First Light Atik 16iC mono -LRGB

[moondog]

First go with the Atik 16iC(mono CCD), the Atik filter wheel and Astronomik LRGB filters.

To keep it simple I used the ED80 on the HEQ5, roughly Polar aligned, with no guide camera.

Had a bit of trouble fitting a T thread extension to the filter wheel as the wheel is so thin. This means that the threads are not deep enough to accept a normal adaptor. If you try the filter wheel it won't turn.

Atik supply a special short thread 1 1/4 ins nosepiece which I had to use with an adapted barlow without its lens. I have since sorted this problem out with a spacer.

The Atik 'Quick Start' guide is a laugh as the menus it describes seem to have changed and the Function buttons for a quick snapshot don't work. The software was easy to set up, and in spite of the carp instructions the camera is very easy to use.

The 16iC has 659 x 494 pixels, so it gives a good image scale. Obviously the resolution of the chip means that the final images will be fairly 'pixely' compared with the larger chipped Atik CCD's. Then the 16iC is nothing like the price.

The Artemis Capture software has a useful image focus tool which shows the brightness and width of a star you click on. Get the star as small as you can and the brightness as high as possible and its focused. The focus aid is very large so you can see it at a distance from the screen.

As I wanted to try out for the first time LRGB imaging I used one of the best placed colourful targets at the moment - the well imaged M27. Decided on 40 sec subs for the first test - 3 subs for each colour (RGB) and 6 subs for the luminance (L).

The exposure is easy to set up. As I knew the FIT images I was taking would initially all look grey I gave each image batch a prefix L, R, G, B.

Started off with the luminance, shuffled around a bit to see if it was all working OK (Big mistake shuffling!). Did the R series, G series and turned the filter wheel for the B series and the camera rotated a bit in the lashed up adaptor.

Fired up ImagesPlus software and looked at the images, R and G series all looked OK but the L series had a couple of subs with wobbly stars - don't shuffle next time!

As I thought the B series had rotated about 20 degrees.

Stacked each series separately and used the ImagesPlus Combine LRGB function. Simply put all the stacked images on the screen. Click R on the menu and click on the red stacked image. Do the same for all the others and voila! - they all appear in their true colours. I used Translate Scale and Rotate (that B series!) to produce a final unstretched image. Used the Digital Development of IP to quickly see the finished result. The rotated blue series had been correctly rotated by IP to line up with the others, but there was an out of line border to crop. Overall the 16iC obviously doesn't need any dark frames as it's a cooled camera and I was pleased with the low noise levels.

With the Astronomik dichroic filters I didn't need to adjust the focus each time I changed filters. Probably also says something for the ED80's object lens.

Processed the image in Photo Shop and the result is posted below.

A bit pixeley, but happy with it for a first go with only 8 mins 40 secs of exposures. With longer, guided exposures I should get some decent images - just don't shuffle!

MD

(click to enlarge)

Above image should have appeared on this post before - website problem.

Don't click on attachment below, no image and I can't remove it now !

MD

[jcm]

I have been doing pretty much the same as you with my 16HR.

Having to move the filters by hand is a bit of a pain , there is always the danger of knocking the scope , moving the filter wheel/camera system.

I am also using ImagesPlus for the stacking , aligning and RGB. I layer the luminance in CS2 , gives more control over the final image.

John

PS could not see your image

[MikeP]

I can't see the image either

Mike

[moondog]

Sorry guys - It says that the Stargazrs website is having problems at the moment

The image paste function hung as well before I had chance to click 'Post'.

Still seems to be having problems.

Texts get through but not images - weird never had this problem before.

I'll try posting an image later.

John

Thanks for the tip about luminance in Photo Shop - I'll give it a go.

MD

[jcm]

Yep , gremlin in the Stargazrs system.

John

[moondog]

Stargazrs problem seems to have been fixed now - image added to my first post.

John, what filter wheel and filters are you using ?

MD

[Grant]

Sorry MD, the Stargazrs server had a hiccup - must have been something it ate!

[jcm]

John, what filter wheel and filters are you using ?

MD

Astronomik LRGB , cheapo - Astro Engineering - cost about £69.

John

PS Anyone suggest a better one?

[Milamber]

A bit Pixely? it is only a 640x480 ICX424 remember (OK, it's 678x489 or what ever but ykwim) The Atik manual is a little behind the times but when you consider the *reason* why then you may think better of it (the presets are not preset to let you do it yourself btw). It is simply that the software is constantly being updated as requests for other/different features come in. Go to the Artemisccd.co.uk website for more details... or even the Atik site.

