Equipment suggestions for live viewing

[shirva]

https://www.altairastro.com/Hypercam-IMX178-USB3.0-Colour-EAA-Imaging-Guide-Camera.html

This is a nice camera,, and probably my next camera purchase 

[DorsetBlue]

15 hours ago, shirva said:

https://www.altairastro.com/Hypercam-IMX178-USB3.0-Colour-EAA-Imaging-Guide-Camera.html

This is a nice camera,, and probably my next camera purchase 

I popped into their shop, whilst I was on holiday a few weeks ago.  Had a good long chat - and I am considering this camera too....although they did mention something a bit like a ZWO 1600 is in the design phase too.  Just wish there were more examples of what this camera can do, they said most of their chatter has moved to Facebook, which I am not a huge fan of (prefer forums, probably showing my age).

[shirva]

On 03/03/2017 at 08:53, DorsetBlue said:

I popped into their shop, whilst I was on holiday a few weeks ago.  Had a good long chat - and I am considering this camera too....although they did mention something a bit like a ZWO 1600 is in the design phase too.  Just wish there were more examples of what this camera can do, they said most of their chatter has moved to Facebook, which I am not a huge fan of (prefer forums, probably showing my age).

I prefer forums as well, nightmare trying to find a specific post in Facebook , but it's worth a look to be honest, I have have been a fan of the starvis sensor since it's launch as a CCTV camera over a year ago,, it showed big cats in near pitch dark,, now that was fantastic and given the new generation astronomy software,stacking ect, makes it a really good camera,, I'm shure nick at Altair said it had a cooling fan,, we also spoke about peltier cooling of it,, but to our knowledge at the time nobody had done this mod,, now that would make it an even better camera than it is.

[London_David]

Hi,

Thanks again to everyone who’s commented -- everyone has been really helpful.

I've just got back from holiday and following HiloDon's suggestion I went back and checked the space I have --and I have miscalculated. I do have space for a 6" evolution, indeed, I have just enough space for an 8" Quattro...

I really thought hard about he SCT... The f2 speed is really tempting — but having to switch out the secondary mirror for visual is less appealing, because I would like to sometimes just do visual. However, I’m also really interested in multi-spectral and as I understand it the filter wheel would take up too much space and the drawer solution is sub-optimal… Plus… I've had access to, my Dad’s 8" SCT for a few years and I'd like to try something a little different.

Perhaps those are not the most scientific reasons but...

My intended final set up is:

• Skywatcher Explorer 150pds on a StarDiscovery AZ GoTo

The 8" Quattro is actually what I really want... but back of envelope calculations suggest it weighs in at about 25Kg, with each component (ota, mount, tripod) weighing about 8kg.  Disappointing as it is, I can fit the OTA — but with the bigger mount it’s is too big and heavy for my current location. Not having seen the equipment in person, or tried to lift it / set it up, does this seem correct? It’s not exactly going to be too 

Martin -- I believe this must be similar to what you have? And I assume this is quite a hefty setup.

The Skywatcher Explorer 150pds on a StarDiscovery AZ GoTo is so much lighter. I'm thinking I go cheap and play with the 150pds in my small apartment for a year or two then upgrade to something bigger when I move house and have more space.

I do have reservations about the mount, but willing to take a chance.

The 150pds OTA is 4.9Kg but then I’m adding maybe 1Kg for the camera and filter wheel. The SkyWatcher load is described as 5kg, however, the Orion StarSeeker which seems to be exactly the same is rated for 6Kg. Either way I know I’m pushing the mount. But I don’t want to have to move up. I basically can’t — the EQ5 is too getting big again. 

Am I crazy?

Again, my aim is not to shoot more than 30 second subs, mainly keep them under 10. Plus, I mainly want to see objects and investigate, rather than make pretty pictures.

Should I just drop down again to the 130PDS and then weight is not an issue?

Would it make a noticeable difference to EAA speed?

I have no idea how much that at 33% smaller aperture will effect EAA viewing. Is there somewhere way I could get a sense of comparison?  

The Camera...

I'm edging towards a Lodestar X2 with an SX filter wheel. But this is a struggle for me. I want a bigger sensor and more resolution... But I would prefer to use the Starlight Live software.

This also may be nonsense but my gut says that the CCD Lodestar is less suited to short subs than the CMOS ASI cameras.  

