Recommended first EP's

[SparkyVRA]

Hi I'm a complete noob and spent weeks researching which has led me to the Nexstar 8SE.

So this comes with a single 25mm EP, which I guess is going to be a budget EP.

Unfortunately the scope has left little budget for EPs. And while I could by the celestron EP set these are not going to be a budget set so I would probably end up replacing them.

Considering the 8 inch scope has a focal length of 2032mm what would people recommend for good eye relief and fov.

I'm setting an initial budget of £200 but would prefer to buy  good ep's, so if that means I'm limited to 1 or two initially what focal length would be recommend? I have been looking at the bst range as these have a good fov but also considered celestron x-cel and Omni.

I wear glasses but not sure if I will wear them until scope arrives next week.

 

Thanks

[Ricochet]

Personally, I would start my eyepiece collection by choosing something in the region of 2-2.5X the focal ratio, so a 20-25mm eyepiece. Then I would move in steps of ~1.41, which will lead to a doubling or halving of brightness depending on which way you go and is what your brain notices as "steps" in brightness. This would give you something in the region of 14-18mm for your second eyepiece and then 10-12.5 for the next. Where this falls down is for Lunar/Planetary where you will want a whole range of focal lengths so that you can adjust for what the atmosphere will allow on any given night.

As you've already got the 25mm you could keep that for now and consider that maybe in future you replace it with a 24,, 68° eyepiece (i.e the Explore Scientific or TeleVue). That would mean you're looking for roughly 17.5mm and 12.5mm eyepieces as your next steps up, both of which are available in the Baader Morpheus range if you do decide you want to spend your budget at this time on a single eyepiece. Optically, these are better than the cheaper ones you are considering and they also have a bit more eye relief, which will make them more comfortable if you do have to wear your glasses. I've tried my 25mm BSTs with glasses and they're just about usable, but my glasses touch the rubber eyecup in its lowest position so a touch more eye relief is preferable if you do wear glasses.

[JTEC]

3 hours ago, Ricochet said:

the Baader Morpheus range

FWIW, I think this is where the best balance of quality in a reasonably wide eyepiece with comfortable eye-relief against price is currently to be found.  Not cheap but not crazy expensive either.  You might regret going halfway house to start with - a process of continuous ‘upgrading’ ends up being the most expensive way to do things in the long run. I have the 17.5mm Morpheus (and the 6.5) and think they’re excellent. I also have some of the Delos range and had thoughts of getting more. They’re excellent of course but nearly twice the price of the Morpheus and, imv, not ‘twice as good’, whatever that would mean. So, I’ve moved towards the Morpheus and am looking at these and the Pentaxes (priced in between) to fill the space between my 8mm Delos and 4mm Tak TOE. The Televue prices - though the quality is beyond reproach are, to my mind, now looking harder and harder to justify. That’s a bit of a digression, but my point is that you can get excellent eyepieces for ‘moderate’ prices, as long as you don’t want special features like, say, 100 degrees. I don’t know of any top quality eyepieces that are cheap to buy, but others might. I think the TV Plössls come close but they’re not everyone’s cup of tea. 

Edited May 9, 2020 by JTEC

[SparkyVRA]

Wow the Morpheus are expensive but the specs look good. 

 

Food for thought. Thanks

[John]

While the step from the stock eyepieces to something like the BST Starguider or Celestron X-Cell LX is quite big in performance terms, the steps after that are quite a bit smaller, especially with a "slow" scope such as and SCT.

Some eyepieces are eye wateringly expensive - there are some that top £1K each now. The Morpheus are "middle of the road" in cost terms but seem to perform as well as some that cost twice as much.

 

 

 

 

[SparkyVRA]

Thanks I have the 17.5 Morpheus in my basket, just working up the nerve to click buy lol.

How would you guys rate the cheaper x-cels? Is it really that much difference in quality? Ok silly question but interested in opinions anyway.

[Ricochet]

18 minutes ago, SparkyVRA said:

Thanks I have the 17.5 Morpheus in my basket, just working up the nerve to click buy lol.

How would you guys rate the cheaper x-cels? Is it really that much difference in quality? Ok silly question but interested in opinions anyway.

I had the 7mm X-Cell LX, and it was a good eyepiece. Unfortunately, I don't have it to go back and assess the quality of the coatings now that my eye is more critical. At the time I thought it was better than the 8mm Starguider I also owned. However, with both Starguider and X-Cell LX, the longer focal lengths are generally weaker than the shorter ones, but at f10 they might both be ok in terms of correction. 

[John]

40 minutes ago, SparkyVRA said:

Thanks I have the 17.5 Morpheus in my basket, just working up the nerve to click buy lol.

How would you guys rate the cheaper x-cels? Is it really that much difference in quality? Ok silly question but interested in opinions anyway.

There won't be much of a difference between the Morpheus and the X-Cell LX's or BST Starguiders. The Morpheus has a larger apparent field of view of course but optically they will all be quite close, especially in the central part of the field of view. I compared the 8mm BST Starguider (£47) to my Tele Vue 8mm Ethos (£500+) a few years back and there was not much difference in performance apart from the massive field of view of the Ethos.

