lost in the eyepiece world, need help pleeeeease

[klomoli]

Hello Everyone,

This is my first post, I am a beginner in astronomy and I have recently purchased a Skywatcher 200/1000 Explorer EQ-5.

The scope was supplied with two eyepieces (1.25”), 10 mm and 25 mm and a Barlow 2x.

I have been amazed at looking at my first ever galaxies and although full of joy and emotions, almost hypnosed and glued to the eyepiece I keep on wondering whether I could not get much more out of my scope by purchasing better quality eyepieces.

I have now read millions if not billions of posts (maybe slightly exaggerating!) but I’m still very much unsure to what should I do next.

One thing I know is that I’m not interested in photography. I love DSO and planetary.

I have been looking at many options and this is where I’m at:

1) Should I simply buy a box set (like the Celeron £170 or skywatcher £140 kit for instance) and experiment for a few month to find out what I really want, I know that many eyepieces will not be used very often.

2) Are the eyepieces sold within such a box set really better than the ones supplied with the scope?

3) Should I directly buy lets say 3 good quality eyepieces and a good barlow, around £100-150 each? Something like a 10 mm, 20 mm, 32mm.

4) Should I directly buy lets say 2 good quality ones but in 2” with a decent Barlow that goes with it? I have received with the scope a 2” eyepiece holder, but is it really adequate for the type of scope that I have? Can he take it? As I know that it is not a bad scope but far from a good quality one.

5) I have noticed that Celeron do a 2” kit with a Barlow for £369 but once again, worth it?

6) Should I directly buy lets say 2 super quality eyepieces and a super Barlow.

Once again with such a scope is it worth spending £400 on an eyepiece, and been a beginner will I appreciate the outcome so much more then lets say a £70 or a £150 eyepiece?

7) Can the difference between a good and a very good or even a super eyepiece be really discerned by an un-experienced user?

What I have never found on all the forum or sites is some kind of ladder/scale for eyepieces that tell you, for example.

An eyepiece that you receive with a scope will score 10 out of 100

A Plossl will score 30 out of 100

A Super Plossl will score 40 out of 100

A Hypenrion will score 60 out of 100

A panoptic will score 80 out of 100

A Nagler will score 90 out of 100

I do appreciate that it can not be this simple as too many factors get in the way, but for beginners like myself, it would be so much easier. Or even someone who would take a photograph of lets say M51 with 25 different eyepieces and place the photos for view. I have read so much about eyepieces but it all still remains pretty complex, at least at this stage with so little experience.

As you can see I am prepared to invest in some good eyepieces, but would be so disappointed to spend lots of money on some eyepieces that I wouldn’t appreciate because of my lack of experience and lack of a good scope but in the opposite way, would hate to spend some good money on mediocre eyepieces and regret the purchase some time later.

I am looking forward to any kind of advice on the subject.

Many thanks,

klomoli

[nicnac]

the 200 is F5 so I would save the pennies and get few real gud ens, the sets are fine but not the best for fast telescopes

[swamp thing]

the 200 is F5 so I would save the pennies and get few real gud ens, the sets are fine but not the best for fast telescopes

I would agree with that, as a fast scope owner.

Regards Steve

[johninderby]

I agree with the above. A few decent eyepieces will serve you better than one of the sets. One way to compromise in order to get decent eyepieces without spending a fortune is to sacrifice some field of view and go for something such as the Televue Plossls. Top quality eyepieces that will work in fast scopes. With an f/5 scope wide angle eyepieces need to be good quality (£££) or they won't perform very well.

http://www.telescopehouse.com/acatalog/TeleVue_Plossls.html

John

[brantuk]

Divide the cost of a set by the number of pieces in it for a rough guide as to what they're worth. If it comes to less than £35 per eyepiece then dont bother. If there are filters and it all comes in an aluminium case then they're worth even less. Nearer the quality of supplied ep's and in many cases worse.

