Imaging setup - opinions please :-)

[FLO]

Have spent the last month trying to persuade myself to settle on a set-up based around an Atik 16 CCD imager but have gradually weakened to the point where I am dangerously close to placing an order with Ian King imaging for a SXV H9 and SXV Guide Camera :toothy5:

I would be grateful for your thoughts on the following set-up (perhaps what I really need is a bucket of cold water thrown over me!!!).

SXV H9 mono with SXV Guide Camera

Baader LRGB filter set (I understand Baader's imaging filters are parfocal)

Baader Narrowband H-alpha Filter (7nm)

Scopeteknix CCD filter wheel

Maxim DL CCD software

The plan is to use it initially with a Skywatcher ED80 PRO with a Skywatcher ST80 as a guide-scope (would much prefer a ZS66!) on a HEQ5 PRO or EQ6 PRO.

I am also seriously contemplating a Skywatcher Explorer 250px f4.8 OTA with a Moonlite focuser and Baader MPCC coma corrector. At 1200mm it'll give me double the ED80's focal length and apparently 1200mm produces 1 arc-second per pixel when used with a SXV H9, which is it's sweet-spot. I guess that explains in part why steppenwolf and Yfronto produce such excellent images.

Unless somebody throws new light on this set-up I shall be placing the order tomorrow

Ian King has been fantastic :salute: but so has this forum. There has been a distinct rise in the number of posts regarding imaging and I am lapping them up.

Many thanks

[stargazer1980]

Sounds like you've hit the nail on the head there steve!

Im no imaging expert and will never claim to be, but as you say from the images that have been produced from this kind of set-up, you cant really go wrong! Its gonna be a steep learning curve, but im sure there will be plenty of guidance and help here for you!

Looking forward to seeing pics of your equipment and first light reports and pics!

regards

Darren

[MartinB]

Well I've never regretted getting my SXVH9 and integrates very well with the SXV guidehead. Very well supported by Maxim

Don't know about the Baader filters but the 7nm band pass Ha has some pros and cons. It will cut out more non Ha light so imaging with a full moon will be great. Interference filters such as Ha suffer a shift in band pass wave length at low F ratios. The narrower the band pass the greater this messes things up. At F4.8 I imagine this will be having a bit more of an effect with a 7nm filter than 13nm. No problem at F7.5. Another problem with the very narrow band Ha images I've seen is that the stars don't look rather muted. I was thinking of getting one at one time but decided to stick with the 13nm

The Scopeteknix filter wheel is great. Very well engineered and is the slimest wheel around which is very important for my AO set up. It is open at the bottom and this can be a source of gradients esp if there is a moon so I just cover it over with a duster.

The Maxim DL SXV drivers work very well. Guiding calibration and sub pixel accuracy is very good.

The ED80 works very well with the H9 and you can use focal reducers to further increase the field of view.

The 250px should be superb as well but you will need good seeing!

Think you'll be very happy with that little lot Steve

[Kaptain Klevtsov]

The Atik 16HR camera is still cheaper by a bit, wonder why you chose the SXV?

Kaptain Klevtsov

[FLO]

From what I hear, the SXV is better built and has that little bit extra that justifies its additional cost(?) It is also said to be easier to use with its dedicated guide camera. Starlight Express also have an excellent reputation for after-sales support. After saying that, what the heck do I know. Please feel free to talk me out of spending the extra

The new Chinese cameras sound good value but I'd rather stick with the tried and trusted; the learning curve is steep enough already! I might well change my mind after the early adopters have tested them.

[centroid]

It is very difficult spending other people's money for them Steve, as if they end up buying something they are not happy with, you feel some sort of responsibility.

Getting into serious astro imaging is not a cheap exercise, and it is very easy to throw thousands of pounds at it, especially with cameras like the SBig range and SX's M25C etc.

Upgrading is really not something that you want to keep doing, albeit some people just have to have the latest technology, as its an expensive exercise.

Therefore, you need to buy a set-up with which you'll be happy, and will do what you want, for the forseeable future.

I had my MX7C for five years before I upgraded to the H9C, during which time it never went wrong, or caused any problems.

When I wanted to convert it to mono, Starlight Express (Terry Platt and Michael Hattey) could not have been any more helpful. They supplied me with the 'chip', and Terry gave me step-by-step instructions.

There are a lot of comments related to the Atik and SX cameras under SteveL's mono v colour 'thread', so don't really need to reiterate them here.

Seeing the results 'posted' on this forum, and others, that have been captured with both Atik and SX cameras, I don't think either will disappoint you.

Dave

[centroid]

Just an after thought Steve, if as I said in the other 'Thread', the Atik engineering build quality, is similar to that of the Artemis, then it really doesn't compare to the engineering of the SX cameras, and I'd not be happy with it.

This is purely my personal opinion.

Dave

[FLO]

Thanks Dave, I think part of my bias towards SXV is that it is a British product and, as you say, Terry and Michael have a reputation for being helpful and approachable.

