Help me choose a new scope.

[Alec S343 UNSC]

at the end of the month im getting a new scope my current scope is the National Geographic 50mm scope and was 23 pound,im not in a stat to be spending 300-400 pound on a scope and because i work at argos, i get a 10% disciunt so im taking advantage of that like many people say,the universe is not going nowhere. so unless i die tonight then i have many decades to spend huge amounts on a scope.

so the 2 below are my choices,can we get a discusion on these 2 please? i am a total noob on telescopes and know next to nothing about them.

National Geographic Newtonian Telescope 76mm.

Buy National Geographic Newtonian Telescope 76mm at Argos.co.uk - Your Online Shop for Telescopes.

Explore the fascinating world of astronomy with this National Geography Newtonian Telescope. Ideal for both beginners and practised astronomers, it offers 3 interchangeable eyepieces that will suit all enthusiasts and has an impressive maximum magnification of 525x. Complete with manufacturers lifetime guarantee, immerse yourself in the universe.

• Optimum magnification 175x.
  
• Maximum magnification 525x.
  
• Lens diameter 76mm.
  
• 3 interchangeable eyepieces 4mm, 12.5mm, 20mm.
  
• 13 x Barlow lens.
  
• 6 x 25mm finderscope.
  
• Reflector lens.
  
• 1.5 x image erector.
  
• Manual focus.
  
• Aluminium full height adjustable tripod.
  
• Altazimuth mount with vertical fine adjustment and lock.
  
• Includes user manual and a National Geographic map of the heavens.
  
• Weight 4.3kg.
  
• Size H128.3, W86.4, D86.4cm.
  
• Manufacturer's lifetime guarantee.
  
• EAN/MPN/UPC/ISBN: 5060062140750.
  

Celestron Telescope PS70/700 Refractor.

Buy Celestron Telescope PS70/700 Refractor at Argos.co.uk - Your Online Shop for Telescopes.

Explore the fascinating and enthralling night sky with this Celestron Refractor Telescope PS70/700. It comes with The SkyX planetarium software, which has a 10,000 object database - making it ideal for both the budding beginner and the practised astronomer. Boasting an impressive maximum magnification of 525x, engross yourself in the night sky.

• Optimum magnification 175x.
  
• Maximum magnification 525x.
  
• Quick and easy no-tool set-up.
  
• Slow motion controls for smooth tracking.
  
• Erect image optics - ideal for terrestrial (land) and astronomical (sky) use.
  
• Fully coated glass optics with high transmission coating for enhanced image brightness and clarity.
  
• Aluminium tripod with accessory tray for convenient storage of accessories.
  
• 'The SkyX' Planetarium Software with 10,000 object database and enhanced images.
  
• Mount: Altazimuth.
  
• Finderscope: 5x24.
  
• Aperture: 70mm.
  
• Focal Length: 700mm.
  
• Focal Ratio: 10.
  
• Eyepieces: 4mm, 15mm, 20mm, 3x Barlow lens, moon filter.
  
• Weight 3.63kg.
  
• Size H120, W90, D73cm.
  

Manufacturer's 10 year guarantee.

p.s for some reason the links to the scopes have changed itself to buying them lol

[Carbon Brush]

I'm sure you will get lots of replies, possibly from people who have used these particular scopes.

My first comment is to forget the magnifications that are quoted in the descriptions.

The second comment is to look at the 'proper' scope retailers rather than the 10% discount. That way you will find the scope that suits you best and not the cheapest.

Visit an astronomy retailer. Have a look at, and hold, a few scopes. Talk to the person behind the counter and between you build up a picture of what you want from a scope.

Visit a local astronomy club. Have a chat. Maybe get a look through a scope or two. Perhaps a member will have something on sale?

If tell us whereabouts you are, local members will recommend a retailer and a club.

[Cornelius Varley]

Personally I would avoid any telescope, including telescopes sold by Celestron, which has claims to 525x magnification. These figures are misleading and completely false.

