First scope - skywatcher 200p or 250px

[DrNeb]

Hello all,

this is my first post! I would like to apologise if I have posted in the wrong section, as I generally do this in every forum the first time as I am completely useless.

I am very new to the world of telescopes but I have been doing a bit of research. I'm looking to purchase a dob and the skywatcher series seems to be ticking all the boxes for me.

However! I'm looking for something that I can grow into. I'm very keen on planetary observing but DSO's really appeal to me.

I have my eye on the skywatcher dob 200p and the 250px.

the 250 offers around 56% more light gathering then the 200.

Would this be worth it? or would I be out of my depth with a 250? would the 250 require more work in regards to Collimation?

Please keep in mind that I want to grow into this scope and that I do not want to upgrade any time soon after purchasing.

I would appreciate any advice that you are willing to offer!

[John]

The 250 is a bit bulkier and heavier but still quite manageable. Collimation adjustment is needed with all newtonians from time to time, the 250 is no exception to this. The extra aperture will give you more deep sky potential and is well worthwhile - it will postpone an outbreak of "aperture fever" that much longer !.

[simon84]

Welcome to SGL, location wise its in the best place.

I would go for the bigger scope as you will wish you had if you dont. Collimation is pretty much the same and if you can accurately collimate an 8" scope then could pretty much do the same on a larger one. There are plenty of tutorials on collimating, but the best thing I ever did was buy the Hotech laser collimator which made the job very simple indeed. You dont necessarily need to go for something like that and there are other options, have a look at the collimating section at SGL's sponsor First Light Optics who do a nice range. One day you will probably want to go even bigger though. I did and I'm still not satisfied.

As your going for the dob you shouldnt have too much trouble moving it around. I'm just about to get another 12" EQ mounted Newt but will make a dob base for that at some point. I have a very bad back and can handle sliding a 12" dob around and use it quite well for a few hours before I start having any problems.

A 10" scope will give you alot to look at so take your time, enjoy each view you get and have fun.

I hope you get what your after and you have come to the right place for help, advice and the chance to meet like minded people. Best thing I ever did in astronomy was join SGL.

[brantuk]

Skywatcher are very good scopes and great value for money. They give just about the best price to aperture size ratio that I've seen and thoroughly recommended.

As for the size of aperture - bigger is better with Newtonians wether dob mounted or eq mounted. The 200 (8") is a very popular size and would keep you going for many years to come. The 250 (10") 'ers extra light gathering will afford deeper views into space and more objects to see.

Collimation is the same process on both whichever tool you use - seemingly difficult at first it becomes dead easy after the first few goes and you know what you're doing.

Either size would make a very nice starter scope, but do see one in the flesh first so you know how big/heavy it is, and assess storage, portability, etc.

Hope that helps

[DrNeb]

Thank you all for your help.

I've been looking on "flo" for all my potential gear.

I saw a video un-boxing of the 200p and it does look pretty large!

i'm assuming that the 250 would only differ in terms of diameter?

a couple more questions - Sorry!

Would I need any sort of barlow lenses from day one, or would i be good to go "out of the box" allowing me to save for a week or two before buying some more gadgets?

Is it possible to add these GOTO kits to dobs? - this isn't a high priority as i am very much looking forward to finding these objects on my own. it seems like half the fun!

Thank you all for your input! i truly cannot wait.

[CGolder]

I own a 250px in dob for and a 200p on with rings/dovetail..

The 250px tube is a lot larger than the 200p. if i were to be buying a dobsonian i would buy the 250px as it gives more height and a better viewing position. if i were to be mounting on a eq i would get the 200p, its still pretty heavy for lifting on a eq. you will get away with a smaller mount for the 200p eq5 or heq5. 250px is heq5 min and eq6 to be safe.

The views on most nights i dont see too much of a difference but on some nights where its clear the 250px shows its worth.

if you like i will take a picture of the 2 tubes side by side today?

[CGolder]

you shouldn't need a barlow to start with, I personally only use a barlow on a webcam, the standard 10 and 25 should be fine to begin with.

as far as i am aware skywatcher only do tracking/goto mounts when you buy that scope and there are no upgrade kits.

