My first scope, any advice?

[Ibbe]

I hope this is the correct place, for this kind of thread?

Hi there, I am new on this forum, and also new into looking at the space, through a telescope.

I am thinking about buying a Skymax 127 SynScan AZ goto, as it seems to fit me needs.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/az-goto/skywatcher-skymax-127-synscan-az-goto.html

 

As I am using a wheel chair, I need a scope, with the eye piece at the back of the scope, and also a light scope, I can handle with one hand.

Does any of you nice people who have any advice, pro and cons regarding this type of scope?

Also, any advice regarding eye pieces to buy?

There's a 10 and 25 mm in the set, a 2X DeLuxe (whatever that means?) Barlow with camera adapter, and a 6*30 finderscope.

I want to use the scope for photography of the space object also, so I need a T2 ring for my Canon EOS 6D.

 

Thank you in advance, for all Your kind answers. ?

[Astro Imp]

Hopefully @LukeSkywatcher will be along soon.

[Ricochet]

What sort of photography are you thinking of? Neither the alt/az mount or slow focal ratio of a mak are suitable for DSOs. Lunar/planetary might be ok using a webcam or your camera set to video mode. 

[Ibbe]

34 minutes ago, Ricochet said:

What sort of photography are you thinking of? Neither the alt/az mount or slow focal ratio of a mak are suitable for DSOs. Lunar/planetary might be ok using a webcam or your camera set to video mode. 

I was hoping for planets and nebula and maybe deep sky items. I was told by the sales man, that this scope and mount was ideal for tracking objects with my camera attached to the scope. 

I was/am planning using my Canon EOS 6D for photograping the items, which I also was told that it would be ideal for this purpose.

Why can't I use my camera with long exposure with this mount and motor, but have to use video mode?

 

my first choise regarding scope was a Startravel 120, but If I should have a mount that could be used with a motor, it would be to heavy for me to handle ?Then I looked at the Startravel 102, but though that the Skymax 127 SynScan AZ goto would be a better choise due to the langer diametre, 127 v. 102mm.

 

kind regards

[Louis D]

3 minutes ago, Ibbe said:

Why can't I use my camera with long exposure with this mount and motor?

You could if you take one of the following three approaches to counteract field rotation because the azimuth axis is not aligned with the Earth's axis of rotation:

1. Mount the base on an equatorial wedge to align the azimuth axis with the Earth's axis of rotation.

2. Use a field derotator to rotate the camera the appropriate amount during exposures to counteract field rotation.

3. Use short enough exposures that star trailing won't be visible and then stack the exposures in software.

[Ricochet]

As Louis says, you will have to do something to account for the fact the mount is not equatorial. Option 3, short exposures, is probably the only real choice. The idea of video mode for planets is that it takes many very short exposures and then you use software to combine all the frames into a single image. 

Have a look at this thread to see what sort of DSO photos people have managed using alt/az mounts https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/228101-the-no-eq-dso-challenge/

Pay attention to which images come from which scopes to get an idea of what can be done. 

[Louis D]

I forgot a fourth option for photography with an alt-az:

4. Place the tripod on an equatorial platform.

[Ibbe]

11 hours ago, Louis D said:

I forgot a fourth option for photography with an alt-az:

4. Place the tripod on an equatorial platform.

The sales thread mentions this 

SynScan™ AZ GoTo Computerised Alt-Azimuth HD Go-To Mount

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/az-goto/skywatcher-skymax-127-synscan-az-goto.html

I read this, as If the mount is a Alt-az mount, or am I misunderstanding something? I just wonder why I would be told that it can be used for long exposure

 

But I need a lightweight solution, as I am sitting in a wheel chair, so I has to be able to handle the mount and tri-pod/alt-az with just one hand, when I move the setup in and out of the house.

If I could use both hands, I would have bought the Startravel 120 and a decent alt/az mount. But they are to Big/heavy for me to handle with just using one arm.

