Fuzzy hunting

[Stu]

1 hour ago, Stardaze said:

That was my logic too John. If ain't broke for you and all that.. You have years of experience working in your favour, I need all the help I can get 😀 I think having the phone in red and turned down should negate my issues with it, so looking forward to giving it a go. 

I’ve observed some fairly faint galaxies with my 16” under mag 21 skies whilst using my phone. When fully dimmed and in red mode it’s no brighter than a red light torch shining off a map. I confess I find paper maps much harder to read than SkySafari; the app just represents everything in a far more realistic manner and my brain doesn’t convert from black on white to white on black very well!!

What is clear is that we all have different preferences and there is no right or wrong answers, what work for you is what counts.

[Stardaze]

6 minutes ago, Stu said:

I’ve observed some fairly faint galaxies with my 16” under mag 21 skies whilst using my phone. When fully dimmed and in red mode it’s no brighter than a red light torch shining off a map. I confess I find paper maps much harder to read than SkySafari; the app just represents everything in a far more realistic manner and my brain doesn’t convert from black on white to white on black very well!!

What is clear is that we all have different preferences and there is no right or wrong answers, what work for you is what counts.

This has been a really helpful post for me, so thanks to everyone for their input. It was certainly time to review things and I'll give SkySafari more of a go. It's also good to see other experienced observers note that they too find one method easier than another. Some maps I have struggled with and that is largely down to the scaling I think, the app does look a little more like you see when zoomed in properly. I can't believe I hadn't noticed that the FOV element wasn't turned on! 

[Pixies]

44 minutes ago, Stardaze said:

Are you hatching any plans to head out to a dark site? I’m just over 20 mag here so not too bad but I do have to be careful with stray light from the neighbours usually. 

The rules in Scotland are a little different still. We are still not supposed to go more than 5 miles beyond the local authority boundary. My garden is supposedly 19.28 but it's a lot better looking North and East, as that's over the sea. There's a site used by local astro groups that is within the above limits, and that's 20.6 (using the light pollution map website). However, 25 miles away is a 21.75 site - but that should wait until the restrictions are lifted in 3 weeks (although that's full-moon time 🙄)

[Whistlin Bob]

3 hours ago, Pixies said:

What's the name of the filter app you are using?

It's called Bluelight filter but doesn't seem to be on the play store now. Like like there are loads using the same name so hopefully one of those will be ok. It literally dims my screen and cuts out blue light in a controllable way, which is exactly what I need.

[Stardaze]

2 hours ago, Pixies said:

The rules in Scotland are a little different still. We are still not supposed to go more than 5 miles beyond the local authority boundary. My garden is supposedly 19.28 but it's a lot better looking North and East, as that's over the sea. There's a site used by local astro groups that is within the above limits, and that's 20.6 (using the light pollution map website). However, 25 miles away is a 21.75 site - but that should wait until the restrictions are lifted in 3 weeks (although that's full-moon time 🙄)

If it hadn’t have been for all of the restrictions I would have taken mine out by now. There’s a spot not much more than 20 minutes from here that measures 20.98 on the pollution map. Certainly planning on doing that when I can. Just have to plan an evening when there’s no restrictions, cloud, dew, moon, work nights etc.. Simples 🙄

[Pixies]

Found another feature I haven't used before: "Observation Planning"

Choose: 'Planner' from the Observations menu

Select:

• 'Open Clusters', 'Globular Clusters', 'bright nebulae', 'planetary nebulae', 'galaxies'. 
• magnitude 0-10
• Constellation: Coma Berenices

Do Search

Make into Observation List

 

and voila:

[Stu]

44 minutes ago, Pixies said:

Found another feature I haven't used before: "Observation Planning"

Choose: 'Planner' from the Observations menu

Select:

• 'Open Clusters', 'Globular Clusters', 'bright nebulae', 'planetary nebulae', 'galaxies'. 
• magnitude 0-10
• Constellation: Coma Berenices

Do Search

Make into Observation List

 

and voila:

If you go to observing lists and look at the bottom there is an option to Import from Online Repository. Select this and there plenty of preprepared lists to import and use. These include all the Messier objects, for instance, all a list of coloured doubles. Well worth a look.

