Takahashi TOE are coming

[Piero]

Takahashi has recently released this new eyepiece, TOE. Considering the focal lengths, it seems a replacement of the Takahashi HI-LE and an almost complement to the Vixen HR (for reference 1.6mm, 2.0mm, 2.4mm; design: 5:3; 42 deg).

 

The TOE have the following specs:

- Focal lengths: 2.5mm, 3.3mm, and 4.0mm.

- AFOV: 52 deg

- Eye relief: 10mm

- Strehl ratio: >98%

- Design: 6:4

- Weight: 140g (4mm and 3.3mm) and 145g (2.5mm)

 

It is now sold in Japan and the US. 

[John]

Interesting - I think I saw somewhere that they will cost around £200 or so apiece ?

 

[Piero]

Precisely the cost without customs and VAT : ¥29,000  ~ £200  (at today's currency exchange rate).

Source http://www.takahashijapan.com/ct-news/news_topics/newst_170605_toe.html  
 

[Floater]

Just some clarification for a student trying to learn, please. Are these focal lengths aimed at imagers, rather than visual observers?

Because 2.5mm is something I can barley imagine ever getting the chance to use. ?? My 3-6 zoom has a quiet life ... ?

[Piero]

6 minutes ago, Floater said:

Just some clarification for a student trying to learn, please. Are these focal lengths aimed at imagers, rather than visual observers?

Because 2.5mm is something I can barley imagine ever getting the chance to use. ?? My 3-6 zoom has a quiet life ... ?

It depends on f-ratio, focal length, seeing, and telescope optics, I feel.

On my TV60 I regularly use my Vixen HR 2.4mm. That gives 150x which is reasonably within normal UK seeing. I also used it with my 8" dob in Italy (500x), but the seeing over there is often very good and steady for many days consecutively.  

[John]

They are aimed at folks who use high and very high magnifications for visual observing. My 2-4 zoom gets much more use than I thought it would in my Tak 100 and Skywatcher ED120. Most of the time in the 3mm-4mm range though, it has to be said.

 

[Floater]

I had a horrible suspicion that these answers might come. 

Y'see, I am just unable to achieve those magnifications. I may (and hope I do) hit a magical night in a dark sky location but, generally, from my back garden the conditions - seeing, turbulence, pollution, whatever - have ruled out any useful observation at such high mags. ???

[John]

I would have thought that your TV refractors would do well at high magnifications, on the right targets such as double stars, Saturn, Mars and the moon

 

[Floater]

1 minute ago, John said:

I would have thought that your TV refractors would do well at high magnifications, on the right targets such as double stars, Saturn, Mars and the moon

 

I live in hope that they will, John. And without hope, we are lost.

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, Piero said:

The TOE have the following specs:

Could you please try one first so I don't have to?

[Piero]

6 hours ago, jetstream said:

Could you please try one first so I don't have to?

I am interested in a ~3.5mm. However this is a bit less urgent now that the tak is coming and I have a more robust focuser to use than the TV60 one. I have a ~3.6mm with the Zeiss zoom + barlow 2x. 

On the other hand, will this line be on par with the Vixen HR? There will be reviews about this soon. I'll wait.

[Moonshane]

When using very high mags you rarely get a constant super steady image. So bear in mind that using these high powers the sharpness usually comes and goes so patience is needed even with high end scopes.

[John]

I will certainly be waiting for reviews on these before taking any serious interest. Tak produce wonderful scopes but their eyepieces have been somewhat mixed over the years, given their cost, I feel

 

[jabeoo1]

2 hours ago, John said:

I will certainly be waiting for reviews on these before taking any serious interest. Tak produce wonderful scopes but their eyepieces have been somewhat mixed over the years, given their cost, I feel

 

I agree, I found the LE range gave me the most undesirable views to date.  I held onto them for about a week.  Very disappointed.  That said these new ones may have no resemblance to the LE's

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, Piero said:

However this is a bit less urgent now that the tak is coming

I think it is more urgent now that you have a Tak that will take super high mag! Seriously, I was using then 90mm the other night and while the 3-6NZ is VG in this scope an HR2 like eyepiece in the ~3.3mm focal range would have been nice to have. I typically don't use the Zeiss in my refractors much- a personal thing really- the length and weight kind of bother me...

The view of Saturn in the 90mm/3-6 NZ was much much better than a small scope should give though.

[Piero]

39 minutes ago, jetstream said:

I think it is more urgent now that you have a Tak that will take super high mag! Seriously, I was using then 90mm the other night and while the 3-6NZ is VG in this scope an HR2 like eyepiece in the ~3.3mm focal range would have been nice to have. I typically don't use the Zeiss in my refractors much- a personal thing really- the length and weight kind of bother me...

