frac, this is why I would also like the 4.5mm

[StuartT]

forgive the dumb question, but as my new Morpheus has a wider angle of view, it actually has to squeeze more stuff in, so the image will actually be smaller than it otherwise would with, say, a 12.5mm Plossl?

So not really one to use on planets then? (as why would I want a smaller image?)

[Louis D]

23 minutes ago, StuartT said:

forgive the dumb question, but as my new Morpheus has a wider angle of view, it actually has to squeeze more stuff in, so the image will actually be smaller than it otherwise would with, say, a 12.5mm Plossl?

So not really one to use on planets then? (as why would I want a smaller image?)

No, the central 50 degrees of the Morpheus will show the same amount of sky as the Plossl at the same magnification.  12.5mm focal length determines the image size.  You'll just get to see what was beyond the field stop in the Plossl for better context.

It should work fine on planets, especially for those of us without a tracking mount.  It gives more dwell time between nudges.

Edited March 9, 2021 by Louis D

[StuartT]

13 minutes ago, Louis D said:

No, the central 50 degrees of the Morpheus will show the same amount of sky as the Plossl at the same magnification.  12.5mm focal length determines the image size.  You'll just get to see what was beyond the field stop in the Plossl for better context.

It should work fine on planets, especially for those of us without a tracking mount.  It gives more dwell time between nudges.

excellent! thanks