An f5 scope won't be as forgiving of poor quality ep's - I agree - go for 2-3 good ones and Powermate barlow to double the size range - eg 12mm, 16mm and 40mm with a powermate also gives you 6mm, 8mm and 20mm (or you can work out your own personalised range).

Now you just have to pick the right makes and barrel size (2" or 1.25"). Hope that helps

[Andyfx]

Well my scope is rated at F5 and to be honest I love the BST Explorers from Skies the Limit, at £40 including postage I dont think they can really be beat! Oh and I dont own any but the TMB clones are supposed to be ok too.

[WayBig]

Well my scope is rated at F5 and to be honest I love the BST Explorers from Skies the Limit, at £40 including postage I dont think they can really be beat! Oh and I dont own any but the TMB clones are supposed to be ok too.

Yes indeed, both great value for money and a noticeable step uo from the eyepieces that come with the scope. I've had several bst eyepieces and have been very happy with them

[stick]

Well my scope is rated at F5 and to be honest I love the BST Explorers from Skies the Limit, at £40 including postage I dont think they can really be beat! Oh and I dont own any but the TMB clones are supposed to be ok too.

I have to agree with Andy and Waybig

I recently bought 2 BST Explorers and they are superb (5 and 15mm)

I have the Skywatcher explorer 130pm, and like yours came with a 10 / 25 Eps

The difference between the stock eps and the BSTs is marked

True, you could spend much more on eps, but you need to take the scopes quality into account as well

The BSTs have a slightly wider FOV over the TMB clones (for only about £2 more each) but these are also supposed to be excellent

Give Alan at Sky's the Limit a call, great guy and he will talk to you about what you want / need

hope this helps

I know how you feel, its a minefield for us noobs !

stick

[klomoli]

Thank you for all these fast replies!!!!

I agree with the above. A few decent eyepieces will serve you better than one of the sets. One way to compromise in order to get decent eyepieces without spending a fortune is to sacrifice some field of view and go for something such as the Televue Plossls. Top quality eyepieces that will work in fast scopes. With an f/5 scope wide angle eyepieces need to be good quality (£££) or they won't perform very well.

http://www.telescopehouse.com/acatalog/TeleVue_Plossls.html

John

I have had a look at these, pretty decent price, are they better than the BST eplorers ones???

Divide the cost of a set by the number of pieces in it for a rough guide as to what they're worth. If it comes to less than £35 per eyepiece then dont bother. If there are filters and it all comes in an aluminium case then they're worth even less. Nearer the quality of supplied ep's and in many cases worse.

An f5 scope won't be as forgiving of poor quality ep's - I agree - go for 2-3 good ones and Powermate barlow to double the size range - eg 12mm, 16mm and 40mm with a powermate also gives you 6mm, 8mm and 20mm (or you can work out your own personalised range).

Now you just have to pick the right makes and barrel size (2" or 1.25"). Hope that helps

I had a look at the power mate (televue), it cost approx £160, is this the one you mean? And do you have any experience in 2" EPS? Do you think that my scope can take it?

I have to agree with Andy and Waybig

I recently bought 2 BST Explorers and they are superb (5 and 15mm)

I have the Skywatcher explorer 130pm, and like yours came with a 10 / 25 Eps

The difference between the stock eps and the BSTs is marked

True, you could spend much more on eps, but you need to take the scopes quality into account as well

The BSTs have a slightly wider FOV over the TMB clones (for only about £2 more each) but these are also supposed to be excellent

Give Alan at Sky's the Limit a call, great guy and he will talk to you about what you want / need

hope this helps

I know how you feel, its a minefield for us noobs !

stick

I can not find the BSTs Eps on the net? have they got another name??? Does BST stand for someting

I must give this Alan a call!!!

Many thanks for all the input!!

[MorningMajor]

3) Should I directly buy lets say 3 good quality eyepieces and a good barlow, around £100-150 each? Something like a 10 mm, 20 mm, 32mm.

If budget allows, that would be my option

[stick]

Thank you for all these fast replies!!!!

I can not find the BSTs Eps on the net? have they got another name??? Does BST stand for someting

I must give this Alan a call!!!

