Eyepieces

[Louis D]

16 hours ago, Charic said:

Unfortunately, as good as the Skyliner is, my scope is resting (hibernating) because I have twilight conditions here at present, so it never  gets dark enough to get the best from any DSO observations.

That has got to be a major bummer.   Living at 30 degrees north latitude, I've never had to deal with twilight conditions throughout the night.  Here, I can't observe at night in the summer because the bugs attack ferociously, especially this year after our flooding spring rains.

[Charic]

.......we have  biting Scottish midges! Their not everywhere, but certain habitats will have them in their thousands, nae, millions, they  eat you alive?

As for the lighter nights here, I have been tempted to buy a traditional, smaller scope (refractor)  for Planetary work but I reckon the results will not be any better than i experience now, plus my restricted views of the skies from my  home observatory limit much of my viewing experience full stop.
I've  also read on many occasions, that its not really a different scope I need, its more aperture (greater light gathering) capturing fainter targets  even when conditions are brighter?

Failing more aperture (bigger scope) there's always the Moon, so easy to look at and track with my Skyliner, so all is not lost.

[Sanj Ara]

I'm sure most of you will find it surprising to hear that night skies in sunny Southern California have been super cloudy the past few weeks. Today however is a different story. Clear skies. And I just got my new Meade 9mm (5000 series 60HD) in the mail.  Excited to observe tonight. 

[Sanj Ara]

Wow. The difference in image quality between the Meade 9mm and the 10mm eyepiece that came with the Tel is night and day. Jupiter looks like a light bulb with the stock eyepiece. Meade clearly showed the bands. I also saw 3 moons of Jupiter. Amazing. 

But i couldn't see Saturn clearly. Do I need A more powerful eyepiece for that?

[cloudsweeper]

Saturn plus rings is about the same size as Jupiter, so you should see it easily.  It's beautiful, unmistakable!  Depending on conditions, too much mag can make a planet look blurry, and better, crisper views are obtained with lower mags.  Get Saturn in the EP (low mag initially) as you did with Jupiter, then experiment with different magnifications.  If it wasn't clear (as you say), I suspect you were using too much mag.  (Or were there hazy clouds about??)

Doug.

[Sanj Ara]

Hi Doug, first of all cool username. 

Not many clouds tonight. Jupiter was mindblowing. I'm new to stargazing and this was my true first crisp view of Jupiter. I'm a happy camper even if I didn't have the same luck with Saturn. I'll try what you said tomorrow (assuming clear skies). 

 

 

[cloudsweeper]

Sanj - glad you're enjoying all this.  The more you look, the more you see - more bands on Jupiter, a hint of colour, etc..  The dance of his moons from night to night is good to behold too.  As I said, Saturn is just stunning - a bit harder to get much detail from, but those rings!  And you should spot at least a couple of moons.  (Averted vision helps.)  Check what you observe against Stellarium.

Doug.

[Ricochet]

The other thing to remember is that the lower an object is in the sky the more atmosphere you have to look through. Saturn is lower in the sky than Jupiter at the moment and so the views will be more affected by the atmosphere. If you can time your viewing for when Saturn is at its highest you should find you get a better view. 

[Mak the Night]

There are apps that tell you when Saturn is at Transit, Planetarium on Android is one I find useful.

Planetarium

[Sanj Ara]

Thanks. I will check out this app. 

[Sanj Ara]

Doug, Ricochet and MTN, just wanted to let you guys know that I managed to focus in on Saturn and it was amazing. Thanks for all your advice. Also Jupiter's 4 moons were visible today.

Mars looks more like a large glowing ball and less like a planet. Is it because it's close to the moon or my 9mm eyepiece is not the right tool for viewing Mars. 

[cloudsweeper]

14 minutes ago, Sanj Ara said:

Doug, Ricochet and MTN, just wanted to let you guys know that I managed to focus in on Saturn and it was amazing. Thanks for all your advice. Also Jupiter's 4 moons were visible today.

Mars looks more like a large glowing ball and less like a planet. Is it because it's close to the moon or my 9mm eyepiece is not the right tool for viewing Mars. 

Great news!  

Mars is a lot smaller, and it is harder to get much detail from it - especially when low in the sky.  You might see a hint of polar cap, or a couple of darker areas.  And the same comment applies - too much mag and it goes fuzzy.  (I doubt the Moon would have much effect on viewing a bright object like Mars however.)

Doug.

[rockystar]

Glad you got Saturn, lovely view. You should be able to get 3-5 moons in your 8" too.

I've never had any luck with getting any detail out of mars.

[Mak the Night]

7 hours ago, Sanj Ara said:

Doug, Ricochet and MTN, just wanted to let you guys know that I managed to focus in on Saturn and it was amazing. Thanks for all your advice. Also Jupiter's 4 moons were visible today.

Mars looks more like a large glowing ball and less like a planet. Is it because it's close to the moon or my 9mm eyepiece is not the right tool for viewing Mars. 

When Mars is particularly low it can suffer from a phenomenon known as 'atmospheric boiling' as you are effectively viewing it through a great many kilometres of atmosphere. Not unlike Jupiter, patience and sustained observing will be needed to tease out detail. Mars responds well to filters. The Baader Neodymium filter is particularly useful I find. Wratten No. 8 and No. 12 yellow contrast (minus blue) filters work well by sharpening the contrast of the maria (seas) on the surface. The Yellow-Green No.11 can also have a similar effect even darkening the maria to make them more visible.

I saw Syrtis Major last night with the help of Baader Neodymium, Light Yellow and Yellow-Green filters.

