Access to classified ads

[robhatherton]

Hi

I think it is a pity a relative newcomer has to have 50 posts before being able to access classified adverts.

I have been a member for a few months now. I look at the forum, mainly to learn, but don't that often feel I have a lot to contribute or ask about - perhaps because I will search previous posts carefully before asking a question.

Is it helpful then, to deny access to adverts to someone who has recently joined and may well be in the market for new equipment or to restrict the potential audience and chance for established members to sell on when they upgrade.

I'm puzzled; is it a security issue?

Rob

[Bizibilder]

Basically it is due to some folk joining solely to buy and sell without any input into the forum. It shouldnt take long to get to 50 posts if you participate. If you simply want to buy and sell there are many sites on the web that will allow you to do just that.

Feel free to ask questions - after all the only daft question is the one that is not asked!!

[Digz]

Any genuine member wishing to participate in the forum will quickly get the required posts, even if you think you have nothing to participate.

[Russty]

oops maths never was my strong point lol 84 posts to go. How many posts before you can edit your own posts?

[nephilim]

oops maths never was my strong point lol 84 posts to go. How many posts before you can edit your own posts?

250.....only 83 to go mate

[Russty]

250.....only 83 to go mate

Doh!

[Kai]

oops maths never was my strong point lol 84 posts to go. How many posts before you can edit your own posts?

Unless of course the Mods suspect people of post farming to increase their count , in which case we will reduce the amount of posts by the same amount

[Steve Ward]

And double posts don't count ...

[robhatherton]

Any genuine member wishing to participate in the forum will quickly get the required posts, even if you think you have nothing to participate.

Sorry, Lee, I think I get your point. Obviously you are coming from the point of view of over 3000 posts. Let me assure you I am a perfectly genuine member. I have been a founder member of a certain music forum forum for more than 15 years but will not be approaching so many posts! I am sure you do not intend to sound patronising. I 'll just have to go back to ebay!

[RikM]

Sorry, Lee, I think I get your point. Obviously you are coming from the point of view of over 3000 posts. Let me assure you I am a perfectly genuine member. I have been a founder member of a certain music forum forum for more than 15 years but will not be approaching so many posts! I am sure you do not intend to sound patronising. I 'll just have to go back to ebay!

Sorry to hear that you feel that way, but SGL is an astronomy forum, not a market place. UK Astro buy & sell is probably a better bet than ebay and most SGL classifieds are listed on UKAB&S as well anyway

[robhatherton]

Hi Rik

Don't get me wrong; I came here to learn 4 or 5 months ago, certainly not looking for a market place! But after a period of time when I am looking to upgrade my scope, I don't think it's an unreasonable wish to be able to look at classified ads. I entirely take the point about being not able to place adverts. Those Stargazing programmes on the BBc must have brought in a lot of new members to the forum who at some stage will be looking to purchase and I would have thought it also benefits your established members.

Any way, if we carry on this debate I could soon be up to 50 posts!

[Digz]

It's a shame really as in those 5 months it would have equated to 10 posts a month or roughly 1 every 3 days and there wouldn't be this debate......

[knobby]

I can see all the points of view have their own validity / merits... But a forum rule is a forum rule

Here's a scenario for you...

A member (A) has been on here forever and helped countless people in a brilliant / friendly manner is looking for say for arguments sake a certain type of plossl.

A member ( joins today, contributes nothing to the forum but just happens to be after the same plossl.

Member (A) misses the plossl because he is diligently helping someone out with their collimation problems or maybe moderating the forum.

Member ( snaps up said plossl

Just my 2p worth

[Strath]

I have also thought that this restriction was a bit severe but I can totally understand the reasons. I also used to admin a games site and had the view that the rules we set, which were not liked by others, were our rules. I used to equate it to visiting someone's home; their place, their rules. It is all about fitting in and there are plenty of alternatives if the rules don't suit. I know this also sounds a bit severe too but it is pretty accurate for life in general.

[brantuk]

SGL is really a place where enthusiastic amateurs can hang out and discuss astronomy. As part of that a new member gets the opportunity to ask questions about their potential scope purchase and receive good, polite, friendly, and informative guidance on what to choose - totally for free. A by product of it all is that members sometimes want to swop or sell a bit of kit, or a whole setup, amongst themselves.

The classifieds section isn't really "general classifieds" in the same sense as newspapers, ebay, or astro buy/sell. Here you get genuine descriptions reasonable pricing, and a higher quality that you don't always see on public sales sites. You're also very well protected from scammers, traders, and con artists. Part of that protection involves ensuring that new members want to be part of a community in which they wish to participate and contribute - hence the post count to monitor that level of interest.

Whether it's fair or practical for a newbie isn't really the issue - but the benefits of joining in with a welcoming and friendly and informed community, imho, far outweigh the disadvantages of none participation.

[Carbon Brush]

Hi Rob.

I could sign up here with a false identity and try to scam you all by selling non existent astro kit.

But the time & post rules mean I will probably do it elsewhere.

Besides which In the time, and by the views on my posts, I would probably get discovered.

For buying kit here. As one of these 'buy it cheap and sell for more' people who trade scopes & kit more often than some people change their socks, the restrictions on here would make me stand out as an unregistered dealer.