Many thanks for all the input!!

BST Explorer EPs (eyepieces!)

http://www.skysthelimit.org.uk/telescope%20eyepieces.html

[Mr Flibble]

I'm a newbie but I thought I'd let you know of my experience so far with regards to eyepieces and kits.

I only had two generic eyepieces which came with my f5 reflector and so I decided to get the celestron eyepiece kit as a starting point. In short it gave me about two years of use in which I became familiar with the use of my scope, how to find objects, what the planets and DSOs look like with different focal length eyepieces and which focal lengths I use the most. It also gave me time to read about the different eyepiece manufacturers on the market and how users of SG lounge rate them and which ones will be more suited to my scope.

Using this info I then set about purchasing good quality replacements which I intend to keep for a very long time. They greatly outperform the ones from the celestron kit in terms of sharpness and contrast but I'm glad I took the route that I did because it gave me the confidence to spend that little bit more for a good eyepiece. And afterall, the image from the kit eyepieces were pretty adequate for my needs when getting to grips with the scope.

If however you decide not to get a kit and just plum for some better quality eyepieces, to determine which focal lengths you're likely to need there is a rough guide in the book, 'Illustrated Guide to Astronomical Wonders'. Its based on the exit pupil of the eyepiece (worked out by dividing the eyepiece focal length by the focal ratio of your scope). So with your f5 scope you could go for :

1. Finder

Exit pupil of about 6 to 7mm - so a 32mm eyepiece is about right (mag x31)

2. Two Workhorses for large DSOs

Exit pupil of about 3mm and 2mm - so a 15mm and 10mm eyepiece (mag x67 and x100)

3. Barlow X2 for your Workhorses for smaller DSOs

Will give exit pupils of 1.5mm and 1mm (mag x133 and x200)

4. Planetary eyepiece

Either use your barlowed 10mm to give a magnification of x200 which is ideal. Or get a dedicated planetary eyepiece of 5mm (maybe an ortho).

Using this method you can cover most bases with 3 (at most 4) eyepieces and a barlow. I hope this is of some help and bear in mind I'm a newbie so use the above at your own risk

[brantuk]

"I had a look at the power mate (televue), it cost approx £160, is this the one you mean? And do you have any experience in 2" EPS? Do you think that my scope can take it?"

Yes - the Televue Powermate is the one I'm saving for - about the best you can get. I have many 2" eye pieces - I like a decent lense to look through and enjoy the extra width of field they give in a newt. All very suitable for an f5 200mm imho

[klomoli]

If budget allows, that would be my option

Well I was all geared up for spending some hard earned cash but now that I'm discovering these BSTs Eps, they are so cheap and can only find good comments on forum about them or is they some kind of conspiracy or something ???

BST Explorer EPs (eyepieces!)

http://www.skysthelimit.org.uk/telescope%20eyepieces.html

So cheap and yet suppositely so good, truly? How do they compare with the televue Plossl Eps that johninderby mentioned, anyone knows? Dont make me wrong I would be so happy to spend less!!!

I'm a newbie but I thought I'd let you know of my experience so far with regards to eyepieces and kits.

I only had two generic eyepieces which came with my f5 reflector and so I decided to get the celestron eyepiece kit as a starting point. In short it gave me about two years of use in which I became familiar with the use of my scope, how to find objects, what the planets and DSOs look like with different focal length eyepieces and which focal lengths I use the most. It also gave me time to read about the different eyepiece manufacturers on the market and how users of SG lounge rate them and which ones will be more suited to my scope.

Using this info I then set about purchasing good quality replacements which I intend to keep for a very long time. They greatly outperform the ones from the celestron kit in terms of sharpness and contrast but I'm glad I took the route that I did because it gave me the confidence to spend that little bit more for a good eyepiece. And afterall, the image from the kit eyepieces were pretty adequate for my needs when getting to grips with the scope.