[Stardaze]

Had another 2 hours just before retreating having lost the feeling in my fingers (minus 2 just now)

Spent most of my time around Leo, M65/M66 to begin. Transparency looked reasonable but not excellent. Found the Leo Triplets relatively easily too and so observed them for a good while. M96 seemed to really stand out against it's closest neighbour as well.

I fancied having a go for Markarians Chain, so using the finder armed with SkySafari I found M60 & M59 quickly. From there there seemed to be a bigger expanse of nothing until I came across M87. I completely over shot the spot next but landed on the M99 (Coma Pinwheel) so not a bad bonus galaxy, though seemingly very dim to my eye. When I finally did drop back to find the two prominent galaxies in the chain it confirmed that I had found them the previous evening. It certainly is a fitting name but I wasn't over-awed for some unknown reason. 

I decided to drop onto M51 just to see how she looked tonight which left me wondering whether last night probably was the better evening . Nevermind, Arcturus had risen nicely between the houses and so I thought a globular would be a nice end to the evening so I paid M3 a call. I swapped the 13mm for the 8mm to help add some contrast and fill more of the eyepiece, the 8E really did make her shine through. 

A nice enjoyable session with a hard frost really starting to form as I packed the gear away, the week ahead doesn't look promising at all for another go.

[Zermelo]

On 05/04/2021 at 10:39, Pixies said:

The Pro offers a lot of fainter objects over the Plus version. I've never felt the requirement to upgrade from Plus yet, though.

+1

The (relatively small) cost of upgrading to Plus is certainly worth it for all the features described in this thread, especially if you have a goto mount; but if your equipment/skies are such that you're not going to see anything very faint, it's harder to justify the extra for the larger database in the Pro version.

I realized early on that the night mode wasn't going to be sufficient (other apps and notifications unaffacted) so I made a physical shield by attaching a piece of red plastic to one of those soft cases that just goes around the back and sides. Then I turn the brightness down so that I can just see the detail. Touch screen still works through the plastic.

[Froeng]

Definitely the difference between standard and plus is worth it.

what kind of plastic product are you using with your phone?

[Stu]

7 minutes ago, Zermelo said:

I realized early on that the night mode wasn't going to be sufficient (other apps and notifications unaffacted)

If you have an iPhone you can set it so it is red for everything, combined with the brightness on minimum this is generally enough. That said, the red film can be useful for darker sites to knock the brightness back a bit more, I’ve done the same myself before.

I also agree with other comments that Plus is plenty for most uses. I have Pro but only for the enjoyment of being able to reference fainter stuff, I don’t think over ever needed it when observing.

 

[Zermelo]

1 hour ago, Froeng said:

what kind of plastic product are you using with your phone?

I bought it from eBay, but I checked and it's no longer there.

 

[Pixies]

The US chap that used to supply the high quality red filter plastic for such purposes has 'retired' now, too.

I'm in the market for something suitable. Is there anything to be aware of regarding the type of plastic, so that the touch screen continues to work?

[Stardaze]

There was a break in cloud just after dusk for a few hours and so I grabbed the opportunity until midnight, being off from work too this week. Meteoblue had the seeing down as poor and so I confirmed that whilst realigning my finder scope. I think it did improve a little throughout the session but it wasn't great. Thanks to @Pixiesfor the SkySafari star hopping tip, worked a treat at the eyepiece last night, I seemed to get my eye into the finder scope much better tonight.

Started working upwards from Vindmiatrix.

M60 - Nice a distinct.

M59 - Similar to M60, both stand out well as a good starting point.

M58 - Notably lower in brightness than M59, no detail.

Virgo A - Seemed brighter last week from memory?