 

just a thought, would it be a possibility to remove the scope from the alt/az tri-pod, every time I move the setup around, without ruin any alignments?  If so, then I guess one of the not all to big alt/az could be used. But the scope and tri-pod at once, is to much for me to handle

[Ricochet]

It is an alt/az so not ideal for photography and really long exposures aren't possible. I don't know why you would be told otherwise. 

For any set up it is the alignment of the mount that it important. If the mount doesn't move then I think the alignment should stay. If you move the mount from one place to another then you lose the alignment. You can mark the ground to position the legs of the tripod quickly each time but I don't know how accurate that can be. 

[happy-kat]

Welcome.

Altaz mounts move in tiny left right up down movement so the object is kept in the field of view but these movements do not allow for the earth's rotation. However you can get anything from 15 - 45 seconds before star trailing becomes evident depending where you point in the sky. The mak127 is not ideal for imaging the focal length is very long but the mount could be used with a camera and camera lens. I think @LukeSkywatcher carries a 8 inch mak and tripod but perhaps carries them outside as separate items. Have a look at the No EQ DSO Challenge thread. If it is unrealistic for you to have a quality EQ mount then need to look at what will work for you within what you choose limitations. Is the 6d full frame?

Camera lens like 135mm can frame some DSO very nicely, you might already have a lens selection, primes are best.

[happy-kat]

To think about, what is more important observing or imaging, do you want to find things manually or is goto. If you use go to you'll need to factor in a battery pack and for lightness this may need to be the tracer lipo range to keep the weight down. 

[Ibbe]

My camera is a fullframe, and I got a 24/105mm F/4 and a 70/200mm F/4 and a 50mm F/2.8

 

I am going into the telescope mainly to be able to take good photos of the Moon, planets and nebula. I was told by the sales people the this 127 goto would be ideal for long exposure and therefor good for deepsky, planets and the Moon.

 

now I am really confused!?!

 

what would you recommend, with the limitations I got?

 

kind regards

[Cosmic Geoff]

The 127mm Mak Synscan is a good choice for a beginner, especially if you need the eyepiece to stay in a convenient position. It's essentially the same as my 127mm Mak, except for the software. This outfit is designed for portability and I have taken mine on holiday.  For shifting it around, I usually take the telescope off the mount, not because of the weight but because it doesn't feel good to carry around a cluttered yard with the topweight and the tripod legs sticking out. When the tripod is set for observing, it can't be carried through a domestic doorway. (To get it through a doorway you have to retract the legs which means taking the telescope off.)

You should replace the 10mm eyepiece with a better one ASAP, as it is almost certainly a cheap 3-element type and even a budget Plossl would probably represent an upgrade. When I upgraded the HP eyepiece on mine I was sorry I had not done it sooner.

For photography, you should heed the people telling you that you need something completely different (and more expensive). The mount isn't stiff enough for serious photography and there isn't a 'wedge' readily available. As a disabled person, you probably would not get on well with a heavy-duty powered equatorial mount unless it's permanently installed, but an alt-azimuth GoTo +wedge might be easier to manage.

[newbie alert]

9 minutes ago, Ibbe said:

My camera is a fullframe, and I got a 24/105mm F/4 and a 70/200mm F/4 and a 50mm F/2.8

 

I am going into the telescope mainly to be able to take good photos of the Moon, planets and nebula. I was told by the sales people the this 127 goto would be ideal for long exposure and therefor good for deepsky, planets and the Moon.

 

now I am really confused!?!

 

what would you recommend, with the limitations I got?

 

kind regards

Dont go back to that shop...with that setup you can image the planets and moon but better off with a webcam type rather than a dslr..

For dso you need a equatorial mount..it tracks with earths rotation..

Something very light that will track and you can use a small refracter  and or your dslr(which is a very good camera by the way) is a skywatcher star adventurer..can be mounted on the ball head of your tripod..some people are getting 10 min exposures on theirs...check them out,around £300..and a small refracter...look at altair ones

[ronin]

For astrophotography, and that aspect being DSO imaging, then the requirements are fairly simple: Equitorial mount with motors (minimum) but preferably goto and a relatively small fast scope.