[Astro_Baby]

I's kip the Barlow and go for extra Eyepices. I assume the scope comes with the standard 10 and 25mm ones which will be enough to get you started. Better eyepieces will be the fisrt thing you'll need along with a dewshield for the scope (you can make one easy enough from a camping mat and gaffa tape if money is tight.

You'll also need a collimation tool - a Cheshire only costs about £20 and will do the job as well as anything else. Whatever refelector you buy it will need collimation and one scope is no worse than any other for that.

Do get a look at one of these if at all possible or at least a picture that gives a sense of scale because these things are quite large. Also check the weight. Most beginners are amazed by how heavy a seemingly empty tube can be.

My 200 steps in at almost 10kg - it doesnt seem a lot until you have to carry it across a field to set it up.

[DrNeb]

Thank you all for your help! this is truly a very welcoming forum!

Yes! it would be fantastic if you could take some photo's side by side. I saw a man straddling his 200p on an unboxing video! it looked pretty damn big!

cGolder, you said the 250 really shows it's worth on clear nights. as you own both, say hypothetically both your scopes broke and you were limited to buying only one. Which would it be?

Thanks for the help all.

[TheThing]

I'd go for the 250 as well. Bigger is always better. I have a 200 which is mighty fine. The 250 can only be better!

Get a Barlow and then you only need half as many EPs. Cheaper in the long run. The Tal Barlows are very good and excellent value for money.

[Perryellis]

Some other things you might want to go for are red dot finders

Like these

Telrad Red Dot Finder

Finders - Rigel QuikFinder Compact Reflex Sight

A good book or two like these

Turn Left at Orion: A Hundred Night Sky Objects to See in a Small Telescope - and How to Find Them: Amazon.co.uk: Guy Consolmagno, Dan M. Davis: Books

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Deep-Sky-Companions-David-H-Levy

/dp/0521553326

A sub to the sky@night magazine. They have a guide to what to look for sky each month and usually features a deap sky challenge of some sort (has done for the last two issues anyway)

And a red light tourch to help you read at night while protecting your night vision!

These are all suggestions that were made to me about a month or two ago when I started on these forums. Very nice and helpful bunch here!

and download stellarium.....

[CGolder]

a comparison pic for you

[Jdavies]

Go for the the bigger scope, the bigger the apature the better the qualty of the images.

[DrNeb]

Woahh..

thanks CGolder. that was very informative indeed. I'm sure i could cope with the extra weight to lug around. I'm sure the end result would be worth it.

I've looked at the cheshire tool and i've started reading up on the process.

I'm going to look into the red dot finders today and i'll be ordering "turn left at Orion". I'm pretty sure I'll go with the 250.

Cheers for all your help. I'll report back once I get it.

No doubt i'll be back seeking your expert advice once again.

[ollypenrice]

Years ago I upgraded from an 8 to 10 inch SCT and certainly thought the gain worthwhile.

Olly

[johninderby]

I'd say get the 10" dob. Yes it's a fair bit bigger than the 8" but it's still easy enough for most people to carry around. It only takes a few seconds to remove or put the tube back onto the base so you don't have to carry the whole setup at once.

BTW the 12" is a lot bigger and heavier than the 10" and that's the point where some people struggle to carry the scope outside.

John

[DrNeb]

Some other things you might want to go for are red dot finders

Like these

Telrad Red Dot Finder

Finders - Rigel QuikFinder Compact Reflex Sight

A good book or two like these

Turn Left at Orion: A Hundred Night Sky Objects to See in a Small Telescope - and How to Find Them: Amazon.co.uk: Guy Consolmagno, Dan M. Davis: Books

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Deep-Sky-Companions-David-H-Levy

/dp/0521553326

A sub to the sky@night magazine. They have a guide to what to look for sky each month and usually features a deap sky challenge of some sort (has done for the last two issues anyway)

And a red light tourch to help you read at night while protecting your night vision!