The Wratten No.11 Yellow-Green filter makes the Cassini Division much more visible and even improves cloud detail on Saturn. Coloured filters aren't necessarily expensive and you should be able to buy some GSO (mine are mostly Celestron and TS Optics/GSO) fairly cheaply.

[Sanj Ara]

Thanks for the info. I don't have any filters yet. Will definitely need to get some. Since I'm new to this, I Was thinking I should spend several months observing the planets and the moon with different eyepieces and filters before attempting to observe DSOs. So will spend time on eyepieces 10mm or smaller. As of now I only have the stock 10mm that came with the Dob and the Meade 9mm. A lot of people recommend 6mm or 5mm EP for planetary work. And I have been reading up on Televue Ethos and Delos and BAader Hyperian. All of these are expensive. specially Ethos - over $500. Delos and Basder around $250 range. I'm wondering if there is a definite correlation between price and quality of image and whether I need a 5mm for my Dob. If best mag is 200x then the math says to get a 5mm. Any advice would be appreciated. 

[Mak the Night]

20 minutes ago, Sanj Ara said:

Thanks for the info. I don't have any filters yet. Will definitely need to get some. Since I'm new to this, I Was thinking I should spend several months observing the planets and the moon with different eyepieces and filters before attempting to observe DSOs. So will spend time on eyepieces 10mm or smaller. As of now I only have the stock 10mm that came with the Dob and the Meade 9mm. A lot of people recommend 6mm or 5mm EP for planetary work. And I have been reading up on Televue Ethos and Delos and BAader Hyperian. All of these are expensive. specially Ethos - over $500. Delos and Basder around $250 range. I'm wondering if there is a definite correlation between price and quality of image and whether I need a 5mm for my Dob. If best mag is 200x then the math says to get a 5mm. Any advice would be appreciated. 

TeleVue EP's are certainly worth their value and have excellent build quality, but there are many lesser priced that will do the job virtually as well. Don't limit yourself to 200x, I can often get 250x at least on most planetary objects, although light pollution isn't a huge problem for me, as I live at a relatively high altitude above sea level in the greenbelt a few kilometres from any city lights. Baader eyepieces and equipment are expensive Stateside, they can be considerably cheaper in Europe.

Filters don't have to be that expensive though, especially coloured Wratten ones. I've attached a couple of PDF's you may find interesting. It's probably a good plan to concentrate on planets for a bit, but there are plenty of fairly easily found Messier Objects as well.

SAS-The-Use-of-Astronomical-Filters1.pdf

Eastman Kodak Company ~ Transmission of Wratten Filters.pdf

[jetstream]

Sanj, do you let your scope equalize temperature before lunar/planetary? Also is your scope collimated properly? These 2 things are crucial for good viewing of the moon and planets as is the seeing (both sky and local).

As has been said, view the planets at their highest really helps.

Once you can get Mars as a sharp orange ball in your telescope with the 9mm, its time to up the mag. Saturn will show its rings @133x if the above is under control.

Have fun!

[Mak the Night]

I actually saw Saturn's rings quite distinctly at only 28x a few nights ago and I don't think it had even reached Transit. They were tiny, but quite visible.

[Sanj Ara]

I leave the Dob out on the balcony for 15 to 20 mins before observing. Also I collamate using a Meade laser collamator once a week. I keep the Dob indoors when not observing to prevent any dust going in the tube. Is there any other housekeeping items I need to be aware of?

 

Does anyone know the difference between Televue Ethos and Delos in terms of image quality? Alternatively if I simply get a 2x Barlow with my 9mm will that give the same effect as with s 4.5mm? If so any suggestions for a good Barlow? 

 

[Sanj Ara]

I leave the Dob out on the balcony for 15 to 20 mins before observing. Also I collamate using a Meade laser collamator once a week. I keep the Dob indoors when not observing to prevent any dust going in the tube. Is there any other housekeeping items I need to be aware of?

 

Does anyone know the difference between Televue Ethos and Delos in terms of image quality? Alternatively if I simply get a 2x Barlow with my 9mm will that give the same effect as with s 4.5mm? If so any suggestions for a good Barlow? 

 

[jetstream]

You can defocus on a bright star and see any thermals in your scope, from the boundary layer crawling to tube thermals and once these are under control things improve dramatically. Have you check your collimation result on a star, either on the airy pattern or (more commonly) on a defocused star to see if the secondary shadow in centered? A common accurate collimation tool is a sight tube/Cheshire combination tool.Highly recommended.

Ethos vs Delos... a personal thing really- myself I love Ethos for Hyperwide neb viewing and clusters and the Delos for lunar/planetary. They both have very good glass/coatings- and contrast.

[Sanj Ara]

this is the collamator I have... It helps to align the mirrors easily. I'm not sure I follow your comments on "thermals in uour scope". I need to read up on it a bit. 

 

 

 

[Dave In Vermont]

Have you ever been on a highway in a car when it was hot outside - and down the highway it looks like there's a large pool of water that's rippling? Like it was being stirred? That's an effect of what 'thermals' can do inside the telescope with hot air inside it - meeting cooler air coming in to meet it.

This is why a telescope needs to be taken outside and allowed to adjust to the outside temperature prior to using it, for the best image quality.

Dave

[rockystar]

with your laser, try putting it on something stable where you can spin it around (some kind of fashioned V-block) point it at a wall at least 10 feet away and see if the point stays in the same place or if it draws a circle - if it draws a circle you'll need to collimate the laser (this is why some people prefer a Cheshire).

[Sanj Ara]

thanks for the explanation. I do leave the Dob out for 15 to 20 minutes before viewing. I assume that's sufficient considering it never gets too cold in Southern California.