I have tried loading up other software options and Starlight Live seems the most polished and stable. Perhaps it’s the demo mode, but I was very disappointed that AstroLive would barely load in Camera Simulation mode. It kept crashing on me (also, I’m on a macOS Seirra, though I’m happy to use parallels). And it seems to have been discontinued. All of which makes me a bit nervous.

Can anyone tell me of a good or bad live experience with AstroLive and a ZWO camera? Have I just had bad luck with AstroLive not running in simulation mode on a Mac? What can Starlight Live do that AstroLive can’t.

I assume Starlight Live can't be made to support ZWO cameras with additional drivers?

And @shirva what have you seen of the Altair Astro cameras... Having just seen the Altair Astro Hypercam 174 Mono (https://www.altairastro.com/Altair-Hypercam-IMX174-USB3.0-Mono-Guide-Imaging-Camera.html) that is marketed as and EAA camera, and uses the same chip as the ZWO… though I don’t know what filter wheel would work with it.

If you’re thinking this will be your next purchase… Have you used the software? Is it as good as Starlight Live? 

Thanks again,
David

 

[Robrj]

I've tried Astrolive.  I had problems with it crashing and certain aspects of it not working right or me not knowing what to do with it (e.g. models).  If I use my ZWO, I prefer Sharpcap.  Sharpcap is currently in development and progressing whereas Astrolive USB isn't.  Kyle Goodwin, the author of Astrolive, has mentioned open sourcing the software to allow others to continue developing on it as he doesn't have the time.  Sharpcap is moving toward a premium version that costs a small annual fee for premium features.

The biggest difference between a 5-6" scope and an 8" scope (given the same f/ratio) will be the field of view.  You can still get great images with a smaller scope.  I have a 130SLT that I've used on my AVX mount in addition to an 8" Orion Skyview Pro.  Unfortunately, I don't think I have images of the same thing with the same camera to show a comparison.  I get about a 1 degree field of view with the 130SLT and about 0.6 degrees with Orion 8" using the Ultrastar.

If image size and multispectral with Starlight Live is what you're after I would go with an Ultrastar mono camera.

I have an Astrobin account with images broken down into categories:

https://www.astrobin.com/users/Robrj/collections/

Some of the 130SLT images were taken with the standard alt/az mount.  It usually says in the equipment list which mount I was using.  Doing 30 seconds with an Alt/Az mount will depend on where the object is located.  East/West is usually no problem.  I've done a 45 second exposure on an object in those areas with the 130SLT's mount.  Near the poles, you'll probably be limited to around 15 seconds.

Starlight Live only supports Starlight Xpress products.  You could use a manual filter wheel with it but anything driven requires the Starlight Xpress products.

[Martin Meredith]

Hi David

I think in what you're proposing the mount is the weak point. I believe hard core imagers take the official rating and halve it. EAA is not quite so demanding but the longest useable sub length is going to be reduced, which might point you more in the ZWO camera direction.

My mount (az-eq6) is much heavier ~ 16kg + 10kg of counterweights. The scope (carbon fibre) is easier to handle than the weight suggests as it is quite short at f/4. I use a very light Rigel unity power finder instead of the supplied finderscope to knock off a few more grams. 

Info on Quattro weights

How far would you need to carry the setup? It can be quite a pain to move all the individual parts and have to setup the entire thing. I'm fortunate in being able to carry it mounted (usually minus one of the counterweights) for a few metres from house to terrace and back, but any further and it would have to be dismantled. A lighter scope/mount would then be the order of the day. But I would still aim for the fastest scope at any given aperture.

Just to add: if I were starting out in EAA with a view to getting into filters, I would start out with a mono camera anyway. It is going to be more sensitive, easier to manipulate in software, and essentially all that is needed to produce good deep views of many objects (particularly galaxies). Most of my sessions are still in mono. I reserve RGB for clusters (I don't do much nebula observing). I started out with a colour Lodestar but as soon as I could I bought a mono and didn't go back to the colour even though it was a while before I got my filters. 

cheers

Martin

 

[shirva]

Hi, ref the software, I haven't tried looking any further into the camera,,than looking at the pretty pictures it does,, by the time I save up the next generation camera will be out lol.

I think you should pop along to an astronomy club and check out kit the members have,, you have some great ideas of what you want but practical wise I think your struggling, the mount is the most important thing in my opinion ,, steady mount and your half way there,

I started with an eq3 pro and am happy with it but slapping on a biggish newt, filter wheel and camera and it starts to show its limitations and that's only working on Ra axis,, slapping it on a alt az mount and in my opinion will be slightly worse as you are then tracking on both axis.