Markarian's Chain - I sketched this out from memory when I got back in to compare as it's my first near full chain viewed (must download SkySafari Plus later as there's only 2 galaxies noted on the basic version). M84 and M86 were easy to find, like previously. NGC 4435 & NGC 4438 stood out together quite well and I found the bottom end after a minute or so (NGC 4473 & NGC 4477) but I really had to sit there for a few minutes to wean out NGC 4461, but no sign of a companion tonight.

M99 (Coma Pinwheel) - Certainly spread out without a bright core to it. 

M98 - Another one ticked off.

M100 - Wasn't a great view but I was most pleased with the hunt and my ability tonight to find these in succession.

M3 - Didn't resolve as well as last week, stars still lacking contrast even at x157.

Melotte 111 - Observed this in the bino's early evening. Looked pretty good in the 10x50's.

M51 - I was dying to drop in on my old favourite, now very close to zenith. I spent two stints searching hard for some structure, I could see the nebulosity around the core more clearly one side than the other but no separation. 

M101 - Location of the Pinwheel always seems simple up to the last couple of degrees, following the line from Mizar. It's the first time this year I have stopped by here. Because of how dim she appears tonight I over ran it to begin with, but once found, she was extremely dim. On paper, much brighter than M51 at mag 7.86 (brighter than most observed tonight) but assume the area must be less condensed and so there wasn't much to see and report.

M81 & M82 - First time here too this year for me. One of my 'go-to's' from last year and I'd remembered @Stuposting a simple location hop recently, which worked a treat. Both stood out well and I felt that transparency had improved a little, or maybe that I had relaxed off and had my eye slightly more adapted? 

Some cloud was starting to roll in from the West and with temperature now at -1C I decided to pack up and reflect on what I felt was a more organised evening. Tuesday looks the best of the forecasts this week so fingers crossed.

 

[Pixies]

1 hour ago, Stardaze said:

There was a break in cloud just after dusk for a few hours and so I grabbed the opportunity until midnight, being off from work too this week. Meteoblue had the seeing down as poor and so I confirmed that whilst realigning my finder scope. I think it did improve a little throughout the session but it wasn't great. Thanks to @Pixiesfor the SkySafari star hopping tip, worked a treat at the eyepiece last night, I seemed to get my eye into the finder scope much better tonight.

Started working upwards from Vindmiatrix.

M60 - Nice a distinct.

M59 - Similar to M60, both stand out well as a good starting point.

M58 - Notably lower in brightness than M59, no detail.

Virgo A - Seemed brighter last week from memory?

Markarian's Chain - I sketched this out from memory when I got back in to compare as it's my first near full chain viewed (must download SkySafari Plus later as there's only 2 galaxies noted on the basic version). M84 and M86 were easy to find, like previously. NGC 4435 & NGC 4438 stood out together quite well and I found the bottom end after a minute or so (NGC 4473 & NGC 4477) but I really had to sit there for a few minutes to wean out NGC 4461, but no sign of a companion tonight.

M99 (Coma Pinwheel) - Certainly spread out without a bright core to it. 

M98 - Another one ticked off.

M100 - Wasn't a great view but I was most pleased with the hunt and my ability tonight to find these in succession.

M3 - Didn't resolve as well as last week, stars still lacking contrast even at x157.

Melotte 111 - Observed this in the bino's early evening. Looked pretty good in the 10x50's.

M51 - I was dying to drop in on my old favourite, now very close to zenith. I spent two stints searching hard for some structure, I could see the nebulosity around the core more clearly one side than the other but no separation. 

M101 - Location of the Pinwheel always seems simple up to the last couple of degrees, following the line from Mizar. It's the first time this year I have stopped by here. Because of how dim she appears tonight I over ran it to begin with, but once found, she was extremely dim. On paper, much brighter than M51 at mag 7.86 (brighter than most observed tonight) but assume the area must be less condensed and so there wasn't much to see and report.

