So, you're thinking about having a Pier?

[Jkulin]

Well when we moved to our home 18 years ago, it was new and I was enthusiastic about planting trees, unbeknown to me that I would gain an interest in Astronomy and with 2 great big willows and an assortment of other trees, it means I can't have an observatory, well not without having them all chopped down, which isn't going to happen.

So what I now do is move backwards and forwards all my kit in a warehouse trolley on pneumatic tyres from the front of my garage to the rear patio, it saves my back and creates little noise when packing up at 04:00 in the morning (I'm always conscious of making noise when my neighbours are asleep), however I felt that I could still improve setup and stability by installing a pier, I spent months reading on here about the types and advantages and disadvantages, but no one told me how to convince the missus!!!

Missus actually agreed with very little persuading, so plans started. :-)

I read loads and watched videos and decided that my exposures were unlikely to get longer than 20 minutes because of the light pollution, so I went for a hole 75cm x 75cm x 75cm, this I reckoned was more than adequate, but with 3 slipped discs in my lower back, I didn't relish the thought of digging that hole, in between time I had visited my mate who owns an engineering company and between us we agreed a design and in passing mentioned that he new a builder than could dig the hole and fill it quite cheaply.

Now bear in mind that the cheapest quote I could get for just the concrete being delivered was £180 and then it would have to be barrowed round the back of my home which is about 100ft away, so when the builder popped round and agreed to do it for £140 all in, I jumped at the chance, however he underestimated how much gravel he needed and ended up ordering a further 1/2 ton of which a 1/4 of it was not required but I was lumbered with.

Taking out that amount of soil and the excess gravel is a PITA  unless you have a skip, which I wasn't going to pay another £100 for, so a quick call to the council and they advised that as long as the household waste bin (Not the recycling bin) wasn't too heavy then I could gradually get rid of it in there, it might take a while but I am in no hurry.

One Saturday morning later and the hole is dug, I made some frames that the builder greased so that after it set they could be removed fairly easily, it also allowed for the level to be as perfect as my anxiety would be satisfied with: -

(The green netting in the garden is there because I damaged the grass sowing fertiliser (If that is the proper description) and burnt the grass, so I am letting it recover without my two mad boxers ruining it.)

A point to note, I was very worried about the very sharp corners if my grandchildren fell and hit their head, so a day after the concrete was laid I chipped the corners off so there was less of a hazard.

Now to the pier, I read loads and initially was going to go for the "Rats Nest design" but having watched a video from Astro-Engineering, and having spoken to another mate of mine who is a retired chief engineer for the aeronautical industry, I concluded that as long as the concrete was level, then the mount would take care of any marginal errors with regards to being level.

This video established the type of pier that I wanted, it was going to be fixed except that the top plate will be able to be adjusted with curved slotted holes, see the drawing, I also purchased from Altair Astro their pier adapter for my AZ-EQ6-GT as I figured it would be cheaper to have the proper thing rather than pay out for a car brake disc and have that modified.

As I mentioned my back is not good, so it needed to be higher than the standard one metre, so I opted for 1.2 metre, it would be bolted to the concrete with 16mm studs with proper adhesive glue purchased from fleabay :- http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M16-x-190mm-CHEMICAL-RESIN-FIXING-ANCHOR-PACK-CONCRETE-BRICK-STONE-ZINC-STUDS-/190466805433 it even came with a 16mm masonry drill.

The pier was drawn up as per the following drawing, with a slight modification to allow my big clumsy hands to fit to bolt the mount in place and to allow the adapter plate to align perfectly with Polaris: -

So my mate has made the pier now, the top part has yet to be welded up and the pier fins need welding, a point to note is that this should not be welded in one continuous strip as it can distort and weaken to tube.

With a bit of luck it will be finished this week: -

As to the finish to stop it rusting, I contacted a number of firms to get it galvanised and was advised that as it would be dipped both ends of the tube needing to be open and that the thickness of the galvanising could leave an unwanted build up coating.

So I thought of plastic coating, however having experienced when plastic coating gets damaged and allows metal to fester unchecked, I decided against that, I will purchase some cans of galvanising spray and coat where ever I can, then finish off with red oxide and paint, whatever colour my charming wife wants, my mate @toxophilus on here suggested pink with flowers on it as it wouldn't stand out then :-)

Not sure what the final cost will be as my mate is doing things at mates rates, but he has said he might be tempted to produce more if there was a requirement, let me know if anyone is interested.