If however you decide not to get a kit and just plum for some better quality eyepieces, to determine which focal lengths you're likely to need there is a rough guide in the book, 'Illustrated Guide to Astronomical Wonders'. Its based on the exit pupil of the eyepiece (worked out by dividing the eyepiece focal length by the focal ratio of your scope). So with your f5 scope you could go for :

1. Finder

Exit pupil of about 6 to 7mm - so a 32mm eyepiece is about right (mag x31)

2. Two Workhorses for large DSOs

Exit pupil of about 3mm and 2mm - so a 15mm and 10mm eyepiece (mag x67 and x100)

3. Barlow X2 for your Workhorses for smaller DSOs

Will give exit pupils of 1.5mm and 1mm (mag x133 and x200)

4. Planetary eyepiece

Either use your barlowed 10mm to give a magnification of x200 which is ideal. Or get a dedicated planetary eyepiece of 5mm (maybe an ortho).

Using this method you can cover most bases with 3 (at most 4) eyepieces and a barlow. I hope this is of some help and bear in mind I'm a newbie so use the above at your own risk

Many thanks for this extensive reply, much appreciated, but workhorses I guess you mean the ones you use all the time? Sorry english is not my native language!

[klomoli]

"I had a look at the power mate (televue), it cost approx £160, is this the one you mean? And do you have any experience in 2" EPS? Do you think that my scope can take it?"

Yes - the Televue Powermate is the one I'm saving for - about the best you can get. I have many 2" eye pieces - I like a decent lense to look through and enjoy the extra width of field they give in a newt. All very suitable for an f5 200mm imho

£160 for the 1.25" and £250" (aaargh that hurts!) Wonder if they are some BSTs Eps in 2" or do you think that if you spend £250 on a barlow you should use some better EPs with it????

[Mr Flibble]

Many thanks for this extensive reply, much appreciated, but workhorses I guess you mean the ones you use all the time? Sorry english is not my native language!

Yes that's it exactly. The eyepieces you'll end up using the most

[PeterM]

I have now read millions if not billions of posts (maybe slightly exaggerating!) but I’m still very much unsure to what should I do next.

klomoli

Hello! Everyone goes through the same process, so you're not alone. However you go about it you will end up buying:

1. a 32mm 2" EP - highly recommend the 32mm Panaview.

2. a 15-17mm 1.25" EP - the BST Explorers look good in this range or a 16mm Skywatcher Nirvana if you feel like splashing out.

That is all,

Pete

[twotter]

Just to throw in an alternative for you to consider, the Baader Hyperion range. They sell for £90-£95 new, around £65-£75 'pre-loved'. 68 degree field of view, which is a big step up from the standard eyepieces, fine tuning rings can adjust the focal length, and they have screw threads for attaching cameras. Might be worth a look?

My 13mm works very nicely in my F6 telescope, though other opinions would be useful on how they perform in your F5.

[banner001]

1) Should I simply buy a box set (like the Celeron £170 or skywatcher £140 kit for instance) and experiment for a few month to find out what I really want, I know that many eyepieces will not be used very often.

All eyepieces will have a purpose, if that galaxy looks a little too big for the 12mm EP it will probably look stunning in the 15mm, so i wouldnt dismiss them as you wont use many of them, you will be spoilt for choice, having said that i wouldnt buy them.

2) Are the eyepieces sold within such a box set really better than the ones supplied with the scope?

i'd say jury's out on this one, i would bet that they would be no different that those boxed with the scope, if you are getting 6 EP's for £120 thats £20 each...about the same as the bag-standerd ones you get with your telescope.

3) Should I directly buy lets say 3 good quality eyepieces and a good barlow, around £100-150 each? Something like a 10 mm, 20 mm, 32mm.

ill answer this below...