[FLO]

... the 7nm band pass Ha has some pros and cons. It will cut out more non Ha light so imaging with a full moon will be great. Interference filters such as Ha suffer a shift in band pass wave length at low F ratios. The narrower the band pass the greater this messes things up. At F4.8 I imagine this will be having a bit more of an effect with a 7nm filter than 13nm. No problem at F7.5. Another problem with the very narrow band Ha images I've seen is that the stars don't look rather muted. I was thinking of getting one at one time but decided to stick with the 13nm

Thanks Martin, I'll make a point of trying both

The Scopeteknix filter wheel is great. Very well engineered and is the slimest wheel around which is very important for my AO set up. It is open at the bottom and this can be a source of gradients esp if there is a moon so I just cover it over with a duster.

Noted.

The ED80 works very well with the H9 and you can use focal reducers to further increase the field of view.

Do you have a recommendation?

The 250px should be superb as well but you will need good seeing!

Why does that apply more to the 250px?

[steppenwolf]

Your choices seem to be pretty well spot on if you have decided to take the mono route! The only observation that I would make is that the 7Nm Ha filter is perhaps a little too restrictive and I do wonder if you would be better off with the 13Nm from Astronomik although I appreciate that it is somewhat more expensive. Unfortunately, Baader do not do one unless you go really wide which defeats the point somewhat!

The 250PX is a great reflector, I have been delighted with mine although a Crayford focusser would make it even nicer! That said, it hasn't spoiled my enjoyment of using it.

The SXVF-H9 and SXV guider with MaximDL make a great combination and the cost of the software is so well worth it when you look into it's feature set - fantastic.

Good luck and you got good advice from Ian King 'cos he is 'the man'!

[GazOC]

Why does that apply more to the 250px?

The long focal length.

[FLO]

Why does that apply more to the 250px?

The long focal length.

...................... sorry, still don't get it :scratch:

[GazOC]

You need better conditions to image at longer focal lengths.

Some nights 500mm will be OK but not 900mm. I believe 1200mm is where it just starts getting pretty picky..

[FLO]

Your choices seem to be pretty well spot on if you have decided to take the mono route!

Thanks, most of my imaging will be done out at Greg's (he has a dark sky) but I figured that mono would be better for my light polluted back-garden.

The only observation that I would make is that the 7Nm Ha filter is perhaps a little too restrictive and I do wonder if you would be better off with the 13Nm from Astronomik although I appreciate that it is somewhat more expensive.

That's you and MartinB. No point in asking for advice, then not taking it: The 7nm HA has been scratched off the list

The 250PX is a great reflector, I have been delighted with mine although a Crayford focusser would make it even nicer!

A Moonlite has already been reserved 8)

... you got good advice from Ian King 'cos he is 'the man'!

Absolutely, the very best :salute:

[MartinB]

I use an AstroPhysics 0.67 telecompressor along with the 2" tapered nose piece. A great bit of kit. As you would expect the reducer is high quality. The tapered nose piece does a great job of making a rigid connection with the scope and holding your very expensive camera nice and securely. you can also use a celestron 0.63. The AP is a bit more expensive but not outrageously so.

Your sampling rate with the 250PX and H9 is 1.1 arc seconds per pixel. Moderate seeing will be be moving a point source through around 3-4 arc secs. Very good seeing can bring the seeing down to under 2 arc secs. The poorer the seeing the less resolution you obtain so you are wasting effort and field of view with imaging at longer focal length. In bad seeing go short. 600mm and less seeing is rarely an issue.

Plan to have 2 or 3 targets and decide what to go for when you see what the conditions are like.

[FLO]

:idea1:

Thanks chaps

A number of my long-held beliefs are being challenged! My understanding of f-ratio in particular has taken a serious bashing since I discovered that it was based in the days of film and, of course, imaging CCDs have quite different characteristics.

[FLO]

I use an AstroPhysics 0.67 telecompressor along with the 2" tapered nose piece. A great bit of kit.

Thanks

[FLO]

BTW, Ian tells me the cameras should arrive in time for Kelling.

Some on-site tuition would be much appreciated .... please :toothy9:

[peonic]

Add me to the list of students for that lesson, please!

Chris

[MartinB]

Lets hope we get the chance! Will you be set up for guiding Steve cos that's the bit where you can really accelerate your learning by having some help.

[FLO]

Not sure, I know very little about guiding. I should at least have all the kit with me :toothy5:

[MartinB]

Well you've got a guide camera and hopefully 2 scopes. You just need to be able to able to have them set up on the same mount. Then it's just a laptop with a USB port.

[FLO]

Yup, I can do that :mrgreen:

How are you set-up Chris?

[SteveL]

[bEEP] I`m sorry, Chris isnt here right now, as he is currently trying to decide whether to put everything back together in piggyback or on the side by side plate. Please leave a message and I`ll get back to you when I can [beeeeeep]...

[FLO]