I may have purchased a pier that this was based on from Astro Engineering but it appears that their website has gone, not sure if they still trade.

So once it is finished and in place then will post images.

Thanks for listening

[domstar]

Wow, what an undertaking. I'm sure you'll have an excellent set-up.

p.s. Regarding the excess gravel- you could fill secret pouches under your trousers and when you're walking somewhere outside, just pull a string and the gravel will fall down your trouser leg and disperse on the floor.

[Jkulin]

Domstar thanks but I think you have been watching too much of the Great Escape :-) : - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Escape_(film)

[Ouroboros]

Or you could dig a tunnel and bury it in there.

[Ouroboros]

Just out of interest, how high is your pier?  I can't expand the drawings enough to read it. 

[Jkulin]

1 minute ago, Ouroboros said:

Or you could dig a tunnel and bury it in there.

It was bad enough having to ask my wife if I could put a pier up in the middle of the garden, let alone tell her I want to dig a tunnel to accommodate all my mates escaping from her cooking :-)

[Jkulin]

1 minute ago, Ouroboros said:

Just out of interest, how high is your pier?  I can't expand the drawings enough to read it. 

It was in the text, 120cm

HTH

[Ouroboros]

Just now, Jkulin said:

It was in the text, 120cm

HTH

Aha! OK. I missed that.  That's quite high, but then I see you have a Ritchey Chretien which has the eyepiece at the bottom end.

[Jkulin]

Yes and

4 minutes ago, Ouroboros said:

Aha! OK. I missed that.  That's quite high, but then I see you have a Ritchey Chretien which has the eyepiece at the bottom end.

Yes, and I'm not very flexible now with my back, I don't need to look through an eye piece as I now use Astrotortilla for plate solving, it's only in the past when I am having difficulty finding an object that I have put an eye piece in my guide scope.

[Ouroboros]

I look forward to seeing photos of the pier in place. Good project. 

[bottletopburly]

Did you paint your pier yet? i just had mine powdercoated only cost £30 top finish too worth doing rather than hand spraying 

 

[Jkulin]

Yep I gave it two coats of rust inhibitor and then two coats of Hammerite smooth, not a very good finish, but at least it is on and maybe next year I'll look at getting it stripped and coated.

Hopefully first light tomorrow, I'll get some pictures of it upload if it looks promising.

[laser_jock99]

Good pier- not a leveling bolt in sight!!

[fozzybear]

22 hours ago, Jkulin said:

Yep I gave it two coats of rust inhibitor and then two coats of Hammerite smooth, not a very good finish, but at least it is on and maybe next year I'll look at getting it stripped and coated.

Hopefully first light tomorrow, I'll get some pictures of it upload if it looks promising.

if you want to go down the galvanised route, you will have to remove all traces of paint or pay the dippers to strip your pier, as they said the pier has to be open at both ends when dipped if your base plate looking at your picture is welded flush to the tube then you only have to leave a drain hole at the base of the tube 10mm min so excess can escape, I work for a company who fabricate fire sprinkler systems and we send a lot of our stuff for galvanising here in france, so see it every day in stuff we fabricate very annoying but the galvanisers require it. hey ho just thought I would try to help. oh and by the way if you have any threaded parts they will either need to be plugged with paint (over here in france Brun rouge oxide) then a bolt or re tapped afterwards. as the galvanisation will ruin your threads. 

[Jkulin]

Thanks Fozzy, no for now it will do until maybe next year where I'll get it stripped and sorted then.

First light this evening and It was perfectly level and polar alignment took seconds, the top plate is now bolted down and will make future imaging so much quicker.

Shame I coudln't say the same thing about everything else this evening, it went orribly pear shaped, but onwards and upwards, I know where to sort things out.

[Jkulin]

On 10/11/2017 at 22:32, laser_jock99 said:

Good pier- not a levelling bolt in sight!!

Thanks, sorry for the late reply.

