Fitting a Moonlite Focuser to an Altair Starwave Classic 102 f/11

[AdeKing]

Has anyone out there fitted a Moonlite to an Altair Starwave Classic 102 f/11 OTA?

I have just picked up a used motorised single speed 2" Crayford that I would like to fit to the above OTA.

If you have done this, could you let me know which Moonlite Flange you needed to attach the focuser?

Looking at the Moonlite pages, I think that this is the correct one, but I'm not 100% sure.

The Orion 102/ AT102 flange fits the Orion 102ED, Astro Tech 102ED, WO98 Carbon Fiber tube, Astrotelescopes 102, and Kunming United 102. It is a male 4.006" X 1mm threaded flange. The correct drawtube is the 4.5" travel.

I'm going to remove the existing focuser to check the thread diameter tonight, but any guidance would be much appreciated.

Many thanks,

Ade

[GlenM]

The scopes are made by Kunming, although I've never done it. Focuser problem? If it's a bearing problem I have a few left over new bearings,

gratis.

 

Glen.

 

 

 

 

[AdeKing]

3 hours ago, GlenM said:

The scopes are made by Kunming, although I've never done it. Focuser problem? If it's a bearing problem I have a few left over new bearings,

gratis.

Glen.

Hi Glen, 

Thanks for the confirmation, its a combination of things really. I feel that the scope length is at the limit of my EQ5 and manual focusing means that it takes several seconds to settle every time I tweak the focus.

Secondly, no matter how much I adjust it, I can't get rid of the tight spots as you focus which irritates me somewhat.

A motorised Moonlite came up at a good price and so I figured that this would kill two birds with one stone as it were as the motor focus will remove the need to touch the focuser to focus thereby removing the irritation of the tight spots and the annoyance of settling times.

Buying the used Moonlite was a much cheaper option than a used heavier duty EQ mount. 

I'm going to remove the focuser tonight so will have another go at adjusting it to see if I can improve it. 

An unforseen irritation of the hi res stepper Moonlite is the backlash in the gearbox which makes nailing focus tricky with the handset. 

I will however check the bearings to see if they are the cause of the problem though so might yet take you up on your kind offer. 

[John]

Is your EQ5 driven Ade ?

I've found having a driven mount makes a lot of difference to vibration handling with a long scope on board.

A sturdy tripod is impoartant as well.

[AdeKing]

Hi John,

Thanks for the suggestion, it is a full EQ5 Goto and is fitted to the standard EQ5/HEQ5 1.75" steel tripod with a pier extension in between so the OTA doesn't collide with the legs.

The OTA is reasonably light but is quite a bit longer than the ED100 and ED120 which is why I figured that the tube length might be a bit long for the EQ5.

[John]

The longer tube will have an impact, thats for sure. The more stuff you can add that minimises the need to touch it, the better the vibrations will be controlled.

If one comes up, the 2 inch steel tubed Celestron CG5 tripod is taller and quite a bit more sturdy than the 1.75" steel tripod. Might be worth considering. I used to use a 150mm F/8 and also a 127mm F/9.2 refractors on a CG5 (same as EQ5 really) on the 2 inch steel tripod and it did a decent job for visual observing.

 

[AdeKing]

51 minutes ago, John said:

If one comes up, the 2 inch steel tubed Celestron CG5 tripod is taller and quite a bit more sturdy than the 1.75" steel tripod. Might be worth considering. I used to use a 150mm F/8 and also a 127mm F/9.2 refractors on a CG5 (same as EQ5 really) on the 2 inch steel tripod and it did a decent job for visual observing.

Thanks for the tip John.  I'll try it on mu Uni 18 and see whether that makes much of a difference.

Alfian has a CG-5 tripod for sale at the moment, but it needs collecting from Yorkshire which is a bit too far for me.

I'll keep a lookout for another CG-5 tripod if the Uni 18 doesn't do the trick.

[John]

The UNI 18 will make a difference (I have the UNI 28). Not only is it a more stable tripod than the stock 1.75inch one, the ash wood absorbs vibrations well - thats why they make hammer handles out of it.

The UNI tripods are even better than the 2 inch steel tubed ones - I just did not realise you had one !