4) Should I directly buy lets say 2 good quality ones but in 2” with a decent Barlow that goes with it? I have received with the scope a 2” eyepiece holder, but is it really adequate for the type of scope that I have? Can he take it? As I know that it is not a bad scope but far from a good quality one.

just because they are a 2" barrel does not make them better than a 1.25". most 2" barrel's are for 30mm+ EP's, you are not gonna find many (if any) planetary 3.5mm EP's with a 2" barrel. If it was me, i would look at getting wide angle (so 68 aFOV) EP's if its mainly DSO's you want to look at. I would get a 8-12mm EP for viewing galaxies at decent magnification (~100x), i would get a 15-20mm EP for medium-low mag (~50x mag), those will give you a nice big view of the sky at the king of magnification you need for DSO's (if you zoom in too much all you see is a bright wall in front of you...no detail). I would also look to get a small focal length TV nagler for planetary viewing, the 5mm or 3.5mm...yes they are expensive but they are very good.

5) I have noticed that Celeron do a 2” kit with a Barlow for £369 but once again, worth it?

no.

6) Should I directly buy lets say 2 super quality eyepieces and a super Barlow.

Once again with such a scope is it worth spending £400 on an eyepiece, and been a beginner will I appreciate the outcome so much more then lets say a £70 or a £150 eyepiece?

barlow's are 1800's technology...try to avoid them. if you have too, buy a telextender...but remember the more glass you place infront of you the dimmer the final image, really try and avoid them, just but a shorter focal-length EP, it will be much better.

7) Can the difference between a good and a very good or even a super eyepiece be really discerned by an un-experienced user?

again, difficult to say, in the central portion no, but its towards the edges of the view where problems start to occur, coma, chromatic aberations etc...those are compensated for by the more expensive EP's (hence why they cost more).

as a rule of thumb for you, if you want more focal length, i.e a 40mm EP you will pay more than for a 4mm EP, if you want a wider angle i.e. a 68degree hyperion it will be more expensive than a 40 degree plossl, and a 2" barrell will be more than a 1.25"...but just because its more expensive does not always make it better, all EP's are designed to look at a particular thing, saturn will not look good in a 2" barrel 40mm EP, it will look good in a 1.25" barrel meade plossl 4.7mm EP...you need to read more

so for you i would buy:-

TeleVue Nagler 5mm £230

Baader Hyperion 8mm £95

Baader Hyperion 21mm £95

~£400 if you can get a deal...you will get some really good EP's, remember you will always want to buy a bigger telescope, but good quality EP's (like a good quality GEM) are things you will keep.

[banner001]

also remember that quality images are generated by two things 1. quality optics (you have control over this), and 2. seeing conditions (you have no control over this)...magnification (i.e. focal length) plays almost no part.

[Orion_the_Hunter]

I've got a 200p Dob (f6). I've got 2 good ep's atm in adition to the ones which came with the scope. They are a 6mm Planetary which cost €60 and a 32mm Panaview for about £80. These feel well worth it.

I hope to get 2 more, about 13/14mm and 20/22mm soon.

This will give me a set of 4 quality eyepieces. I feel that this will be sufficient.

HTH

[WayBig]

BST Explorer EPs (eyepieces!)

http://www.skysthelimit.org.uk/telescope%20eyepieces.html

they are now branded as "Paradigm"s - same eyepiece.

also remember if you buy decent used equipment and look after it, you wont lose much if you find it's not to your liking and you want to resell it.

[klomoli]

Dear everyone who has contributed to this post.

First of all thank you for your opinions and advice!

I have finally made my decision and after some serious consideration, been a newbie to the world of astronomy and not knowing exactly where it will take me and what I really want out of an eyepiece I have decided to play around for a couple of years with some not too expensive but of apparently great value/quality eyepieces.

And thanks to a great chat with Alan at Sky 's the limit, I have orded the full set of 1.25 " BST Explorer ED 60° : 5,8,12,15,18 and 25 mm.

Should keep me busy for a while!

Now comes the hardest bit, the wait (I live in Burgundy France! )

Cant wait to come back online and give my EXPERT and honest opinion for other newbies in a similar situation as mine.

Keep on skying, klomoli

[MorningMajor]

Good luck, looking forwardto hearimg your opinion when you get them

[WayBig]

Crikey, that's a lot of eyepieces, you dont do things by halves, post a review once you've tried them out.