M81 & M82 - First time here too this year for me. One of my 'go-to's' from last year and I'd remembered @Stuposting a simple location hop recently, which worked a treat. Both stood out well and I felt that transparency had improved a little, or maybe that I had relaxed off and had my eye slightly more adapted? 

Some cloud was starting to roll in from the West and with temperature now at -1C I decided to pack up and reflect on what I felt was a more organised evening. Tuesday looks the best of the forecasts this week so fingers crossed.

 

Nice report. You seem to be getting your eye in now.

Up here, last night's transparency wasn't as good as the end of last week. The sky was jus a little brighter. I've been using M51 as a transparency check at the start of recent sessions and I couldn't see any 'join' last night.

There are so many Messier objects in and around Virgo, I've actually started knocking them off a list. Looks like a little Messier-bagging work to do this year. Hopefully we get lots of further clear nights.

[Stardaze]

19 minutes ago, Pixies said:

Nice report. You seem to be getting your eye in now.

Up here, last night's transparency wasn't as good as the end of last week. The sky was jus a little brighter. I've been using M51 as a transparency check at the start of recent sessions and I couldn't see any 'join' last night.

There are so many Messier objects in and around Virgo, I've actually started knocking them off a list. Looks like a little Messier-bagging work to do this year. Hopefully we get lots of further clear nights.

I still need to get better organised, I like the idea of SkySafari logging reports. Busy painting today so I’ll have to download it later. 

[Pixies]

Just now, Stardaze said:

Busy painting today

Ah - that sort of "off from work". I assume it's emulsion, not a landscape?

[Stardaze]

1 minute ago, Pixies said:

Ah - that sort of "off from work". I assume it's emulsion, not a landscape?

Definitely emulsion. Hall/Stairs/Landing, lovely job..not. A week off full of ‘jobs’ 😂

[westmarch]

11 hours ago, Stardaze said:

There was a break in cloud just after dusk for a few hours and so I grabbed the opportunity until midnight, being off from work too this week. Meteoblue had the seeing down as poor and so I confirmed that whilst realigning my finder scope. I think it did improve a little throughout the session but it wasn't great. Thanks to @Pixiesfor the SkySafari star hopping tip, worked a treat at the eyepiece last night, I seemed to get my eye into the finder scope much better tonight.

Started working upwards from Vindmiatrix.

M60 - Nice a distinct.

M59 - Similar to M60, both stand out well as a good starting point.

M58 - Notably lower in brightness than M59, no detail.

Virgo A - Seemed brighter last week from memory?

Markarian's Chain - I sketched this out from memory when I got back in to compare as it's my first near full chain viewed (must download SkySafari Plus later as there's only 2 galaxies noted on the basic version). M84 and M86 were easy to find, like previously. NGC 4435 & NGC 4438 stood out together quite well and I found the bottom end after a minute or so (NGC 4473 & NGC 4477) but I really had to sit there for a few minutes to wean out NGC 4461, but no sign of a companion tonight.

M99 (Coma Pinwheel) - Certainly spread out without a bright core to it. 

M98 - Another one ticked off.

M100 - Wasn't a great view but I was most pleased with the hunt and my ability tonight to find these in succession.

M3 - Didn't resolve as well as last week, stars still lacking contrast even at x157.

Melotte 111 - Observed this in the bino's early evening. Looked pretty good in the 10x50's.

M51 - I was dying to drop in on my old favourite, now very close to zenith. I spent two stints searching hard for some structure, I could see the nebulosity around the core more clearly one side than the other but no separation. 

M101 - Location of the Pinwheel always seems simple up to the last couple of degrees, following the line from Mizar. It's the first time this year I have stopped by here. Because of how dim she appears tonight I over ran it to begin with, but once found, she was extremely dim. On paper, much brighter than M51 at mag 7.86 (brighter than most observed tonight) but assume the area must be less condensed and so there wasn't much to see and report.

M81 & M82 - First time here too this year for me. One of my 'go-to's' from last year and I'd remembered @Stuposting a simple location hop recently, which worked a treat. Both stood out well and I felt that transparency had improved a little, or maybe that I had relaxed off and had my eye slightly more adapted? 

