Ethos21/Panoptic24&bino comparison

[alanjgreen]

Ethos21/Panoptic24&bino comparison

Having purchased an Ethos21 in the last Televue sale, I have been solely using that eyepiece on the cold Jan/Feb nights as I have a 2" eyepiece heater tape and if I dont change eyepieces then I can keep my nice thick gloves on.
However, my Baader MarkV binoviewer has been calling to me when I see it sitting in its case with the various eyepiece pairs.
I have been really enjoying the Ethos21 since I got it. The 100 degree view is hard to step away from once you have experienced it but the comfort of two eye viewing should not be underrated!

This week I had the first forcast multi-hour clear spell with the temperatures not too low. So I decided the MarkV was coming out to play...

I had been wanting to do a comparison of cyclops and binoviewer before we get deep into galaxy season so I could determine my weapon of choice for the galaxy sessions to come.

Scope used: CPC1100
Eyepieces used: Ethos21 (cyclops, single eye mode), Baader MarkV binoviewer and pair of Televue Panoptic24 (two eye mode)

Target: M51 Whirlpool
The first target was M51, high at the zenith. First up were the Panoptic pairing. M51 was big and bright, the dark areas between the dust lanes were nice & black. The lanes looked like two shimmering circles. NGC5195 was bright with both a core and surrounding gas. The bridge was not to be seen.
I quickly remembered how comfortable two eye viewing is and love the way you can "stay" at the eyepiece for as long as you like. Yes, I did miss my binos over the last 2 months.
Swap in the Ethos21. No change in size of the galaxy was noticed. (The binos do cause extra magnification on an SCT as you rack the mirror in for focus.) The dark areas were just as dark. The shimmering circles were still shimmering circles. I was struggling to see any real difference between the two views.

Verdict: score draw

 

Target: M101 Pinwheel
After a good time with each eyepiece, it was clear that the Ethos21 had edged out the binos on this target. Both showed three blotchy areas within the outer galaxy, presumably clumpy groups of stars. But the dark areas between the lanes were more defined with the Ethos enabling me to trace out some basic arm shapes more easily.

Verdict: Ethos 1-0

 

Target: M81 Bode's galaxy
This was another well matched contest. The galaxy was big and bright (brighter than on many occasions, it can rival M82 when it is this bright!). I was struggling to pull anything extra out with the Ethos. The galaxy was equally great with one or two eyes. I centred the nearby double double and played with the focus. The tight double is only splittable at this magnification on "good" nights.
The Panoptic24 split them both easily and with a little fine focus the ethos achieved the same result.

Verdict: score draw

 

Target: Jupiter & GRS!
My final target for the comparison was Jupiter. I had noted the GRS transit times and the time was right! Ethos21 up first. I really struggled to settle my eye to the eyepiece, the planet was so bright that I was being blinded!
I fitted the Baader Neodymium Filter to the diagonal and tried again. (I like this filter on Jupiter, it dims the view and brings out the blues in the clouds). This time I could get my eye settled. When I had the moons focused then I fine focused on the planet and there was the GRS (first time this year). The colours on the planet were not the same as last year, the GRS was more of an orange spot and the band colours seemed different to what I was expecting based on my memories from last year. The outer edges of the planet were in hairdryer fuzzy mode but the planet was showing detail well! (at last!, its been a poor year for Jupiter viewing so far )
I swapped to the Panoptic24 pair. The view was instantly better and much easier to digest. I had found the brightness of the planet forcing me to pull away from the eyepiece in cyclops mode. Now, I could settle and more fine lines in the cloud system started to be noticed. The lovely blue structure in the banding popped out and it turned into a lovely view at quite low magnification.
I would be interested to hear if anyone else thinks the colour tones have changed from last year as for me it seemed very noticeably different?

Verdict: Panoptic24 pair 1-0

Final Summary: I am happy with the overall results as it confirms what I was expecting. The Ethos21 really is a great eyepiece, comfortable to use on DSO and the 100 degree experience is not to be underestimated. The little bit of light loss with the binos did make a difference to the end view on the larger galaxies there for us to view. The panoptics really are good on tight stars and excellent at splitting doubles. They held their ground against the Ethos on the DSO and with very good results. On the planets, the binos won out easily, you really need to study them before the fine detail is noticed by your eye. With two eyes your brain is on and working with you which is a real advantage on the brighter objects.
I didn't want the Ethos to kick my other kit out to graze so I am happy in the knowledge that there is a place for cyclops & binoviewing. I look forward to repeating the comparison with the 20" as there will be no shortage of light coming into the binos on these same objects and I may be able to afford the tradeoff of light loss against eye comfort, we will see... Until then, the Ethos21 will be the tool of choice for galaxy season and I will sit at the eyepiece knowing that I am seeing all that can be seen!

