Table top Dob

[Okeydokey]

Both my children have taken a bit of a liking to the sky at night, I love the idea of something like the Edmund Astroscan for a Christmas present they could share, anyone have any advice or opion on these things?  For what ever reason I have never taken to the Celestron range of products, so any alternative options would be appreciated.
Many thanks

[hobsey]

I think the Heritage 130 is going to be massively recommended on this topic as a good table top dob.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Both my children have taken a bit of a liking to the sky at night, I love the idea of something like the Edmund Astroscan for a Christmas present they could share, anyone have any advice or opion on these things?  For what ever reason I have never taken to the Celestron range of products, so any alternative options would be appreciated.

Many thanks

I personally have never heard of it before, but reading the optical specs:

The Astroscan is a simple Newtonian reflector. It has a 4⅛" clear-inch (105mm) diameter f/4.2 aluminized and overcoated borosilicate glassparabolic primary mirror with a focal length of 17½ inches (445mm).

It really doesnt seem too bad. I dont know the cost etc or how old your kids are.

The Skywatcher Heritage 130P really is about the best "table top" Dob on both value for money and performance. To be honest, it doesnt even need to be on a table. Its usable when sat on the ground and used from a seated position.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-heritage-130p-flextube.html

[Schorhr]

Two firstscopes or a Heritage 130p.

More aperture will alow higher magnifications on planets and 5" starts to show nebulae and galaxies quite well.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Aperture is king.

[Joseki]

Skywatcher infinity 76P http://www.green-witch.com/acatalog/Starter_Scopes.html if you love or need the mount design (really young children?), or the Heritage 130P if you want the extra aperture.  I don't think I could pay the 200-300 pounds ebay prices for the Edmund Astroscan, though it is pretty nice.

[Okeydokey]

Many thanks every one.  The Heritage-90 Virtuoso looks like a really good fit and at £200 should be good value for money.  Thanks for the link Joseki, I have never owned or tried to polar aligned an alt-az, any ideas if this is difficult or might be a bit of a burden for a 9 year girl and 14 year boy?

[Schorhr]

Hello,

the virtuoso is more difficult to use then the 130p, has less aperture and does not provide the wide field views the heritage 130p - basically you waste all money on tracking, and at 150-200x, even kids can do that on a dobsonian ;-)

Just get the 130p and a 6mm wide angle eyepiece for 27gbp.

If you favor GoTo you could get the nexstar SLT with a small refractor, but both planets and deepsky are much more fun on 130mm aperure.

[rory]

Many thanks every one.  The Heritage-90 Virtuoso looks like a really good fit and at £200 should be good value for money.  Thanks for the link Joseki, I have never owned or tried to polar aligned an alt-az, any ideas if this is difficult or might be a bit of a burden for a 9 year girl and 14 year boy?

you actually don't polar align  a alt/az mount. you can polar align a equatorial type mount ,and if its for observing you can simply set the angle of your location (roughly) and point the axis of the mount toward polaris ( again roughly) . its when you want to take long exposures with cameras that you need to get a very good understanding of polar aligning.

 as above I don't think for visual youll get better value than that of the 130 heritage.

hth.

[Okeydokey]

Thanks again, another rethink required.  If I may ask concerning the limitations of the 130P is it worth puting a good quality EP at 6mm for the wide angle view on it, or is that like putting lipstick on a pig?   My budget was set at £200, the scope looks to cost around half that.  I guess a barlow would also be of use,  but a wider angle EP I feel would appeal to my siblings!

[Schorhr]

Hi :-)

The Heritage 130p mirrors quality fluctuate, but 6mm/108x is no trouble at all, 150/160x should not be either.

I have used both 200x and 260x on mine, and it's acceptable (stunning on moon, on very good seeing conditions Saturn was amazing).

A decent budget solution:

Heritage 130p + 6mm

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/wide-angle-eyepiece-1-25inches-66-degree-F-6mm-/140717462903?pt=UK_Telescope_Eyepieces&hash=item20c36a1577

and

an achromatic 2x barlow lens are a great combination for a low budget.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/achrom-Barlow-Linse-1-25-Kunststoff-fur-Einsteiger-Teleskop-2BLK-/390658420139?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_16&hash=item5af50e6dab

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Achromatische-Barlow-Linse-BA2-2x-fur-Teleskope-31-7mm-/200607942106?pt=DE_Foto_Camcorder_Okulare&hash=item2eb52a45da

There is a zoom barlow but I'd say fixed eyepieces are a better deal as the quality is better.