Some cloud was starting to roll in from the West and with temperature now at -1C I decided to pack up and reflect on what I felt was a more organised evening. Tuesday looks the best of the forecasts this week so fingers crossed.

 

You've inspired me to get the dob out tonight and head to my local dark sky spot.  Time for some galaxy hunting around Coma Berenices.  It looks like a cold but clear night in Yorkshire.

Many thanks.

 

John

[Stardaze]

1 minute ago, westmarch said:

You've inspired me to get the dob out tonight and head to my local dark sky spot.  Time for some galaxy hunting around Coma Berenices.  It looks like a cold but clear night in Yorkshire.

Many thanks.

 

John

Super John, glad to have inspired someone to make the most of it. I’m feeling a bit too tired tonight, have my new binos at the ready instead. Hoping tomorrow is still on, though forecast has degraded a little since yesterday. Be sure to let us know how you get on!

[Pixies]

I'm going to have another shot tonight. Just a quickie, though, as I'm knackered now.

That's 5 clear nights out of 7 up here! And it even looks like we might have 2 more to come.

[Stardaze]

1 hour ago, Pixies said:

I'm going to have another shot tonight. Just a quickie, though, as I'm knackered now.

That's 5 clear nights out of 7 up here! And it even looks like we might have 2 more to come.

Clouded over again just now, forcing me in. Had an enjoyable hour with the binos.

[westmarch]

There are some nights when it all just comes together.  Local dark sky site, moonless night, excellent seeing and transparency, dry with a low dew point, Virgo and Coma high in the sky and enough night hours to leisurely scan their galaxy clusters.  The kit all worked, I hadn’t left the illuminated reticle or the red spot finder on last time out, so the batteries were good.  The equatorial platform performed flawlessly, meaning that by the time you consulted Sky Safari, the star hopping point you were at had not moved out of the field of view.  

Four hours spent teasing detail out of Virgo galaxies I had missed in the past and the Coma Berenices galaxies.  Main EPs were Explore Scientific 68o 20, 15 and 12mm.

M61  Identified as a faint round fuzzy. No real detail visible but bright core on direct vision.

M49  Mistook this for a star but fuzzy edges gave it away. Accessory star visible adjacent to it.

NGC 4526   Identified as a faint oval fuzzy, a short star hop from M49.

NGC 4762  Faint but clear vertical needle shaped fuzzy with a bright core, in direct vision

NGC 5248  Tried but could not find this one.

M91  Faint circular shaped fuzzy with brighter core on averted vision.

M99 Struggled to find this.  Fainter than expected with brighter core in averted vision.

M85 Faint oval smudge. No detail seen.

M64 Black Eye Galaxy  Bright oval fuzzy with some core detail visible in averted vision. 

NGC 4494  Found while star hopping. Faint smudge with brighter core in averted vision.

NGC 4565 Needle Galaxy  Spectacular edge on galaxy - one of the highlights of the evening. Distinct bright central bulge with possible detail of dust lane and well defined, extended arms.

NGC 4631 Whale Galaxy  Difficulty star hopping to this one, probably because it was so high in the sky.  Elongated but asymmetrical fuzzy.  Benefits from time taken to tease out detail. 

NGC 5005 Getting cold by this point.  Struggled with directing the dob but finally found it. Faint elliptical smudge in averted vision with brighter core. Could not identify company  NCG 5003.

That last one was almost vertically overhead, so the movement of the dob wasn’t intuitive and it seemed to have a mind of its own. Consequently I whacked my eye against the eyepiece and this morning have a bruise coming up.  Poetic really, the Black Eye Galaxy session leaves a reminder all of its own! 🧐

Very enjoyable session. Sky Safari comes into its own as a planning tool, a log of the session and when shifting between finder star hopping and upside down, back to front, EP star hopping.  

Thanks once again for motivating me.