It is perfectly level, just taking a little time to build a frame that is perfectly level and overseeing the builder to make sure that it is levelled as per the guide frame, there are opinions as to whether to have make the level adjustable or not, I read loads and came to the conclusion that I should make it as level as I can and if it was a small amount out then I could pack some small plates under the base, but in the end it wasn't necessary and polar alignment with the polemaster was perfect, Happy Days :-)

[Jkulin]

Here is the pier in situ, all painted up, my wife wants me to tile the top of the concrete, so I suppose that is the least I can do and will only take a morning (famous last words). Note the grass seeds that I sowed are finally shooting up.

I'll get one of everything set up if we ever get a clear night.

[Jkulin]

Well I promised some photos of the setup after everything was fitted and finished, the artificial grass is there to stop my chewing up the grass when it is wet, the portaloo tent works perfect to keep the dew off my laptop.

Cables even though I have switched over to using a rig runner are still a pain, as the focuser has three cables running to it, then two for the Cameras and FW and another three for power feeds, but at least it is now safe with the two 12v Nevada PSU's safely on a shelf in the lean to shed.

I'll have another go tiding the cables when I change the ED80 over to the new Esprit 100, it is not so crammed when I use the RC, but at least there is less chance of it catching now.

The pier is absolutely perfect, there is nothing that I would change apart from my painting, height is perfect and it just doesn't/can't move.

[groberts]

Just came across this thread - looks very good, well done - something I'm toying with myself.

• I presume you run an electric cable down the garden for power?
• Have you considered operating back near the house or even in it where it's more comfortable via USB leads or wireless?
• Most importantly, how did you convince the wife + do you disguise or cover up the rig when not in use?

Thanks, Graham  

[Jkulin]

Thanks Graham.

I have a lean to type shed at the side of the house which I have run mains and a dual network point to, I have then put a shelf which houses an 8A Nevada PSU and a Nevada 25-30A PSU, I then run three cables out to the pier, 2 x 25A 12v dual core rubberised cables and one rubberised Network cable, the 8A supply solely powers my laptop, although it could do with a bit more and the 25-30A PSU runs everything else with loads to spare.

After polar alignment I then operate the whole lot from my study about 100ft away in the warmth of my Study using TightVNC.

I could not put it any nearer to my home as it would block out most of the N, NE skies not to mention Polaris, but it isn't a problem as I can operate quite happily from here, when everything is operating correctly.

I have a large warehouse trolley with sides that I now store in the shed apart from the scopes/cameras which I keep in the garage.

Nothing stays on the pier when not imaging, in fact I timed things this afternoon and it took just 20 minutes to set everything up and on Wednesday night 15 minutes to pack everything up.

As for my missus, she had an easy choice, an obsy in the middle of the garden and I assured her it would be 10 x 12 or a thin green post in the middle, I have however agreed to tile the top of the concrete as a favour for her :-)

[groberts]

Thanks John, very interesting. 

What is the network cable you are using? Most of my stuff is via USB and I'm concerned about the signals over such a length, which would be about 25 metres.  

Looks like a clear night, hope the sames true where you are. Good Luck.

Graham

 

  

[Jkulin]

Thanks Graham, yep clear just having some issues with plate solving at the mo.

The cable is bog standard Cat 5, I can look up later where I bought it from if it helps?

[groberts]

Thanks would be interested to know when you get a chance + what hub you you use / is it powered? 

Hope you got the problem sorted? 

[Jkulin]

4 minutes ago, groberts said:

Thanks would be interested to know when you get a chance. 

Hope you got the problem sorted? 

Just found it, I ordered from Cable Monkey https://www.cablemonkey.co.uk, the product was Code 003-3nb4-200-05C / Cat5e UTP RJ45 Booted PVC Patch Lead - Colour : Red, Length : 20m and it was only £8.50

I usually make my own cables up, but I preferred the connections on these ones as they are quick to release with cold fingers and the cable wasn't stiff leaving it coiled up in the garden making it a hazard for the dogs or even my wife.

http://www.cablemonkey.co.uk/rj45-network-cables/9214-snagless-booted-cat5e-rj45-patch-cables.html

And no still can't get the plate solving to sort, really stumped.

[groberts]

Thanks John, much appreciated.

Sorry to hear the problem's not sorted, good luck.