If the mount is not equitorial then it will not track correctly, if the scope is "slow" and long focal length then you are simply creating troubles in getting images. Longr exposures are required and the system is more prone to vibrations which can render exposures unusable.

The one exception is imaging planets where for assorted reasons you can manage to use a Mak/SCT and an alt/Az mount at least for a short time. The point to take into consideration here is the planets amount to Jupiter, Saturn and Mars. So the imaging possibilities are limited.

Not sure why you have been told the Alt/Az 127 is good as really wrong mount and wrong scope. Unless you want an image of Jupiter in 3 months.

Seems that the manufacturers now are enabling a DSLR to be attached to their scopes and then claiming it is suitable for imaging. It is not in reality, bit like putting "S" on the rear of a car does not actually make it a sports model suited for the race track.

Are there any clubs within reach of you? Just that seeing equipment in use is likely to be a great help. I would have guessed that a suitable scope for you is a refractor, as the tail end sticks out a bit more. The somewhat workhorse of the Skywatcher ED80 being useful for both reasonable imaging and reasonable visual, and not overly heavy as it is a doublet not a triplet.

Mount/tripod is a different matter, would half suspect that the tripod legs would hinder access. Hence the idae of visit a club.

[happy-kat]

I think it would be a good idea to learn and understand more about imaging so you can make the right choice for your needs and circumstance.

This thread is members who are imaging with their AltAz mounts for various reasons be it is kit they already have or because the setup is lighter and portabe which they need though they are using camera and lens, or camers and reflector or camera and refractor as all shorter and much faster then maks are.

No EQ DSO Challenge thread

This book is all about imaging and uses EQ mounts.

Making every Photon Count

 

This book is understanding imaging using the limitations of an AltAz mount.

Astrophotography on the Go

The mak127mm I think would be great for the Moon and planets to observe and capture, I have not used one but see other people's reviews. You can use a webcam to good effect to capture them as they take video and the image will appear bigger.

[Ibbe]

So I would want a tri pod like this one?
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts/skywatcher-eq3-2-deluxe.html

This is a EQ3-2. Then I need a sort of motor, and as I do like the idea of the GoTo Versions, would that work, or is the GoTo not good at all for when it comes to photography?

I also need a scope of course, to mount on tri pod, how would a Skywatcher Startravel 120 fit my needs, which is, for now, Photographing the space ie planets moon and Nebula

When it comes to move the gear out of, and back into my house, would I be able to take the telescope off the mount, to make it easier for me to handle?

 

I am sorry for all my questions, but as I am set back to square one now, as I thought I had found all I needed, according to the local shop, where I was going to make the deal. But guess I will be dealing online instead, when I get my new setup sorted out!  

[Ibbe]

34 minutes ago, happy-kat said:

I think it would be a good idea to learn and understand more about imaging so you can make the right choice for your needs and circumstance.

This thread is members who are imaging with their AltAz mounts for various reasons be it is kit they already have or because the setup is lighter and portabe which they need though they are using camera and lens, or camers and reflector or camera and refractor as all shorter and much faster then maks are.

No EQ DSO Challenge thread

This book is all about imaging and uses EQ mounts.

Making every Photon Count

 

This book is understanding imaging using the limitations of an AltAz mount.

Astrophotography on the Go

The mak127mm I think would be great for the Moon and planets to observe and capture, I have not used one but see other people's reviews. You can use a webcam to good effect to capture them as they take video and the image will appear bigger.

I will read all this later, maybe tomorrow. I can't do it now, I am using heave dosis of morphine due to chronical pain. So getting tired quickly and will loose focus.

 

Just wanted to explain, why I hvan´t read it yet.