I have an heq5 pro and it's a cracking mount but heavy to lug about but it's  what I think suits my needs.

Being honest I would look at a eq3 pro and a ed80, fit a 0.85 focal reducer to it and you have a decent light weight rig that is ideal for va and visual ,and when you decide to upgrade you can do it in stages,, bigger mount then bigger scope .

[London_David]

Hi Martin,

To answer you Quattro question: I need to carry it quite far — narrow stairs plus to and from a car. So “quite a pain” isn’t going to work for me… hahaha.

Camera wise I'm definitely going mono. I'm quite excited about exploring what I can see in different bands. I think I mentioned before, there was a post you put up of a galaxy and then you overlayed the Ha image that showed up the star forming regions. That kind of thing is much more exciting to me than polishing up long exposures to look beautiful. Similarly, there is another post somewhere showing a relativistic jet from an active galactic nucleus which was a smudge on a b+w image. Again, that is the kind of thing I'm interested in trying to find, not make Hubble. I'm not expecting to see _that_ much with where I am, but I'm hopeful that I'll there will be some interesting stuff I can pick up with a camera. 

But if the Skywatcher mount is not really good enough on the 150pds for even under 30 subs, I see the following options:

Less OTA...
130PDS + StarDiscovery is relatively cheap at less than £500 for both (ota+1kg takes you to ~5/6kg payload limit). Going cheap certainly appeals if I'm not getting exactly what I want right now. 

More mount...
Jumping substantially to the very nice iOptron AZ Pro at £1299 with a 15kg payload capacity on the compact 6kg mount. This at least should do me if I get a Quattro or similar fasts 8" in the next 18 - 24 months. Plus I could double mount another scope on it when I have space. This is my main thought.

A non GoTo Vixen mount -- the Porta 2 rated for 6.8kg.  Add on a Train-n-Track which I imagine takes a bit of learning to use. It may be odd but it's a neat small solution (5.7kg inc tripod for £615). This is weirdly tempting because it’s so small -- and weird.

A motorised Vixen AZ Polaris T style mount, tiny and pretty (8.2kg payload, £619+589+299). But expensive and with some unknowns on the motor GoTo controls. Not so sure about this right now.

With EQ mounts, without seeing them in person I fear they all may be large - especially with the counterweight arm. That said, the EQ3 Pro is rated for 5kg imaging and 7kg for visual. The Celestron AVX looks really nice (£599), but again, probably too big…. but it’s half the price of the iOptron! Hahaha.

More OTA...
Spend more money on the OTA on a ZWO CF 153 (£650) or TS Optics 153 CF. I know nothing of their quality but it would get me to f/4 and 3.8kg. Plus 1 for the camera, totalling ~5. But if what your saying is right, that still might not be stable enough, even with short frames. 

So the question that requires some experience to answer --specifically for EAA with short subs is it better to:

• Loose aperture, go to a 130mm and be a bit more stable on the Star discovery,
• Chance a 150mm on a Star Discovery, Vixen, or EQ3 Pro at the limits because it matters less for short subs, or
• Spend disproportionately on the mount now and get something really nice which should see me through a few OTA set ups -- and even though it's not equatorial, should be fine? 

Thanks again,

David

[London_David]

Hi Shirva,

ED80... Well, that is a thought that would solve all the size problems but also… it’s what started them!

It was meeting someone at an astronomy society last month with an ed80, StarAdventurer block and DSLR that got me looking to buy a telescope in the first place, hahaha!

As it happens the next observing meet up of the society I'm a member of is next week -- I've kind of been on here researching in the meantime trying to educate myself to be able to ask decent questions. Last month I was really clueless and could only ask the most basic questions. I couldn't even tell you what equipment anyone had -- it all looked much the same!!! 

So 80ED refractor —  I didn't think that size of refractor was going to show me the stuff I'm interested in and so decide against it. Please explain that I'm wrong since a smaller scope would make things easier… 

I’m most excited about exploring what's out there in terms of the science. I don't want to compete in astro photographer of the year but as I posted to Martin above, I’m more interested in trying to image interesting things - even if it’s a just tiny smudge of the edge of a galaxy. I want to discover things rather than make things look nice with a camera. Would I be able to do that with an 80mm refractor? 