 

[Rob]

Ade. I would certainly suggest the 2" CG5 tripod. It made the difference to my EQ5 for sure.

Rob

[GlenM]

17 hours ago, AdeKing said:

Hi Glen, 

Thanks for the confirmation, its a combination of things really. I feel that the scope length is at the limit of my EQ5 and manual focusing means that it takes several seconds to settle every time I tweak the focus.

Secondly, no matter how much I adjust it, I can't get rid of the tight spots as you focus which irritates me somewhat.

A motorised Moonlite came up at a good price and so I figured that this would kill two birds with one stone as it were as the motor focus will remove the need to touch the focuser to focus thereby removing the irritation of the tight spots and the annoyance of settling times.

Buying the used Moonlite was a much cheaper option than a used heavier duty EQ mount. 

I'm going to remove the focuser tonight so will have another go at adjusting it to see if I can improve it. 

An unforseen irritation of the hi res stepper Moonlite is the backlash in the gearbox which makes nailing focus tricky with the handset. 

I will however check the bearings to see if they are the cause of the problem though so might yet take you up on your kind offer. 

Yes, the scope does have a moment arm problem. Just let me know if you need a couple of bearings. They do have a tendency to collapse a little when the focuser is over tightened. Also check the little nylon half-moon for the tightening procedure. If it's slipped a little this can play havoc with the 'feel' of the focuser. Not a difficult focuser to strip down, but care must be taken. As long as the dual speed is working then it could just be a bearing.

 

Glen.

 

[AdeKing]

9 hours ago, John said:

The UNI 18 will make a difference (I have the UNI 28). Not only is it a more stable tripod than the stock 1.75inch one, the ash wood absorbs vibrations well - thats why they make hammer handles out of it.

The UNI tripods are even better than the 2 inch steel tubed ones - I just did not realise you had one !

 

No worries John. I don't often use the EQ5 as I prefer Alt AZ so I normally have a mini Ercole or my WO EZTouch attached to the Uni 18 as I use them more. 

But I'm trying to learn to like using the EQ5 so am willing to fit the EQ5 and extension to the prized Berlebach. 

 

[John]

1 minute ago, AdeKing said:

No worries John. I don't often use the EQ5 as I prefer Alt AZ so I normally have a mini Ercole or my WO EZTouch attached to the Uni 18 as I use them more. 

 

 

I'm just the same Ade.

[AdeKing]

5 hours ago, GlenM said:

Yes, the scope does have a moment arm problem. Just let me know if you need a couple of bearings. They do have a tendency to collapse a little when the focuser is over tightened. Also check the little nylon half-moon for the tightening procedure. If it's slipped a little this can play havoc with the 'feel' of the focuser. Not a difficult focuser to strip down, but care must be taken. As long as the dual speed is working then it could just be a bearing.

Glen.

Thanks Glen, I assume that the focuser is a GSO one as it doesn't much look like the long perng ones I can find images of..

Ill have a go at following these instructions to see if I can make it smoother. 

http://polluxchung.com/gso_crayford_fix/

 

[AdeKing]

2 minutes ago, John said:

I'm just the same Ade.

Problem is that I like the convenience of goto and tracking when I'm sketching which those lively Alt AZ mounts don't give me. 

Currently saving hard for an iOptron AZ Pro but am not sure it'll cope the the length of the f/11 tube either. 

[GlenM]

The focuser isn't GSO it's Kunming/United optics own. As far as I know they manufacture the whole OTA including focuser.

 

Glen.

 

[AdeKing]

On 11/07/2019 at 09:41, John said:

The UNI 18 will make a difference (I have the UNI 28). Not only is it a more stable tripod than the stock 1.75inch one, the ash wood absorbs vibrations well - thats why they make hammer handles out of it.

The UNI tripods are even better than the 2 inch steel tubed ones - I just did not realise you had one !

 

I had the f/11 EQ5 combo out last night on the Uni 18 and all I can say is Wow. 

What a difference the Berlebach made, vibrations settled almost instantly after focusing and didn't seem to be anywhere near as large in amplitude if that makes sense. 

It was like having the scope mounted on a beefier mount. 

Thanks for the tip @John. Will definitely be using this combo more often. 