 

Kind regards

[Louis D]

8 hours ago, Ibbe said:

I will read all this later, maybe tomorrow. I can't do it now, I am using heave dosis of morphine due to chronical pain. So getting tired quickly and will loose focus.

God speed to you, good sir.  I will say that observing under the stars once you're all set up is very therapeutic and calming.

My dad spent quite a bit of time in a wheel chair, and getting up to a telescope eyepiece would have been very challenging for a tripod mounted one.  The chair would bump into the tripod legs.

Perhaps you could start off with something small, light, and compact like the Skywatcher Heritage-130p Flextube.  If you could rig up some sort of clamped arm to your wheel chair to mount the scope to (I think you could mount a 3/8" bolt through the bottom), you could observe super easily.  You'd have to sit really still at high power, but it would be an awesomely comfortable way to observe.  Even simpler would just be some sort of wheelchair attached lap table that you just place the scope base on to observe from.

[Ibbe]

On ‎21‎-‎01‎-‎2017 at 23:39, Louis D said:

My dad spent quite a bit of time in a wheel chair, and getting up to a telescope eyepiece would have been very challenging for a tripod mounted one.  The chair would bump into the tripod legs.

 

That is also why I am only looking a telescopes, where the eyepiece are located at the back end of the telescope, like on the Skymax 127, or the SkyWatcher Startravel 102/120

 

Kind regards

[Ibbe]

I am sorry to be pestering you all, with my questions, but as I wrote earlier in this thread, I am now back at square one, as I thought that I had it all planned.

 

Could a tripod like this work?
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts/skywatcher-eq3-2-deluxe.html

That is a EQ3-2. I will need some sort of a motor, but as I do like the idea of the GoTo Versions, would that work, or is the GoTo not good at all for when it comes to photography?

I also need a scope , to mount on the tripod , would a Skywatcher Startravel 120 fit my needs, which would be, for now, Photographing planets, moon and Nebulas.

When it comes to move the gear out of, and back into my house, would I be able to take the telescope off the mount, to make it easier for me to handle?

 

PS It the thread is to long to read, then I am looking for a scope, where the eyepiece are located at the bottom at the scope, as I am sitting in a wheel chair

 

[Cosmic Geoff]

What is your budget? You can get that mount with motors or in a GoTo version. 

The only good things about the Startravel is that is short, has a wide field of view, and is relatively cheap. They have noticeable chromatic aberration.

A short focal length ED or APO refractor would fill the requirement of an eyepiece at the back that does not change position too much. And be ideal for astrophotography (but the astro-photographers will advise you better). These scopes are very expensive.

Alternatively, get the 127 Mak you saw first, plus another small mount that will track a camera, camera+telephoto, or a camera + small scope. (Somebody will advise you on the latter, I'm sure.)

You might be well advised to get yourself to an astronomical telescope specialist store and get them to show you this gear in the metal.

[Ibbe]

My budget, I would say 800-850 Euro give and take 50 Euro. If some of you fine people point me to a solution that would cost a bit more, but is a bit more expensive, then I will rather save up more, and wait to get the right solution.

I would like to include a few eyepieces in this budget, and if possible a small power tank, but first priority is the posibility to take photos with the setup, so power tank I will add later, rather then compromise with the telescope and photo options.

 

I have been at the local store, but appetently I have been getting wrong advice there 

kind regards

[Louis D]

34 minutes ago, Ibbe said:

I have been at the local store, but appetently I have been getting wrong advice there 

Did you try rolling up to each type of telescope and mount combination to see which would work best for your situation?  This would include moving the telescope up, down, and around to judge how difficult it is to look into the eyepiece for each.

[Ibbe]

On 24/1/2017 at 21:28, Louis D said:

Did you try rolling up to each type of telescope and mount combination to see which would work best for your situation?  This would include moving the telescope up, down, and around to judge how difficult it is to look into the eyepiece for each.

I can get close, when items are located on a tri-pod.

I am also sometimes using tri-pod when taking pictures, with my Canon EOS. ?

 

Kind regards ?