Peter

[brantuk]

I wouldn't get a telescope from Argos at all. Use a proper astro shop where you will get a proper one. The high street stores generally don't stock anything more than kids toys or the "not so good" cheaper end scopes that won't offer such good viewing.

[Polar Bear]

In addition to what others have said, both scopes have mounts and tripods that will infuriate and frustrate you.

A better option would be to buy a 'proper' scope for just a slightly larger outlay of cash.

A good refractor to start with would be First Light Optics - Skywatcher Startravel 80 (EQ1)

A good reflector would be First Light Optics - Skywatcher Explorer 130

Don't rush into the decision and also have a think about what you would like to observe (Moon, Planets, DSO) as different scopes are better suited for viewing different objects.

Ask a few more questions and you will pointed in the right direction from the wealth of knowledge that members have.

Alternatively you may wish to consider some astronomical binoculars and a good tripod to start with.

Paul

[Alec S343 UNSC]

to be fair i got a 50mm from argos for 23 pound and i was blown away at seeing jupiter and 4 moons,i could even make out her storm lines if i can get that for 23 pound then i cant even imagin what il see for 100 pound+.

like i said,i have many decades to spend lots of cash,now i need to keep the cost as low as possible.

[Alec S343 UNSC]

well i want to view as much as possible to be honest, i want to get better views of jupiter,i want to see her moons pass infront of her,i want to see saturn and her rings,i have yet to find saturn i also want to see orions nebla,i know where it is and have had my 50mm onit but the best i get is about 4 maybe 5 stars and a slight shading of light but no detail or color.

all in all i want a scope that can view as much as possible.

[John]

well i want to view as much as possible to be honest, i want to get better views of jupiter,i want to see her moons pass infront of her,i want to see saturn and her rings,i have yet to find saturn i also want to see orions nebla,i know where it is and have had my 50mm onit but the best i get is about 4 maybe 5 stars and a slight shading of light but no detail or color.

all in all i want a scope that can view as much as possible.

Thats completely understandable but scopes that do that are precision instruments so you will a) need to invest something like £200-£300 and consider using a recognised astro equipment dealer to purchase from.

The scopes you listed in your 1st post in this thread would be a waste of your hard earned money in my opinion.

Try also to avoid the temptations E.Bay as, while there is some good stuff on there, there is much that is poor too and telling the difference is not always easy.

PS: Seeing colour in the Orion nebula and other nebulae is extremely unlikely until your scope gets to 8" in aperture of above. Even then most deep sky objects are shades of grey.

[damnut]

Hi AlecS343UNSC,

It would help if you could set a budget first and let us know what you want to spend. That way we could see what may suit you best for your dosh :-)!.

Cheers

[Alec S343 UNSC]

so ok,i know you need different scopes to see different things,i need help with basics,im reading allsorts about scopes but i have not got a clue what its saying lol

i would be very thankfull if someone could post me a link to telescopes for noobs, the sky i can handle but telescopes make my head hurt.

[Alec S343 UNSC]

100-150 pound is my budget

[cantab]

well i want to view as much as possible to be honest, i want to get better views of jupiter,i want to see her moons pass infront of her,i want to see saturn and her rings,i have yet to find saturn i also want to see orions nebla,i know where it is and have had my 50mm onit but the best i get is about 4 maybe 5 stars and a slight shading of light but no detail or color.

all in all i want a scope that can view as much as possible.

I think you'll need a pretty good telescope to view the transits of Jupiter's moons, though I don't know how good.

Saturn you will need to wait for. Right now it's low in the eastern sky at about 6 in the morning. It will get higher through November and December. Your small refractor should show the rings (they're not that hard to see really), though a larger telescope will be needed to reveal the main divisions in them.

The Orion Nebula, like most nebulae, will be in greyscale visually in any reasonable amateur telescope. The colours only show up in photographs (and often they're false colours anyway).