If I could, to get it fast for EAA I think I’d be looking at something like:

William Optics Star 71 II at f4.9 71/350mm which is £1274 
AltairAstro Lightwave 72/432 f6 £399
Altair Astro Starwave 70/350mm f5 £999
Starwave 72EDR 72/432mm f6 £399 
Skywatcher Esprit 80/400mm f5 £995 4kg
TSOptics 71/347mm f4.9 €1199 2kg
TSOptics 72/400mm f5.5 €675 2kg
TSOptics 80/480 f6 and (379 f4.74 in reducer set up) £689

Knowing nothing of the quality of the optics (other than, you get what you pay for), on bang for buck the TS Optics or the Skywatcher look best to me there. I'm thinking 70mm unless I start thinking about reducers - as the 80 f4.74 TS comes coma corrected set up like that if you want, which is good. That would make sense for eaa. Definitely interested in any ideas about getting the f ratio down. 

Also with the refractor I probably could keep the thing mostly set up on a smaller tripod, reducing set up time to next to zero -- certainly for visual.

However, my knowledge of refractor telescope quality is minimal and have no experience in comparing the effect of aperture between scopes. I know the resolution maths in arc seconds, but what that actually means... I'm not so sure. Just how much do you loose as you drop in aperture?

Am I right in thinking (as with any lens), any given f stop (say f5) should expose as f5 and the FOV at 400 focal length will not too dissimilar (though a bit wider) to the newtonian 130… and so the image should come in at the same speed but less resolution.So… for any given camera it would essentially be like binning 2x2 since the resolution would drop on the smaller aperture, restricting to bigger less detailed objects.

Maybe I’m not going to be able to explore that detail anyway due to light pollution and situation. Less resolution may be okay... I just don't know. 

What do you think?

My impression that more photons are better, even with light pollution and not so great seeing. But I'd be very happy to be wrong! I've always assumed refractors were best for making beautiful wide pictures rather than exploring narrowband detail. 

Anyway... here's what I'm thinking a refractor set up would look like:

• TSOptics Ota f5.5 2kg, £589
• IOptron Cube Pro mount £355 
• ZWO ASI 174 Camera 1kg £647

Which actually takes me back down to exactly my original guess at a budget and is physically much smaller... but can it do the job? 

Also with a sub 5kg payload I have other mounts that I could play with for visual, which would be cool.

Going back to the EQ3 Pro... that was my original first choice too. But with the 130pds... I'm not going to lie -- I have a romantic notion of what a telescope looks like from pictures when I was young -- and it's a Newtonian on an equatorial mount. If I was going to go as big as the EQ3 I'd want to get the 130. 

You are right though -- I think I really need to see a couple of these in person to get a sense of size and weight. The counterweight on the equatorial scares me in terms of additional weight and space. Though I suppose easy to store. 

I did talk to someone a couple of weeks ago an astronomy shop selling cameras who tried to talk to me about astro imaging — and I’m sure he knew what he was talking about to a point — but he was quite dismissive when I was asking about short subs and said a bunch of stuff about CCDs and CMOS that I knew to be untrue… so I figured there might be better knowledge on line!!!

Which definitely seems to be true!

Thanks again,
David

[London_David]

I had a chance to go to a shop and see the equipment today in person, which made things a lot clearer and simpler.

The following will probably be no surprise to many!

The EQ3Pro is actually quite small and compact and I should have no issue with it in terms of space. It also essentially flat packs when you take it apart which makes it relatively easy to move around.

The Celesteon AVX is a nice looking mount in person, though actually quite large, similar in size to the HEQ5. 

Ironically, the small StarWatcher Discovery mount I previously looked at is actually larger and more awkward than I expected because of the plastic arm shape. It's also not very attractive looking.

In addition the 150PDS ota is smaller than I imagined too.

All of which pretty convincingly puts me at onto an EQ3Pro (£399) with a:

-- Skywatcher 150PDS f5 (£219, £618 total), or
-- TS Optics 6" f4 Carbon Fiber (€849[~£745], £1144 total)

I did look at the 80ED which is very compact. I could definitely just leave it out -- so zero set up time for visual which would be fun. It's a possibility, but I'm not sure I'll get out of it what I want. That said, if I upgrade later it would make a nice companion to an 8". 

I'm still unsure about the camera -- the I spoke to was very unconvinced about the Lodestar for imaging and short subs for DSO... but I'll trust the maths (and posts, descriptions and pictures here). I'll probably go for an ASI174 or Lodestar X2 mono. 

@Robrj -- The reason I previously dismissed the Ultrastar mono was @HiloDon saying he'd only recommend it for dark skies and fast optics -- and London definitely doesn't have dark skies...!

As I said, I'm still unsure about the camera. I'll take another look. 