The view of Saturn in the 90mm/3-6 NZ was much much better than a small scope should give though.

Well, I don't buy gear randomly, but only after making sure that there is a real benefit with it (assuming costs are acceptable of course). A ~3.5mm HR would be on my wish list. As far as I know Vixen bought the Pentax XO patent. If so, that could explain why the HR 2.4mm is so close (basically indistinguishable optically) with the Pentax XO 2.5mm as stated by CN members owning both. There is no review about this new Tak TOE as far as I know.

Congratulations for the views Gerry! Under very good seeing, Saturn can leave lovely memories! 

[John]

1 hour ago, Piero said:

.... As far as I know Vixen bought the Pentax XO patent. If so, that could explain why the HR 2.4mm is so close (basically indistinguishable optically) with the Pentax XO 2.5mm as stated by CN ....

Thats a very interesting nugget of information. I wish Vixen would hurry up with their version of the XO 5mm - getting hold of the Pentax version is practically impossible and even when they do come up the cost seems to be in the £400 range

Edit: Of course Vixen now produce what looks like an ex-Pentax design in this scope:

https://www.vixenoptics.com/Vixen-VSD-100mm-f-3-8-Astrograph-p/26145.htm

Perhaps Vixen will take on other Pentax astro designs if Ricoh are not interested in the astro market ?

[F15Rules]

46 minutes ago, jabeoo1 said:

I agree, I found the LE range gave me the most undesirable views to date.  I held onto them for about a week.  Very disappointed.  That said these new ones may have no resemblance to the LE's

It's funny how our experiences can vary: I have only good things to say about the Tak LE range (apart from their inflated price new). I have the HI-LE 3.6mm, the LE 7.5mm and used to have the LE18mm. I found all of them to be excellent, both in optics and build.

If the new TOE range are even better, I'll be very interested in reading reviews.

My Taks are regularly used with Pentax and Vixen LVW EPs and hold up very well, apart from obviously having a much narrower field- which is pin sharp across the field in my Tak and Vixen refractors .

Dave

[jetstream]

My 12.5mm Tak LE offers nice contrast and eyerelief, but falls short a bit in direct comparison to some other eyepieces in on axis sharpness- actually some "selected" very good copies of orthos and a couple of the other EP's. LE's have a good following thats for sure.

[John]

I've assumed that Takahashi make their scopes "in house" with Canon Ioptron supplying the objectives, and outsource eyepiece production to 3rd parties with Tak doing the final quality control. Does that sound right ?

 

[Piero]

3 hours ago, John said:

I've assumed that Takahashi make their scopes "in house" with Canon Ioptron supplying the objectives, and outsource eyepiece production to 3rd parties with Tak doing the final quality control. Does that sound right ?

I heard about the involvement of Canon (which apparently also provides optics for Borg (I think!)), but I don't know about the eyepiece outsourcing.   

[Piero]

>> [quoting myself! ]: I am interested in a ~3.5mm. However this is a bit less urgent now that the tak is coming and I have a more robust focuser to use than the TV60 one. I have a ~3.6mm with the Zeiss zoom + barlow 2x. 

 

 

Actually, thinking about Tak 3.3mm or HR 3.5mm a bit more, I am not getting any of them. I forgot I have a Zeiss barlow now.  Adding a 40mm spacer which I have, that barlow becomes 2.6x, so also the Nikon zoom can work as a 3.5mm at high power!

[marcus_z]

7 hours ago, Piero said:

Well, I don't buy gear randomly, but only after making sure that there is a real benefit with it (assuming costs are acceptable of course). A ~3.5mm HR would be on my wish list. As far as I know Vixen bought the Pentax XO patent. If so, that could explain why the HR 2.4mm is so close (basically indistinguishable optically) with the Pentax XO 2.5mm as stated by CN members owning both. There is no review about this new Tak TOE as far as I know.

Congratulations for the views Gerry! Under very good seeing, Saturn can leave lovely memories! 

The Vixen HR and the Pentax XO have different designs, but have very good reviews. However, the HR 2.4 features is a larger eye relief of 10mm.

[Piero]

47 minutes ago, marcus_z said:

The Vixen HR and the Pentax XO have different designs, but have very good reviews. However, the HR 2.4 features is a larger eye relief of 10mm.

You are right, they do have different designs. Optically very close according to people owning both. I haven't tested this personally, but to me the quality of that eyepiece is just superb. 

[John]

The latest feedback on another forum suggests that the new Tak's might a touch better even than the Vixen HR's:

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/575959-new-takahashi-eyepieces/?p=8026214

The screen printing on the eyepiece barrels comes in for some flack though .......

Waiting for the BillP review here