If you want to view "as much as possible", get a Dobsonian reflector, largest in your budget (though do allow for a collimating tool to help you get the best out of it).

[Polar Bear]

well i want to view as much as possible to be honest, i want to get better views of jupiter,i want to see her moons pass infront of her,i want to see saturn and her rings,i have yet to find saturn i also want to see orions nebla,i know where it is and have had my 50mm onit but the best i get is about 4 maybe 5 stars and a slight shading of light but no detail or color.

all in all i want a scope that can view as much as possible.

In that case you will need to spend much more than your budget permits.

With telescopes you need to be realistic and have an idea of what is possible with certain models and designs before purchase otherwise you will be dissapointed with the results.

Viewing the Orion Nebula (or any other DSO) optically you will not see any colour and will struggle to get detail with most starter scopes.

It is not magnification you need for DSO objects but aperture to gather as much light as possible.

Conversely for planetary viewing you need magnification but you also need very good viewing conditions at anything over 125x-150x.

Your best option to give you both the light gathering you need for DSO's and magnification for planets would probably be a Dobsonian like this one. First Light Optics - Skywatcher Skyliner 150P Dobsonian

This would be an ideal compromise for your needs. It is a little over your budget but as you say the stars are going nowhere and a scope such as this will give you years of service.

In the meanwhile whilst saving for it just get some inexpensive binoclulars and learn you way around the night sky.

Paul

[M4lcs67]

If you are genuinly interested then you would be well advised to take the advice of the people on SGL and stay away from the Argos specials. You may get a 10% discount, but ultimately they will deliver a poor image when compared to other scopes. As some have said these types of scopes are nothing more than toys.

There are some telescopes available that are ok and if you look at the sponsor of SGL (First Light Optics) website then you will find something within your budget.

[heathenwoods]

I'm in a similar position and want to build on the joys that a cheap 'scope I got my eldest son for his birthday has brought to him, me and the rest of the family. With kids and other considerations I'm all too familiar with working on a tight budget and yet wanting to see as much as possible in a new scope.

In this thread here I'm looking to see what the best I can do for c.£150 new or second hand. There is a lot of enthusiasm for second hand Tal 1s and ~6" dobs or, conversely, a new Skywatcher Heritage 130P FlexTube. Both options are within a sniff of your budget, as well what's already been mentioned, and will give you more to see than the Argos option. There's actually a few options at the cheaper end of things and, as time passes, eyepieces can be upgraded, finders improved and, eventually, better scopes bought but in the meantime make sure you're not going to end up with something that leaves you thinking, "But what if I spent £20 more and got X?"

[damnut]

Hi AlecS343UNSC,

If you cannot wait to spend some dosh then there is a Heritage 130p Dob for £120 here :- Skywatcher Newtonian Reflectors

It is a reasonable starting scope, if you can wait I would save up & spend a little more. If you look around once you have 50 posts and have been a member for a month then you gain access to the for sale section.

[perrin6]

How about making your own ! You can get a kit for making a 6 inch mirror for about £60 though you'd have to buy a fininshed diagonal mirror as they are very difficult to make, but every other part can be made out of wood, nuts and bolts and bits and bobs from around the house.

[Orion_the_Hunter]

Hi, I agree with all of the above.

Without causing offence, 10% discount from Argos may be hard to resist, but if I got 10% discount from Toy & Hobby I probably wouldn't buy a laptop from there.

You would save a few quid but you'd end up with unuseable trash.

I'm just being honest to save you from making a mistake. :)

Here's a couple of 'proper' telescopes which will do the job and last for ages.

First Light Optics - Skywatcher Explorer 130

First Light Optics - Skywatcher Heritage 130p Flextube

These are great 'scopes from an astronomy supplier who 'know their onions'.

HTH and I hope you enjoy whatever you opt for.

[Alec S343 UNSC]

can anyone give me a idea of what i can expect to see in a good 100-200 pound scope that can see DSO and planets?

[E621Keith]

can anyone give me a idea of what i can expect to see in a good 100-200 pound scope that can see DSO and planets?