John

Edited April 13, 2021 by westmarch
spelling

[Stardaze]

1 hour ago, westmarch said:

There are some nights when it all just comes together.  Local dark sky site, moonless night, excellent seeing and transparency, dry with a low dew point, Virgo and Coma high in the sky and enough night hours to leisurely scan their galaxy clusters.  The kit all worked, I hadn’t left the illuminated reticle or the red spot finder on last time out, so the batteries were good.  The equatorial platform performed flawlessly, meaning that by the time you consulted Sky Safari, the star hopping point you were at had not moved out of the field of view.  

Four hours spent teasing detail out of Virgo galaxies I had missed in the past and the Coma Berenices galaxies.  Main EPs were Explore Scientific 68o 20, 15 and 12mm.

M61  Identified as a faint round fuzzy. No real detail visible but bright core on direct vision.

M49  Mistook this for a star but fuzzy edges gave it away. Accessory star visible adjacent to it.

NGC 4526   Identified as a faint oval fuzzy, a short star hop from M49.

NGC 4762  Faint but clear vertical needle shaped fuzzy with a bright core, in direct vision

NGC 5248  Tried but could not find this one.

M91  Faint circular shaped fuzzy with brighter core on averted vision.

M99 Struggled to find this.  Fainter than expected with brighter core in averted vision.

M85 Faint oval smudge. No detail seen.

M64 Black Eye Galaxy  Bright oval fuzzy with some core detail visible in averted vision. 

NGC 4494  Found while star hopping. Faint smudge with brighter core in averted vision.

NGC 4565 Needle Galaxy  Spectacular edge on galaxy - one of the highlights of the evening. Distinct bright central bulge with possible detail of dust lane and well defined, extended arms.

NGC 4631 Whale Galaxy  Difficulty star hopping to this one, probably because it was so high in the sky.  Elongated but asymmetrical fuzzy.  Benefits from time taken to tease out detail. 

NGC 5005 Getting cold by this point.  Struggled with directing the dob but finally found it. Faint elliptical smudge in averted vision with brighter core. Could not identify company  NCG 5003.

That last one was almost vertically overhead, so the movement of the dob wasn’t intuitive and it seemed to have a mind of its own. Consequently I whacked my eye against the eyepiece and this morning have a bruise coming up.  Poetic really, the Black Eye Galaxy session leaves a reminder all of its own! 🧐

Very enjoyable session. Sky Safari comes into its own as a planning tool, a log of the session and when shifting between finder star hopping and upside down, back to front, EP star hopping.  

Thanks once again for motivating me.

John

Superb John 😀

I might add to my Virgo list using some of those. ClearOutside has changed again here; 2 days ago, tonight looked to be as good as it gets, but now very patchy. Thursday may be my best opportunity to take the dob for a drive. We’re having a family day out today and I might take the scenic drive back to recce the spot I have been thinking of. 

How dark is your spot? I’m in a bortle 5 here but 20 mins drive south gets me into a 4.

[westmarch]

1 hour ago, Stardaze said:

Superb John 😀

I might add to my Virgo list using some of those. ClearOutside has changed again here; 2 days ago, tonight looked to be as good as it gets, but now very patchy. Thursday may be my best opportunity to take the dob for a drive. We’re having a family day out today and I might take the scenic drive back to recce the spot I have been thinking of. 

How dark is your spot? I’m in a bortle 5 here but 20 mins drive south gets me into a 4.

Hi there,

I’m Bortle 5 here and used to go to a public dark sky centre in the Yorkshire Moors but a Racehorse owner built a stable next door to it with horizontal floodlights, to keep away thieves.  Like you, I have found a Bortle 4 spot  a short drive away where I can park up with a fairly flat and unobstructed horizon.

Good luck with your recce - I used this map to short list some spots and google street view to suss out parking before visiting.

https://www.lightpollutionmap.info/#zoom=6.39&lat=54.4132&lon=-3.0354&layers=B0TFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

John

Edited April 13, 2021 by westmarch
spelling