Arthur

[Kaptain Klevtsov]

Looks like you've cracked it MD, now for the longer exposures, guiding and all that stuff. Great first go I have to say.

Kaptain Klevtsov

[MartinB]

Great result MD. Like the colour. My understanding of the 16ic is that it should give just as good resolution as the 16HR but that being a smaller chip it wont give as large a FOV

[moondog]

Arthur

I'm not complaining about the camera - I am only saying what I found in trying to use it.

I'll go to the websites you mention and see if there's an update. It shouldn't be rocket science to get the instructions to match the software though !

I think it's a great value camera and I was well aware that it was only 659x494 pixels. Because of cropping (due to camera rotation during the blue subs) the posted image was only 601x439 pixels anyway.

KK - can't wait to have a go with guiding and I still have to have a bash with the Atik and the guide cam now the C8's on a wedge

Martin - The Astronomik filters seem to have given me a good colour image. I was concerned about the comments of having to re-focus each time I changed filters, but that's not been a problem.

Resolution - just checked the pixel sizes. The Atik 16HR is 6.45 x 6.45 and the Atik 16iC is 7.4 x 7.4. I guess this means that the HR will have slightly better resolution with its smaller pixel size?

8)

MD

[Kaptain Klevtsov]

The Atik 16HR is 6.45 x 6.45 and the Atik 16iC is 7.4 x 7.4. I guess this means that the HR will have slightly better resolution with its smaller pixel size?

MD

The 16HR has got a lot more pixels as well, so you can use a shorter 'scope (as in faster) for the same target, which also helps.

Kaptain klevtsov

[Milamber]

16HR will get better resolution because of the smaller pixels yes, but the bigger pixels get more photonsso will be more sensitive. Horses and courses and stuff. It's a dangerous place to play in is ccd specification land!

Arthur

[Kaptain Klevtsov]

Its very dangerous stuff, totally. Now I need a really short focus 'scope to play with, something like a 100mm f/2 APO sort of thing. Bet there not cheap though. Wideangle with the 16HR is in the realms of camera lenses, not 'scopes. That's why I moved up from the SC3 I suppose.

Kaptain klevtsov

[MartinB]

MD - the smaller pixels will retain good resolution at shorter focal length larger pixels can be an advantage -resolution becomes limited by the seeing and this happens at a shorter focal length the smaller the pixels. The 16ic pixels aren't exactly large though

[Milamber]

... Again, it's all relative Martin. Compared to the SAC10, (for example, off the top of my head), the 16IC's pixels are like canyons...

Arthur

[moondog]

Arthur

The SAC10 has 3.45 x 3.45 pixels.

There's a wide range of pixel sizes out there - SBIG and some others have 24 x 24 pixels

That's some pixel. If the 16iC's pixels are like canyons the SBIG's are like a whole continent !

MD

[Milamber]

Yup - they are big, the KAF11002 is 15x15 istr, but when your pixel size gets in that region your QE drops through the floor. Back to courses and four-legged-transport again :roll:

Arthur

[barkis]

If I could cut through the technical stuff for a few seconds MD. That is a darned good picture of M27.

I know of course the feedback coming in on this is important to you, and others also.

Ron.

[moondog]

Thanks Ron - that's what it's all about really isn't it - the final result ?

Yes I was pleased with the image - not bad for an 80mm scope and less than 9 mins total exposures.

I know I commented on the image being a bit 'pixeley', but I'm actually very impressed with the 16iC - especially its very low noise signal. It's an excellent value little camera.

MD

[Helen]

Nice shot MD 8) And I really like my ATiK too. Haven't got into colour yet, but once I get an EQ solution (either wedge or HEQ5) then it will be an option

Helen

PS what wedge have you got? (I'm looking for one)

[moondog]

Helen

PS what wedge have you got? (I'm looking for one)

I bought the Celestron Heavy Duty Wedge and adjustor kit from First Light Optics (10% discount for SGL members). I couldn't really find any alternatives to the Celestron - one or two expensive second hand ones on Astro Buy Sell and that was all.

The wedge itself is reasonably OK but the adjustor kit needs a bit of tweaking to make it work smoothly.

It's a simple modification with some spacer washers - I could show you how. Martin B also had to do this modification when he bought the same wedge. Setting the wedge up didn't seem to be a problem and it worked fine for up to about 80 secs subs. For longer subs you'd have to drift align the scope or - much better- get a guide scope.

MD

[Helen]

Thanks MD - that's very helpful!

Helen

[MartinB]

It's a simple modification with some spacer washers - I could show you how. Martin B also had to do this modification when he bought the same wedge.

Ha and I thought it was just my cack engineering skills that meant I couldn't get it to work!