Most DSO (except open clusters) will appear as fuzzy colourless and featureless blob. However, that's still true even for scopes five times the price.

Provided the atmosphere is clear and steady, you can see belts on Jupiter and Saturn rings. However, you are unlikely to see Great Red Spot or the Cassini division. Based on my experience with a scope similar to the Argos Celestron, you will be very lucky to get a view similar to my avatar pic, certainly nothing close to the images on the packaging.

I'd say don't bother with the Argos scope. If you must, then you can get the 127EQ, but that can only be described as poor to borderline rubbish. The rest are just rubbish.

You can get the much better Skywatcher 130p Dob for £135 at FLO. If you can't afford that, then get a pair of 10x50 binoculars. You'll still be using them long after you upgraded to some amazing telescope(s) in the future.

[Polar Bear]

can anyone give me a idea of what i can expect to see in a good 100-200 pound scope that can see DSO and planets?

Have a look at the scopes available from First Light Optics (link at the top of page) and then put the specifications into this websites telescope view calculator.

Telescope Calculator

It will give you a good idea of what can be achieved.

Paul

[Alec S343 UNSC]

i dont have a paypal so i cant get the scope calculater

because i cant view the sales side of the forum till the end of the month, i was wondering if there was anyone in nottingham that has a scope for sale? 100-150 pound is my budget.

like i said i would like to view planets at the best my price range can handle and maybe DSO like galaxys and nebula, it would be cool to see the astroid belt or even astroids in our system.

i know im a noob at this and maybe my expectations are high , but if i can cry from seeing jupiter and her 4 largest for the first time using a 23 pound argos telescope then i cant even imagin what i will feel like using a 100 pound + scope.

i have decided not buy a argos scope though,i have just under a month till i get cash so i want the very best for my money,be it brand new or second hand

what price range am i looking at to get views of jupiters moons make there transit?

[Damo636]

Hi Alec. I would seriously consider a pair of binoculars if i were in your position. The Argos scopes are nothing short of toys and will ultimately frustrate and disappoint you in the long run. I should know because my first scope was the Celestron 127eq. As this is a family forum i don't want to cause offense by stating what i really thought of it but it was poor to say the least. With your budget i would think a pretty decent pair would be within reach and provide you with a much more enjoyable experience than any of the cheap Argos scopes could.

[Alec S343 UNSC]

SKYWATCHER SKYHAWK-1145P TELESCOPE

114mm (4.5") f/500 Parabolic Newtonian Reflector

• Magnifications (with eyepieces supplied): x20, x40 x50, x100

  
  

• Highest Practical Power (Potential): x228

  
  

• Diameter of Primary Mirror: 114mm

  
  

• Telescope Focal Length: 500mm (f/5)

  
  

• Eyepieces Supplied (1.25"): 10mm & 25mm

  
  

• X2 Barlow Lens

  
  

• Parabolic Primary Mirror

  
  

• 0.5mm Ultra-Thin Secondary Mirror Supports

  
  

• Red Dot Finder

  
  

• R.A. Motor Drive (D.C.) (supplied with PM Version only)

  
  

• EQ1 Equatorial Mount

  
  

• Aluminium Tripod with Accessory Tray

  
  

• 125% more Light Gathering than 76mm

  
  

• Tube Dimension(dia. x length) 15cm x 41cm

  
  

• Tripod Height 67cm-119cm

  
  

• Shipping Weight 11.5Kgs

  
  

• Shipping Carton Dimensions 76cm x 28cm x 23cm

  
  

SKYWATCHER SKYHAWK-1145P TELESCOPE

114mm (4.5") f/500 Parabolic

Newtonian Reflector

£125.00

SKYWATCHER SKYHAWK-1145PM TELESCOPE

114mm (4.5") f/500 Parabolic Newtonian

Motorised Reflector£150.00

[Alec S343 UNSC]

is this one any good? what would i expect to see in this one?