[Robrj]

If I were going for a ZWO mono camera, I'd probably go with the ASI290MM.  It has a much lower read noise than the 174 and is much less expensive.   It would be a great camera for short exposure video astronomy. 

[shirva]

Hi David, it's all about capturing photons lol, the video astronomy side of things have changed a bit over the last couple of years,, video astronomy was a way of getting images to a screen and getting near live experience,, we were all about speed, fast scopes with a wide fov, compared to astrophotography large aperture scopes and long exposure,, these days the methods and cameras almost meet,, where does video astronomy and ap meet nobody knows,, so most are looking for scopes that will do both,, most scopes can do a reasonable job and with the new breed of software it just gets better and better,, but in your case it's down to physical size and you are now finding you have constraints,,  

I know the feeling 

I live in a third storey flat with another flight of stairs to get to the car park,, and it's a struggle, equipment wise.and takes a bit of planning and even then I still struggle, I use the eq3 pro or Skywatcher allview,, bit of weight so it's  two run's to the car,then if it's the eq3, I need a power pack,, I use a 12v 22amp golf cart battery for its compact size,, allview has built in power source ,, scope wise st102 or ed80, dslr and laptop,, picnic fold down table,, lot of kit to move,

But easier than my heq5 pro, twin saddle, 200mm newt,ed80, mini guider and twin DSLRs , no chance moving this size of kit,

I've down sized to Skywatcher allview, modded canon 450d and laptop running backyard Eos and astrotoaster, but even want to go less, and get the new Skywatcher Sam to cut weight and equipment down and run modded DSLR  with laptop,, You would be amazed at what you can capture and doing stacking with astrotoaster even better,, started working with startools software as well.. 

[London_David]

Thanks to everyone for the help, it was all very useful. I have purchased a 150pds with the EQ3Pro GoTo mount.

After a bit more digging (thank you for the suggestion @Robrj ) I've also purchased an ASI290 mono and filter wheel.  Astrojedi's results convinced me...

I'm very interested to see what results I get. There has been a surprising amount of skepticism in person about short subs and using cameras like the Lodestar for galaxies... And heaven forbid a CMOS! camera for anything other  than planetary imaging.

I was tempted by the zwo electronic filter wheel but I decided I'd get setup first and make sure the 290 can do what I want before spending more. Also if the whole thing is a wash out and I can't image or see anything... then the 290 will be pretty decent for the moon anyway which is my second interest after galaxy's. 

What else...

Filters. I was going to buy the Baader CCD LRGB set but the guy in the store said the ZWOs would be good enough and less than half the price. I appreciate that he was trying to save me money but... My priority is the  the Baader 7nm Hii filter and that won't be parfocal with the ZWO. 

What gave me pause was that I could buy an auto focuser for less than the additional cost of the Baader CCD filters over the ZWO. And actually... just how par-focal are filters even from the same set, moving any glass in an optical system tends to make you want to double check focus. 

Are the Baader or ZWO just as good on my setup? Will it have a noticeable effect on exposure time or image quality?

And can anyone recommend an auto focuser for the 150pds?

I assume, also, that the 7nm is recommended over the 35nm? Is there a reason to get the 35nm?  How much will the 7nm extend my 

Are there other things I should be getting (someone mentioned bobs knobs in a post, flocking too)?

Should I bother with a light pollution filter, if I'm going rgb hii and mainly mono plus hii. I assume it would help with the mono  but I also assume it will mess with the IR signal.

Are there any other bits and bobs I should now about that make things easier/better...? 

@martin -- In an earlier post you said that there might be some tweaks to a Newtonian you could recommend… what would you suggest!?

Looking forward to first light!

Thanks!

[Martin Meredith]

Hi David

Glad to see you've now got your kit together. Exciting times! A few comments

I have the Baader set bought as a pack of 8 (3 narrowband, RGB, L and C) at a decent price on Amazon (though it doesn't look like there are any good deals at the moment). I find them parfocal enough for me (I haven't noticed them not being parfocal, that is, although a close inspection might -- or might not -- reveal some issues). I have a motor focuser kit that I bought ages ago and haven't installed. Having got a Bhatinov mask (an *essential* accessory!) I focus once only at the start of the session and it takes about 20 seconds, using the bright star I complete my 2-star alignment on. Perhaps with an autofocuser and the right software you could get away with non-parfocality. I don't know because I've never used an autofocuser. But it might slow you down. For instance, when doing live RGB on clusters I can get the next filter in place and the next exposure going with about a 2s gap... not sure how long an autofocuser would take. You want to minimise gaps between subs if doing live combination simply to make life easier for the stacking/rotation, although tolerances are generally ok.