 

[Stu]

Good news Ade, tripod do make a huge impact on stability, it's very surprising just how much.

[AdeKing]

I've got an old TAL wooden tripod stored at my folks place. Maybe I'll dig it out to replace the other steel tripod. 

Not as nicely finished as the Uni18 though. 

 

[AdeKing]

On 12/07/2019 at 15:09, GlenM said:

The focuser isn't GSO it's Kunming/United optics own. As far as I know they manufacture the whole OTA including focuser.

Glen.

Thanks Glen,

I stripped the focuser right down at the weekend, added a bit more silicone grease to the bearings and reassembled. 

After much gentle tweaking of the grub screws on the focuser body where the spindle emerges from the focuser body I eventually managed to find a setting which holds everything in place and significantly reduced the tight spot on the focuser motion.

It's now much nicer to use, but I'm yet to use it in anger.

Thanks for the heads up about the bearing and Teflon pad. Both appear to be in excellent condition on mine with no signs of cracks in the bearing housing and the Teflon pad was exactly where it should be.

Much happier now though still trying to identify the correct Moonlite flange. 

Ade

[GlenM]

Excellent news, Ade. Enjoy your 'new' focuser.

 

Glen.

 

[Stu]

Good news Ade! Have you tried contacting Moonlite directly, they are normally very helpful.

I had the pleasure of viewing Jupiter and the partial lunar eclipse through a lovely Lyra Optics 102mm, very nice views!

[AdeKing]

6 hours ago, Stu said:

Good news Ade! Have you tried contacting Moonlite directly, they are normally very helpful.

I tried emailing them on an address that FLO supplied me with but have had radio silence. 

I'll try the email address I used when I contacted them about the bearings I managed to crack. 

The views are very good and now that the EQ5 is on my Uni 18 the scope is nice and stable. 

[AdeKing]

7 hours ago, GlenM said:

Excellent news, Ade. Enjoy your 'new' focuser.

Glen.

Thanks Glen, it's amazing what a bit of fettling and a lot of patience can achieve. 

Patience is something I don't have much of but given this result I clearly need to have more of it and more often. 😊

[AdeKing]

On 10/07/2019 at 16:05, AdeKing said:

Has anyone out there fitted a Moonlite to an Altair Starwave Classic 102 f/11 OTA?

I have just picked up a used motorised single speed 2" Crayford that I would like to fit to the above OTA.

If you have done this, could you let me know which Moonlite Flange you needed to attach the focuser?

Looking at the Moonlite pages, I think that this is the correct one, but I'm not 100% sure.

The Orion 102/ AT102 flange fits the Orion 102ED, Astro Tech 102ED, WO98 Carbon Fiber tube, Astrotelescopes 102, and Kunming United 102. It is a male 4.006" X 1mm threaded flange. The correct drawtube is the 4.5" travel.

I'm going to remove the existing focuser to check the thread diameter tonight, but any guidance would be much appreciated.

Many thanks,

Ade

Thought that I'd give a quick update to this thread.  Despite fettling the original focuser and improving it dramatically, due to my Starwave 102 f/11 being, in my opinion, slightly under-mounted on the EQ5, I did eventually decide to cough up the cash and get a Moonlite  flange to fit.

Anyone else going down this route, please note that I made an expensive mistake and the flange mentioned above DOES NOT fit the tube. 

I had some further dialogue with Ron and after supplying a couple of thread measurements, and a couple of days looking, Ron came back to me and confirmed that the correct fitting for the Starwave 102 f/11 is the same as for a WO FLT98 / GTF102 / TS 102.

The flange was duly ordered, has been delivered and I'm pleased to report fits like a glove.  The motor focuser will make life so much more bearable splitting those doubles at high magnifications.

This time, I did order from Ron directly as the waiting time for custom Moonlite parts through FLO tends to be quite long. 

However, lesson learned and I would strongly urge anyone going down this route to confirm measurements directly with Ron at Moonlite then send an order through FLO or your preferred UK Moonlite distributor. 

The shipping cost, import duty and Parcelforce ransom holding/admin fee made ordering directly from Moonlite a quicker, but much more expensive option than being patient and ordering through FLO.

Ade

Edited November 20, 2019 by AdeKing