These are all suggestions that were made to me about a month or two ago when I started on these forums. Very nice and helpful bunch here!

and download stellarium.....

the red light torch is a great idea! i cannot wait turns out one of my friends at work has been into this for the last 6 months! so it's even better.

Thank you all again for helping a noob!

i did a bit of hunting around the forum and found this guy.

Matt's Astronomy Site <--- Awesome site! i hope my setup can be as decent as his one day.

that 800 quid EQ6 looks mighty tasty. I've got upgradeitus and i haven't even had my scope delivered yet! Oh dear!

[MikeWilson]

Welcome to the site DrNeb!

You will soon find, as I have today that simply Googling an astronomy question on your mind will often lead you right back to this site and a wealth of helpful solutions and discussions. I found this thread while researching my next Newtonian telescope (either a 200P DS or 250P DS).

Good discussions here, I'll step back a moment and carry on reading:)

[DrNeb]

Thank you Mike,

I have indeed found the very same! it seems to be the best resource on the internet for such things.

I just hope my expectations aren't too high! I'm sure that I won't be disappointed, even if the planets are the size of a 5p piece and blurry!

[MikeWilson]

Planets will look like a garden pea at arms length. Turn left at Orion is a good book as it has plenty of sketches of what objects look like at the eyepiece.

If it's planets that you like, it's worth looking at Mak telescopes. Longer focal length gives a greater magnification and you can expect to see a more contrasty view on planets.

[DrNeb]

hmmm

right! now im confused.

What should i go for? I'm quite happy with my expectations. even the size of a pea is quite something really isn't it!

However! Maksutov-Cassegrain? is the increased focal length more important than aperture?

Dob or Mak!

keeping in mind the 250px was top end of my budget as i need to keep some money aside for other bits n'bobs!

Sorry all! Advice please!

[DrNeb]

Ah i think we can safely scrap my last comment. the Mak's are out of my budget unless i go for one with less aperture. plus it's only got 300mm more in focal length.

I will risk it with the dob 250px i reckon.

thoughts and opinions welcome.

[MikeWilson]

hmmm

right! now im confused.

What should i go for? I'm quite happy with my expectations. even the size of a pea is quite something really isn't it!

However! Maksutov-Cassegrain? is the increased focal length more important than aperture?

Dob or Mak!

keeping in mind the 250px was top end of my budget as i need to keep some money aside for other bits n'bobs!

Sorry all! Advice please!

Two totally different horses for courses

In very brief summary:

+DOB: Bigger aperture, better deep sky views, cools down faster

+MAK: Lighter and much smaller, better planetary and moon views, almost always doesn't require collimation.

So up to you

Incidentally I think very highly of both 'types' of scope and I have a 150P as well as a 127 Mak (practically new, which I'm selling) and I love them both. Love not being too strong a word to be honest The 250PX will give you more of what the 150P gives me and although it has a more aperture it also has a smaller field of view and it's much heavier.

Depending on your budget and what you want to achieve, I would say:

1. Visual observations and/or imaging of planets, moon, some smaller and brighter deep sky objects and clusters, variable and double stars = Mak (127 or 150)

2. Visual and tending towards imaging of deep sky objects - get a solid mount (CG5, HEQ5, EQ6) and put a small or medium reflector (150P, 200P) on it.

3. Visual observations of deep sky objects - get the biggest aperture that you can afford right now (e.g. 250PX) on a dob base.

Don't forget that the second hand market can be a very valuable source for used equipment as it leaves you with cash for the extra things you'll need down the line.

If you're looking down the Makuskov-Cassegrain line, I have a mint condition, almost new Mak 127 on a GOTO mount with filters quite cheaply and there's often a dob up for sale too. Don't forget to try "UK Astro Buy & Sell", too.

[MikeWilson]

EDIT: I've just read: "but DSO's really appeal to me."

Then all things considered, get the DOB 250PX.

[dmahon]

Afre you just going to us this scope to look through, or are you planning on taking pictures.

Are you more interested in the Sun, moon, planets, or DSOs?