As part of the filter set I have the Sulphur filter, but have found very few objects so far for which it gives a worthwhile signal for EAA use (the Crab is an exception).

Re light pollution, there is some info here about the gap left between the Baader G and R filters to reduce light pollution from sodium/mercury lamps -- not sure how we stand with LEDs though.

Newtonian tweaks:

* Bob's Knobs for the secondary; if you mention which scope you're using, he'll advise if any are needed for the primary I believe. I didn't need them for my Quattro.

* plastic (milk bottle) washers placed under the tips of the collimation bolts smooth out the jerkiness of secondary motion

(Even so, secondary collimation is a pain! but I think you're at f5 so less critical)

* Flocking at the upper end (Wilco sells cheap suitable material for about £6 a sheet)

* I've also flocked the back of my mirror; this I think helps a bit in reducing the amount of light (think laptop screen?) entering at the mirror cell end of the scope. AstronomyShed have some nice youtube demos showing how much light enters at that point if you're not careful. You can combine with a fan holder too which doubles up as a light shield at that end. I don't use a cooling fan. I put the scope out about 1 hour before I want to start observing (though some of that time is occupied with checking collimation, polar alignment, focusing and gathering darks).

Additional stuff:

I find a good dew/light shield is really helpful. I almost never suffer from mirror dewing up even when the outside of the scope is dripping wet (I live near a reservoir...).

Depending on how much you find your coma, you might want to invest in an autocollimator at some point. But at f5 the case is marginal.

Hope this helps, and looking forward to some nice galaxy pics. 

Martin

 

 

 

 

[London_David]

Thanks again for all the help.

@Martin Meredith - Bahtinov mask arrived this morning! And after playing with focus last night I think I'll go for the parfocal Baader filters, rather than introduce extra complications. I'll work through those extra tweaks! Thanks for all your help. I'll post the first galaxy pic I get back here. 

@Robrj and @HiloDon -- thanks for the camera notes. Also thanks to @Astrojedi who hasn't posted in this thread but has posted lots of useful interesting stuff, including a lot with the ASI Rob suggested which convinced me that it was the best match to take a chance on for mono DSO observing. Plus, if the DSO's prove too difficult to see where I am, the camera should be good for lunar, and in the future I figure it will be a decent guidecam if I decide to upgrade to some as yet unannounced zero noise super sensitive camera.

@shirva to keep things light for portable power, I'm looking at one of these (https://www.firstlightoptics.com/batteries-powerpacks/tracer-12v-10ah-lithium-polymer-battery-pack.html) or (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00YP823NA/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3KPCAN4ISC0PS) or (http://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p5991_TS-Optics-10000-mAh-ultra-flat-Powerbank-for-CCD--mounts--mobile-phone-----.html) for the EQ3 rather than a lead-acid battery. Also -- it should power any other accessories (i.e. computer and camera). I need to figure out the power consumption of the mount first for judging how long they'll run for per Ah. 

So I tried out the new equipment on the last two nights which have been clear and... I can't see Polaris so I've had some trouble aligning, I'm working on some daytime alignment methods, I just haven't figured them out yet with the Synscan GoTo operation. But it was getting late.

I saw Jupiter coming across so, I manually pointed at Jupiter looked visually. It looked like a good sized disc in the 24mm eyepiece, though it was very bright and I couldn't see much detail, which also made the 4 moons harder to see, but it was quite satisfying relative to the 10x50 binoculars I have. I switched out the eyepiece to the ASI -- but before it was set up working properly on the computer, heavy haze set in and all I got in the end was a very fuzzy out of focus smudge...

There will be other clear nights though. Other than alignment, setting up and breaking down has been fast and easy.

The Synscan interfaces with my Mac and PC with no trouble, though the ASI seems to have some teething issues runing to Firecapture through Parallels (I'm sure that a computer setting). I'm also tempted to switch to an Intel Compute Stick like AstroJedi for a super compact setup, though I'm surprised the Atom chip is powerful enough to stack efficiently. Either way, I'm going to get everything running smoothly before adding a new computer... AstroLive USB seems to work smoothly enough on OS X, though I've obviously not tried it much over and above checking to see if frames were coming in and stacking. I also had a copy of Starry Night Pro which interfaces with the Synscan nicely on both Mac and PC. It's quite fun to use that to explore objects and point the telescope. 

