Help choosing a starter all-rounder setup

[Stu1smartcookie]

So , come on , lets end the disagreement here , and now ... this is becoming akin to being on Cloudy Nights !!!! 

I'm sure the op didnt bargain for what has been written . 

BTW the OP asked for help in choosing a starter set up . I do understand that people , including me , have different opinions to give and we may all get a little irked when people disagree with our opinions , but , in the scheme of things we should be helping the OP . 

 

[SthBohemia]

41 minutes ago, Stu1smartcookie said:

being on Cloudy Nights !!!! 

I have always enjoyed the thrills and excitement from the 'Adventures into the realm of the Clouded Knights' 🙂 Bit of a free for all, however there are a lot of very informative threads therein, and at times a good laugh!

[Mandy D]

I'm a rank amateur here and I observe and image using a wide variety of kit that I am lucky to posess. I get half-decent results from all of it. I don't think you will be disappointed with the views in any of the telescopes being recommended. Ease of use is probably the most important point. I love Newtonian reflectors on Dobsonian mounts and own two, both cheap Chinese Skywatchers, a 200P and a 250PX. I think they are both excellent scopes and keep saying that both are easy to carry outside. However, I have a back injury at the moment and find both very difficult to handle, so my trusty Nikon D800 with 300 mm prime lens and 2x teleconverter are the only things I am using at present, oh and my Nikon 135mm prime.

I use both Dobs for visual and imaging and they work well on the Moon and planets. Harder to do deep sky, but not impossible with short subs and stacking. I also have an iOptron RC6 which is a Ritchey-Chretien and have been told by some in here that it is not the best for planetary or lunar imaging nor for visual use, but I love it and use it for both. So, even a scope which is sub-optimal for a particular use can be perfectly useable. It is, however, a great little scope for deep sky imaging. However, I'm not going to recommend it.

Don't forget that any reflecting telescope (and larger refractors) will need collimating at some point. Some do it every session, others like me do it only when necessary. It looks difficult and I put it off for as long as I possibly could and only attempted it when I bought a used scope that was so badly out it was unusable, but collimating it was very easy and took less than five minutes and I'd never done it before.

I've never owned a refractor, but have looked through a few, so can say that they give great views within their aperture limitations. I've yet to use an EQ mount, so will not comment on them here. I do own an AZ mount and I find it very easy to point at the sky and find bright objects and track them, even at quite high magnifications. I also find the Dobsonian mounted Newtonian reflectors easy to point and use, but admit they can be a bit tricky if they are not running smoothly on their bearings.

I have considered getting a Skywatcher Skymax. I'd love to get the 180 with it's 2700 mm focal length as it would be great for planetary, but it's pricey and I am not spending that kind of money at present. Look at the smaller ones in that range; the 127T looks like a bargain to me and should deliver great views and could be used with your camera. Here is a link to the range:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-optical-tube-assemblies/page/1/

Or the 127T on an AZ5 mount and tripod:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-skymax-127-az5-deluxe-telescope.html

Or with wi-fi and goto:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-skymax-127-az-gti-wifi-telescope.html

OK, maybe a shorter focal length for deep-sky, so try these refractors:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/bresser-messier-ar-102s600-hexafoc-optical-tube-assembly.html

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/bresser-ar102xs460-hex-focus-ed-refractor-ota.html

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-startravel-102t-optical-tube-assembly.html

Or with a tripod and mount:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-startravel-102-az3-telescope.html

They are not hugely expensive, but you will need to budget for a tripod and mount. This needs to be sturdy enough and rigid enough to support your telescope and keep it pointed at the object of interest as you already know. You could spend a lot of money on this part and perhaps that is where a big part of the budget should go. I mean, who wants a wibbly wobbly shaky view of Saturn? For a reasonable low cost mount and tripod for a lightweight tube, try this:

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-az3-alt-az-mount.html

Have a read of this to find out more about this mount and how to easily improve it:

https://www.cloudynights.com/articles/cat/user-reviews/mounts/alt-azimuth/az3-alt-az-mount-r394

Don't forget that FLO also sell most (or all) of these, so do a price comparison with them at:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/

 

[skybadger]

So a mak or similar of the 110mm region which could be mounted on a tripod or equatorial sounds like a good value proposal. 

The dob is also a sound proposal, even for kids. I leave it to you to determine whether adding electronics makes it more or less suitable for kids or adults..

You can at least take it outside, plonk it down and start observing with something that will show somethi g and is robust against kids handling. 

You can take planetary from the start and can also take deepsky by adding a base or goto with the right camera.

 

[PeterStudz]

On 02/11/2022 at 14:40, Elp said:

I image from bortle 7, and visually I've tried a 130pds and a Celestron C6 SCT. I struggled to even see a bright cluster like the Hercules Globular Cluster (just about making out a faint dark grey fuzziness with averted vision), if I didn't have goto I would have struggled to find it. Viewing nebulae? Impossible, other than maybe Orion. Yet with a camera each object appears reasonably quickly (Hercules for example quite defined in a 10-30 second exposure, many DSOs you have to take a lot of images and stack but they begin to faintly appear in 60-120s images typically).

Others can comment on their experiences about whether using a 8 inch or above from similar bortle as to whether they have seen DSO objects clearly visually.

I’m in a Bortle 7 location. I have an 8 inch Dob and a small 4.5 inch Newtonian. Even in the 4.5 I can make out the brighter globular clusters without averted vision, although they are just fuzzies. The 8 inch can easily resolve many stars.

In the 4.5 I can easily see the ring nebula & dumbbell nebula, although a filter helps. Of course the Orion Nebula is the brightest and on a very good night I can just make it out naked eye.

In the 8 inch everything is brighter with more detail and contrast. With that the galaxies M81 & M82 are great. M31 isn’t bad too. The planets are far better in the 8 inch. 

[bingevader]

On 28/10/2022 at 13:13, SthBohemia said:

Likewise avoid Dobsons like the plague unless you intend to mount a reflector with a 16"+ mirror....

I don't know about the 'war path', but if I am a 'native' then it's frustration at the gross generalisations, like in the quote, that is taking us off topic.

It might be your opinion, as you have now suggested, but there's no qualification, clarification or example as to why someone seeking advice should, 'avoid Dobsons like the plague'.

My 8" 'scope, although large, is more than manageable in two parts. It fits easily in the boot and on the back seat of a Corsa (not big) if I venture out or take it to school.

Without going into a Blade Runneresque quote about the shoulder of Orion, it has not only allowed me to see things I wouldn't think possible from my back garden with relatively cheap bits of glass, but is also, hopefully, inspiring the next generation of stargazers.

Dobs might not be everyone's cup of tea, but avoid them like the plague? Maybe not.

[Stu]

8 hours ago, Stu1smartcookie said:

So , come on , lets end the disagreement here , and now ... this is becoming akin to being on Cloudy Nights !!!! 

Nothing like CN, just trying to keep the advice relevant to the OP so that it remains useful.

[Elp]

3 hours ago, PeterStudz said:

The 8 inch can easily resolve many stars.

Good to know. A collapsible truss dob would be a good option in future.

[xpm]

Thanks again for all of the responses. I have taken stock of the (wildly differing of course! 😆) opinions in your comments and am now swinging towards the suggestion of an Evostar 80ED, possibly with an az-gti on an upgraded tripod (EQ6 most likely), so that I can slot in an upgraded mount in future if I decide that I need to move to EQ for astrophotography. This should hopefully provide something fairly portable that should give us a good start in visual, with the option to move to AP as and when I'm ready.