Any comments appreciated,
Alan

 

[Stu]

A very well written and balanced review Alan, a good read

Your findings are interesting, but they don't necessarily match my experiences. That is not to say you are wrong of course, just that I think different people react differently to binoviewers.

I love my binoviewers for solar observing, and find that I see far more detail in a much more relaxed manner.

They also work very well for me on the moon, but I still struggle with planetary observing. I use Baader Zeiss Mark IV binoviewers with Zeiss orthos, plus an AP Barcon to get the power up when needed. The quality on solar and lunar observing is plain to see, but when I use them on Jupiter for instance, I find the view more colourful but the detail is somehow more smoothed out. It is not an unpleasant view, but I just don't seem to see the same detail as with cyclops.

I will persevere with them, not having had much planetary viewing recently. I'll use them both in the Tak and C925.

Glad your kit is working out for you  

[John]

Excellent report Alan

I'm relieved to read your findings in many ways because I've tried binoviewers a few times and not got on with them wheras I find my Ethos 21 absolutely superb for DSO hunting. I tend to use shorter length Ethos and Pentax XW's for planetary observing but my scopes are shorter focal lengths.

I suspect the Ethos 21 will excell in a 20" dob (with a Paracorr) as well, having tried mine in one not so long ago

 

[Paul73]

Great writeup.

I've just been using the 24mm Panoptic and wedge on the sun. What lovely little eyepieces they are! I'm steadfastly cycloptic in my viewing tastes (think that I may have made up a word there. Sorry). This is purely on the grounds of finance and a love of chunky eyepieces. But, even without the Bino dimension, I would happily have both E21 and Pan 24 in my case. They do a similar job in such different, but pleasing ways.

Paul

[jetstream]

Great report!

I just happened to have the binos out too No Jupiter though, just a nice DSO session. Using the Binotrons/32TV plossl/powerswitch provided a great view of M42 and some galaxies. I find brighter DSO can be enhanced by binos, such as M51,M81,M82, Leo Triplet etc. The Owls eyes were staring at me last night in UMA lol! 4 out of 5 galaxies in UMA seen previoulsy using the 10BCO were seen, not too bad.

With my setup M51 spirals are excellent, I'd say better than mono, bridge showing and some bright patches in the arms glowing. Same goes M81/M82 etc. And then there was the Flame nebula-superb!

Personally I'll take the binos on many bright DSO and I think your binos will love the 20" Alan, they seem to love aperture IMHO.

[David Levi]

Excellent report. There seems to have been a lot of mention of binoviewers on the website recently. I'd like to try one someday but haven't seen anyone out with them in my limited experience of sessions with my local astronomical society. Does an eye patch help with comfort for single eyepiece viewing?

[alanjgreen]

5 minutes ago, David Levi said:

 Does an eye patch help with comfort for single eyepiece viewing?

I'll ask Anne Bonny (Pirate)

I've never tried that. I normally just end up with a finger on the "other" eye holding it closed.

[niallk]

Great comparative report on a very interesting subject - thanks for posting!

I've only dabbled at comparing binoviewers vs cyclops in my scopes: my EP collection is definitely geared towards cyclops for DSOs & basically everything bar select solar system targets.

I definitely prefer BVing on sun, moon, Jupiter, Saturn and Mars in my 10", though I've essentially only one mag option available to me.  It didn't compare favourably on galaxies in my 10" vs mono viewing I found.  I think I'm getting some vignetting when I use my bvs with a powermate instead of my GPC in my 15" to achieve focus - ok on planets, but mono in the 15" has given me my best ever Saturn, Jupiter and Mars.

I use two TV 15mm plossls in my BV.  I've a single Pan24, and it is a beautiful EP, though I've now acquired a 17E which has displaced it: same tfov with 40% higher magnification.

[laservet]

Something to try when monoviewing. When I worked in a microscopy lab with mono microscopes eight hours a day, where scrunching one eye shut resulted in a screaming headache after a few hours, we observed mono with both eyes open and learned to ignore the image in the nonobserving eye. After a little practice one can make the image from the nonobserving eye fade to black even in a well lit area. It's much easier at night with a telescope.