As it is the set up is very (for an equatorial mount) light and easily portable. The mount breaks down to a very compact size and you could easily cary it in a small tote bag or backpack (minus the legs, which are also light). Everything else fits in a small shoebox. The OTA I'm hopeful will fit into a padded Manfrotto tripod carry case I have, but I haven't tested that yet.

This should be a great portable rig which is quick to move and set up. Once I figure this Polar alignment out...

Overall -- on first impressions -- I'm very pleased with everything, and looking forward to tracking down some interesting things!

 

[shirva]

Hi, sorry a bit late getting back to you,, very nice battery packs,, and expensive,, I have a compact jump pack that can run the eq3 for a good few hours ,, recommend it to one of the guys on a Facebook astronomy site,, £35 approx,, if you bought two it would fulfill your needs,, without going to the expense of the ones you highlighted,, the eq3 pro runs at 2amps on slewing and less on tracking if I remember correctly,, I use a few different batteries,, a 12v 22amp golf cart battery, and 12v 12 amp mobility scooter batteries as well as the car jump start pack and would not equal the price of one of the ones you have in mind,,, ok three are lead acid but handy tripod weights when sat on tripod tray.

[shirva]

Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322421947890

Had this a few years and works great for a good few hours and comes with a lead that plugs into power socket on the Skywatcher.

Looks dinky, and I was sceptical as well when a rep came in and left one as a demo in the garage I work in,, we are auto electrical services and a garage,, three of us ended up buying them,, they are that good ?

[shirva]

Fantastic advice from all the guys,, it's been a really refreshing experience actually seeing so many folk give great advice and doing it in a keep it simple way that guides but doesn't confuse new astronomers,, I think with all the advice given David has the perfect set up to give him hour's and years of fun in the hobby.

Davy 

[Robrj]

On 3/23/2017 at 04:45, London_David said:

The Synscan interfaces with my Mac and PC with no trouble, though the ASI seems to have some teething issues runing to Firecapture through Parallels (I'm sure that a computer setting). I'm also tempted to switch to an Intel Compute Stick like AstroJedi for a super compact setup, though I'm surprised the Atom chip is powerful enough to stack efficiently. Either way, I'm going to get everything running smoothly before adding a new computer... AstroLive USB seems to work smoothly enough on OS X, though I've obviously not tried it much over and above checking to see if frames were coming in and stacking. I also had a copy of Starry Night Pro which interfaces with the Synscan nicely on both Mac and PC. It's quite fun to use that to explore objects and point the telescope. 

I use the Computestick (V2) with my setup as well.  It's powerful enough.  I've run Sharpcap, Starlight Live (both capturing simultaneously), Stellarium & StellariumScope, and APT w/Astrotortilla for plate solving and slewing the scope.  It handles all that fine.  The only thing you might want to add is a micro-SD card for image storage.  You can also use the card to store programs to keep the "C:\" drive free.  I use a Cirago 6 Port USB 3.0 powered hub w/2 charging ports.  The stick is mounted on the hub and gets it's power from one of the charging ports.  I've also done guiding with PHD2 & the ASI185MC while using Starlight Live and my Ultrastar/Lodestar for video astronomy.

[London_David]

That sounds very good with the Compute Stick. Do you need to tweak anything? I was skeptical with the 2Gb Atom and was tempted to go for something like this (Bben Z8300 4GB, 64GB Mini Desktop Computer or the MINIX Z83-4 with similar specs) a bit larger but I wondered if they'd be more reliable, since there seemed to be some issues with the compute stick.

I read AstroJedi's post that said he needed to turn off some of the software that is pre-installed. Did you have any issues there, or with the USB 3 and ASI camera, or with the WiFi/USB 3 connection?  I read there were issues there too. 

The other question I had was -- do you use a touchscreen to remote desktop in? I was planning to do that but wondered if SharpCap and other software might not have interfaces that were not that useable on a touch screen.

[Robrj]

I've not done much remoting but Astrojedi has.  SonnyE on CN also has some trial and tribulation posts getting his to work remotely.  

Since I do my viewing at the scope, I do live in Southern California after all, I usually remote the other way to my desktop to access Skytools 3 (object database).   I think the USB 3.0 thing does affect the wireless but you can add a cheap wireless antenna that works well.  I bought an "Edimax Ew-7811uac Ieee 802.11ac" off eBay (SonnyE's recommendation).  

http://www.ebay.com/itm/232117550705?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

I didn't do anything to the stick other than add the card and turn off the internal Wifi Adapter so it would use the adapter above.  