On the bay, there is lots of junk on sale for daft (high) prices.

There are obvious scams that many of us report and they don't get acted upon.

On UK ABS you can buy and sell immediately.

A number of users & the webmaster are always on the lookout for the scammers.

They are not as rare as you might think, but most are spotted and banned before they can do harm.

A glance at how many items bought/sold and length of membership are a good guide for anything of interest.

This forum is well worth sticking with. I have met many friends, received good advice and bought 'honest' used kit.

I have also offered advice where I can and sold kit for sensible prices with, (I hope) honest descriptions.

Hope this helps you to stay with us.

David.

[foundaplanet]

I once bought a scope of the older version. The chap was very keen to post it to me even though I was happy to go and collect it. He had told me that he had a case somewhere and would find it for when I arrived. I arrived to find he had not found the box which I found odd as he was very well organised. A couple of weeks later I had a mail saying that he had found the box and if I sent him my address he would happily post it on to me. I found this a little strange really as right from the off he seemed keen to know my address. Now I am not making any accusations but it did make me wonder some. Needless to say I did not bother with having the box sent to me.

I was not happy really and it left me feeling uncomfortable about SGL in some ways which was a shame as it kind of felt a bit scruffy. This feeling was a total contradiction to the principles of the admin staff and mods along with the better part of the community. There was no doubt in my mind that this chap was a trader and did not care at all for the integrity of SGL.

SGL has become a far more peaceful place since the introduction of the new access rules and is better for it. We now have a first class forum doing what it is good at. It does not take intense participation to reach 50 posts, you only need to join in a little and ask a couple of questions which is what the forum is here for.

[robhatherton]

Well in my first post I said (of your access rules): 'I'm puzzled. Is it a security issue?' Also I could see the reason for the selling rule and now it's explained I understand the buying rule too.

Nor am I implying that the rules are unfair or asking for them to be changed. I suppose I was a little stung by the (maybe accidental) implication that I might somehow not be a 'genuine member' because I don't post every few days. Also in saying, with a smile, I would have to go back to ebay, I simply meant to widen my choices for buying. I wasn't suggesting I felt I needed to leave the forum!

Anyway, today I have ordered (dare I say from a camera and telescope store who have started some months ago to trade on ebay) a new Omni XLT 120 refractor for what seemed a competitive price of more than £50 less than I could see it advertised anywhere else. (I'm not mentioning the actual price in case you don't do that!) and hope to post some first light impressions soon.

That may be more enthusiastic than interesting as I only have my Travelscope 70 to compare it with!

[rowan46]

Well in my first post I said (of your access rules): 'I'm puzzled. Is it a security issue?' Also I could see the reason for the selling rule and now it's explained I understand the buying rule too.

Nor am I implying that the rules are unfair or asking for them to be changed. I suppose I was a little stung by the (maybe accidental) implication that I might somehow not be a 'genuine member' because I don't post every few days. Also in saying, with a smile, I would have to go back to ebay, I simply meant to widen my choices for buying. I wasn't suggesting I felt I needed to leave the forum!

Anyway, today I have ordered (dare I say from a camera and telescope store who have started some months ago to trade on ebay) a new Omni XLT 120 refractor for what seemed a competitive price of more than £50 less than I could see it advertised anywhere else. (I'm not mentioning the actual price in case you don't do that!) and hope to post some first light impressions soon.

That may be more enthusiastic than interesting as I only have my Travelscope 70 to compare it with!

Enthusiastic reviews are interesting. I'm as happy to read a recent converts review as a technical review by an old hand. I read them for different purposes but I find a true emotional response to a subject has as much validity as a technical critique you may not have the tools in your armoury to accurately measure resolution ( I don't) but you have as much right to say I like it or don't as anyone does

[Digz]

Rob, please know that I wasn't suggesting you weren't a genuine member, I apologise if this is how it sounded. I am sure you now understand the position we are in and naturally why we question it when new members start enquiring about the rules for posting classifieds and complain about not being able to achieve them.( Again Im not suggesting you have been complaining :-) ) As mentioned above there have been issues with traders here before hence our interest in such questions and topics.

That aside, congrats on your purchase. I hope you will share your experience and thoughts with the forum.

[Scott]

Hey Rob, congrats on the new scope. I live in Stoke and my work (building industry) often takes me over nantwich way. I've often thought that when you come to the crossroads that take you right to chester or straight ahead to wrexam it would be a good area to get away from the city lights. I suppose knowing a farmer around there would be a great asset. Odd that I can't drive anywhere these days without looking for observing areas

[robhatherton]

Lee and others, thanks for your support and understanding. And yes I am hoping for a break in the weather some time next week!

[RikM]

Good news on the new scope Hope to hear more about it in due course.

[brantuk]

Congrats on your new scope - you'll get some nice views through that. XLT coatings are very nice - a notch above SW coatings imho. You may be interested to read this thread which has some interesting links about the 120:

and this one gives some idea of what to expect:

http://www.harrisontelescopes.co.uk/acatalog/Celestron_Omni_XLT_120mm_Refractor_Telescope.html

[robhatherton]

Auspom, you're welcome to contact me some clear night. My garden is a pretty good location apart from the odd car light and I get on very well with the farmer next door but you'd have to look out for the cow pats!