How To Get The Most Out Of M33?

[Paul73]

Any hints & tips for getting the most out of the giant M33 from my back garden?

Yes, I know that Dark sky is king, but for me, opportunities are very limited.

My naked eye can see stars down to 5.5 with out too much trouble and the usual suspects are also visible unaided - Milky Way, M31, Double Cluster et al.

It took me months to actually see the thing. Binos unlocked that, as it turned out that my scope was looking straight through it!! Now that M33 is back in the sky, I always have a quick glance with the binos as this target seems to be a good indicator of general haziness.

I never point my scope at it. No point (or fuzz). This was until the other night. I had just enjoyed the nearby faint but perfect slither of NGC891/C23, so I thought I would give it a go. In went the 28mm (1.6° FOV x43). And there it was! More of an impression of structure & haziness with no defined start / end.

Obviously, I found this exceptionally exciting and would be great-full for any tips in uncovering more detail.

Paul

PS. I would prefer to avoid undue expenditure - plans to upgrade my 10" to a 14"/ 16" Dob have been temporarily shelved as absurdly Local Government deems a new patio, fence and kitchen makeover to be higher priorities!!!

[acey]

You're right, the way to get better views is to have a darker sky. But in the meantime I would suggest you find it in your scope at low power, switch to higher power, and see if you can pick out any of the HII regions and star clouds in the galaxy, starting with NGC 604. This map (and article) will help:

http://astronomy-mall.com/Adventures.In.Deep.Space/M33.HII-Star.Clouds.html

At low power you might just be able to trace the (backward) S-shape of the main spiral arms, if you know where to look for them. NGC 604 marks the end of the northern arm.

[Paul73]

Thanks Acey

A fascisting link as always.

I'll have a play with the higher magnifications.

Paul

[Michael11]

I always throught that low power (30-40x) is the best for viewing M33.

However last weekend we observed it with a 12" dob at quite high power (120 something) - and to my surprise both spiral arms were really distinct, and easily visible almost to the core. the galaxt halo, though, almost disappeared at this power (maybe this is what made the arms visible).

[swamp thing]

I always throught that low power (30-40x) is the best for viewing M33.

However last weekend we observed it with a 12" dob at quite high power (120 something) - and to my surprise both spiral arms were really distinct, and easily visible almost to the core. the galaxt halo, though, almost disappeared at this power (maybe this is what made the arms visible).

Now your cooking Michael, get the mag up and the contrast with it. Low power is for big nebulae and M31. I can squeeze M33 into my 12mm Nagler at 166x, cracking view with a galaxy filling the eyepiece, much better than squinting at a little tiny object in a huge FOV.

[mjpfc]

A dark sky is one thing, but transparenct is another, with my 8" and a 20mm lens I can barely find it

some dark and apparently clear nights. but on others I can spend hours with 20mm and 10mm ogling

at all the little details of it.

Extended objects are always very susceptible to seeing, the Helix Neb is another, one night invisible,

the next you can smell Ionised gasses.

Mick

[Qualia]

Any hints & tips for getting the most out of the giant M33 from my back garden?

I find the best way of observing, or getting the most out of an object is to place it in a lowish power EP and to ask some basic questions about it. These questions could include stuff like:

What am I looking at?

What have I read or seen of this object that can inform my observation?

What shape does it seem to have?

How many stars can I see in my field of view? What colour are they? Are there differing intensities of brightness between them?

How does the object's appearance change as I flip from direct to averted vision and back again? And so on.

When I move away from the eyepiece to relax my eye, I try to figure what I can recall about the object. Was there anything distinct about it that struck me?

I'll then up the magnification again, and ask a few more questions. Stuff like:

How has the image changed?

How many stars have now been cut away?

Has anything in the image become dimmer or lighter?

Has the object itself changed in any fashion?

Are there any new patterns, shapes or colours to be seen within it?

Are given areas of my new field of view more pronounced than others?

If I close and relax my eye away from the eyepiece can I picture the object there 'within'?

I'll then up the magnification to the optimum power, that which gives the sharpest and clearest image at the highest magnification possible and go through the same questions as above. It is important not to hold back and have fear on magnification. Sure, many DSO don't like too much power, but you'll be surprised how many do and there's only one way to find out

In all cases, getting to know the object for me is the trick of asking yourself questions about the object; to not only appreciate the subtle detail and complexity therein but also to have a general picture of how the object is framed within your eyepieces and mind.

Another great way is to start sketching.

[Paul73]

Qualia

I'll give that method a try. I guess that stepping through things in a logical order will prompt the brain to put together a more complete image which will only improve as you work at it.

Can't wait for the moon to get out of the way to give it a try.

Paul

[alan potts]

All very good advice, I will give it a whirl tonight, now watch the clouds show up.

Alan

[KevUU]

If you get half decent skies, NGC 604 just next door to M33 is a nice distraction as has been mentioned.

I got it at the weekend from Wales, skies only a little better than your 5.5 garden and I was 'only' using 8".

It's VERY small though (just looked like a slightly-out-of-focus star the first time when haze was blowing around).

I quite like seeing two such different objects in the ep at once, one large faint fuzzy and one small brighter compact nebula. They're so different in appearance that they make quite an intriguing and (for me) pleasing view.

PS: I couldn't see any structure in M33 though. If I could see half of the stuff in acey's link I'd be knocked into a coma I think!

[bingevader]

PS: I couldn't see any structure in M33 though. If I could see half of the stuff in acey's link I'd be knocked into a coma I think!

I think there's a challenge in there somewhere or other for the 8" (and smaller!) 'scope users, however, Mr Gottlieb does talk about using a 10-12" or an 18" 'scope!