If you have a bluetooth keyboard, you'll need a wired keyboard the first time you set it up so you can access it to turn on the Bluetooth.  I'm not sure about a wifi keyboard, you may need to log in the first time to get it to recognize it and install drivers.  But once it's set up, it will connect fine.

[shirva]

Nice one rob,, I'm a fan of the use of the stick,, letting you guy's iron out the bugs before i jump in,, usually other way around with me,,, but I'm edging closer lol,, bought the hitecastro DC focuser from an sgl member and looking at long term of attaching to pc stick and remote focus from it,, byeos ,, looking for stand alone scope full wireless remote control

[stash_old]

17 hours ago, London_David said:

That sounds very good with the Compute Stick. Do you need to tweak anything? I was skeptical with the 2Gb Atom and was tempted to go for something like this (Bben Z8300 4GB, 64GB Mini Desktop Computer or the MINIX Z83-4 with similar specs) a bit larger but I wondered if they'd be more reliable, since there seemed to be some issues with the compute stick.

I read AstroJedi's post that said he needed to turn off some of the software that is pre-installed. Did you have any issues there, or with the USB 3 and ASI camera, or with the WiFi/USB 3 connection?  I read there were issues there too. 

The other question I had was -- do you use a touchscreen to remote desktop in? I was planning to do that but wondered if SharpCap and other software might not have interfaces that were not that useable on a touch screen.

Sharpcap ,Stellarium/Scope etc are not very touch screen friendly - they work but dont react as well IMOH, especially if fat fingered like me, ended up using a touch pen then scraped touch screen route too frustrating and time wasted - the latter being less time for Star gazing. I just RDP or REALVNC from a laptop with a touchpad.

Cant say about "the Stick" but once you have loaded up your Star gazing software - along comes Windows 10 update and bang goes your space - yes you can switch of updates. Plus remember adding all these "addon's" add to the cost of the stick which in the UK retails about £130. So add Edimax aerial etc and you will be up to just sub £200 in no time.

I bought a second hand SFF(small form factor) I5-16gb memory ,500gb storage,8 USB ports and after adding 60GB SSD still only spent £170 inc Windows 64bit Pro and now do avg 7sec Platesolves with APT. There is no software I cant run at the same time and no space problems etc. Yes a few wires but one day!!!!!

Plus I doubt if Astrotoaster/DSS would even run along side Camera software (at reasonable speeds) and something so hungry as Stellarium ( I use CDC much more reliable!) on "The Stick".

It depends on what you want - we would all love no cables / very short cables / only one cable and it can be done but not at £130 IMHO - yes the "Stick" runs as does many other similar types of Micro PC's but think longer term. Note I used a Lynx 1010B (had 3 USB ports ,2 full size) , built in touch screen ,SSD ,Windows 10,2GB memory for a while. Same problems as the Stick.

Shirva is right be one or two steps behind everyone else you will spend more time/money on Tech and forget what you really should be doing STAR GAZING.

[shirva]

Ha ha only behind the times,, because I spent my money on something else ? lol.

But fair's fair, we can't keep letting the same folk take the hit on buying and testing equipment,, we have to work as a team,, which to say I can see that happening again on sgl and that's good for all concerned.

The sticks like a lot of equipment we force into video astronomy use ,will have it's limitations but what doesn't in this game,, we have came a long way from the Samsung scb2000 camera in a short space of time, so I'm in no doubt it's just the first generation pc stick and they will probably be getting the next lot ready as I type lol

[stash_old]

3 hours ago, shirva said:

Ha ha only behind the times,, because I spent my money on something else ? lol.

But fair's fair, we can't keep letting the same folk take the hit on buying and testing equipment,, we have to work as a team,, which to say I can see that happening again on sgl and that's good for all concerned.

The sticks like a lot of equipment we force into video astronomy use ,will have it's limitations but what doesn't in this game,, we have came a long way from the Samsung scb2000 camera in a short space of time, so I'm in no doubt it's just the first generation pc stick and they will probably be getting the next lot ready as I type lol

Notice no one really answered your question on CN about running astrotoaster etc on the Stick - note The Stick is gen 2 (there was a stick gen 1) and gen 3 costs £400 quid - well it is from Intel . The old saying you "don't get owt for nowt" is still true.  True about the SCB2000 but it still works every time I get it out of the box unlike my ZWO 120mm USB camera