The Morpheus are clearly very nice eyepieces though so I'm sure you won't be dissappointed at all. You can start saving for the rest of the series then 

It's so easy to spend more on eyepieces than the scope had cost !

[SparkyVRA]

So basically I know what I want, but I'm limited to just one. So going of Ricochet's comments it looks like I will go for 17.5.

[SparkyVRA]

Is it worth me looking at the 12.5 next or a Barlow, if Barlow what would be good one to get?

[John]

2 minutes ago, SparkyVRA said:

Is it worth me looking at the 12.5 next or a Barlow, if Barlow what would be good one to get?

I think you would need to get a 2 inch barlow to avoid loosing some of the field of view of the Morpheus 17.5. So that would also mean a 2 inch diagonal.

There are some good barlows about but personally, with an eyepiece like the Morpheus (good quality, big field stop, lots of glass and rather tall !) I would go for another eyepiece.

 

 

[bomberbaz]

As you have not got the scope but wear glasses, wait until you have and see if you can view without them before spending any money on new eyepieces..

If you are plain near or far sighted, chances are you may get away without them.

If you have astigmatism, you will probably need them when viewing at lower power although to what extent will depend on eyepiece focal length and severity of the astigmatism.

The main reason I mention this is glasses have a massive effect on what field of view you see and also make some eyepieces near unusable. I wish I had known more avbout glasses issues, exit puplis and other things about them, would have saved a few quid for sure.

If you note my eyepiece collection in my signature I can use something called a dioptrix corrector with the nikon and nagler eyepieces which has the effect of correcting my astigmatism. However below around 2.5mm exit pupil the astigmatism becomes so mild I no longer need the dioptrix.

Sounds complicated maybe but once you get your head around the basic principle it becomes easy.

Re; BARLOWS. I use a teleview powermate (also in my sig) as it allows me a large range of viewing with only 3 eyepieces but the PM's are quite expensive. The explore scientific focal extenders run a very close second to the TV PM's I am lead to believe at around half the price. Will work superbly with the C8. Just another idea for you.

HTH

Steve.

 

 

 

[Don Pensack]

On 09/05/2020 at 03:53, SparkyVRA said:

Hi I'm a complete noob and spent weeks researching which has led me to the Nexstar 8SE.

So this comes with a single 25mm EP, which I guess is going to be a budget EP.

Unfortunately the scope has left little budget for EPs. And while I could by the celestron EP set these are not going to be a budget set so I would probably end up replacing them.

Considering the 8 inch scope has a focal length of 2032mm what would people recommend for good eye relief and fov.

I'm setting an initial budget of £200 but would prefer to buy  good ep's, so if that means I'm limited to 1 or two initially what focal length would be recommend? I have been looking at the bst range as these have a good fov but also considered celestron x-cel and Omni.

I wear glasses but not sure if I will wear them until scope arrives next week.

 

Thanks

In the absence of a 2" star diagonal, the obvious choice for a low power, widest field eyepiece in the affordable range is a 32mm Plössl.

This will give you the widest field of view possible in 1.25", or about 0.76° (the Moon is about 0.5°).

From there, a 20mm Plössl would do well, and yield a fine power for most objects and a comfortable and visually acute focal length.

I'd add a 13-14mm eyepiece for higher power for smaller objects.**

Those 3 would be a good choice for a start.

**Add a 2X Barlow lens to double the power of each of the above, and add the equivalent of a 16mm, 10mm, and 6.5-7mm and you have a fairly complete set of eyepieces.

That 2X Barlow lens can also be used in front of the star diagonal to yield approximately 3X for each eyepiece, effectively adding 3 other magnifications.  

And certain inexpensive Barlows can have their lenses unthreaded from the barrel and attached directly to the eyepieces to yield about 1.5x

(magnifications are approximate).  So one barlow can add 9 additional magnifications when used with a set of 3 eyepieces.

More cost effectively, the 32mm, 20mm and 2X Barlow (like the Celestron Omni or GSO) can cover pretty much all the magnifications you need if money is tight.

Wider field eyepieces, or eyepieces to replace the Barlow lens can always be added later, as your budget dictates.

 

If your budget allows, the Celestron X-Cel LX would be wider of field, have more eye relief, and generally be more engaging when at the telescope.

In that case, a 25mm, an 18mm and a X-Cel LX 2x Barlow, yielding a set of 25, 18, 12.5, 9, and possibly 8.3, and 6mm

A very frugal way to approach it, and probably available around £200.

[faulksy]

i found these were very good in my old sct

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/ovl-eyepieces/ovl-nirvana-es-uwa-82-ultrawide-eyepieces.html

[Merlin66]

I’ve got to say, when I started out back in the 60’s I was told even the bottom of a coke bottle would work well at f10.........

[bingevader]

1 hour ago, Merlin66 said:

I’ve got to say, when I started out back in the 60’s I was told even the bottom of a coke bottle would work well at f10.........

If you want to see the bottom of a coke bottle, maybe! 🤔

[Merlin66]