Overall these cheaper barlows (while better then the plastic lens ones) do show some chromatic aberations / color seams.

5 or 4mm TMB HR-Planetary / BST Explorer would be the best but a bit more expensive then the 66degree wide angle eyepieces.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/Telescopes-Binoculars-/28179/i.html?_stpos=&LH_BIN=1&_sop=15&_fcid=77&gbr=1&_localstpos=24109&_clu=2&_mPrRngCbx=1&_from=R40&_nkw=(4%2C5)+mm+(bst%2Ctmb)&rt=nc&LH_PrefLoc=3

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A 30mm (15gbp) 32mm Plössl (20-30gbp) will also give about the maximum field on 1.25" focusers, but the included 25mm eyepiece is decent enough for starters, though shows a little less field.

I will receive the el-cheapo zoom eyepiece (18gbp) tomorrow or so, if you're interested I'll report back on how it performs on the heritage 130p compared to the stock eyepieces, and if the cheap 2x can be combined with it without being blinded :-)

[AlexB67]

At  a cheap price, the 6mm UWA sky-watcher works well with this scope. Of course it is a question of you get what you pay for but at less than < 30 pounds, 66 degrees I like it .. a lot. On the 130p some excellent views of planets and even M13 reveals a remarkable amount of detail, not to forget the moon.

To put it in context, the stock 10mm eyepiece with a sky-watcher barlow at 2x gives slightly higher mag, but the 6mm UWA performs better in terms of revealing detail and a better image. Just my opinion, but a cheap barlow with the stock 10mm is not so good, and even the cheaper modest eyepieces at 5-6 mm will easily outperform that. 

[Schorhr]

not to forget the moon.

Indeed, you haven't really seen the moon if you haven't seen it WHOLE at 108x in a wide angle eyepiece ;-)

[Okeydokey]

Can I extend this slightly then... if I were to buy them a good quality EP like the Baader Hyperion 68 degree at 5mm or 8mm would this be wasted on the 130P (If it were I could always use it on my refractor?)   Whilst it would techinically be theirs, they do have to go to bed at night after all  .

Unfortunately my wife can see through my schemes so it would have to be a good match universally

[Schorhr]

Of course another eyepiece would work like a charm on the Heritage, but that's really a bit overkill on the Heritage ;-)

On a longer focal ratio the 66deg eyepieces work well too.

On f/5 I hear some of the Explore Scientific 82° perform better then the Hyperion while (the lower focal length ones are) similar priced, but perhaps someone else can confirm this.

A cheaper eyepiece has the advantage of no-tears when little fingerprints are spreaded all over the lens :-)

That's one reason I ordered http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/199738-cheap-but-good-zoom-eyepiece/ (as I work with kids), but of course nothing beats a good eyepiece...

[Schorhr]

Unfortunately my wife can see through my schemes so it would have to be a good match universally

So the heritage is essentially just an eyepiece accessory?

[Okeydokey]

I have heard else where that the Sebens excel at economical zoom eyepieces.  Will need to give that some thought.  Many thanks

[Schorhr]

Be aware though that they have three different zoom eyepieces. Even in the other thread people confuse that the discussion is about the cheaper version.

The 50€ version is O.K. for the price, but two to three fixed eyepieces will be a better choice. But for kids the cheaper version would be a nice way to go...

[Okeydokey]

I think the Wide FOV would be best and can't find details of that for the Seben, may have to settle for something more determined, and let the collection grow. So probably going back to the 'wide FOV is best' world view.  Quite tempted by the 9 mm 72 apparent FOV from Williams Optics SWAN range.  At £59.00 is easily within budget.

[Okeydokey]

I think the Wide FOV would be the highest priority and best for the young ones.  Sort of back to the drawing board but  I am absolutley sure the Heritage 130 is the right scope them, the budget now has £70 left in it for an EP. 

EP &  Barlow is how I would potentially spend that, and not a budget zoom.  My own experience of observing doesn't rely on changing EP's very often, I'm more of a browser/spotter though.  The devil is in the detail, without a doubt.

[Schorhr]

Indeed, if it's in the budget, a 66deg uwa or BST Explorer / TMB would be a much better choice.

Though the stock eyepieces are usable for starters.