Ships and Stars

Thank you!! 👍

I was thinking last night actually I've never had the same level of career development/support at work or at university (except one professor) as I've had on SGL! 👍

Do you have a chainsaw and some tarps, and how are you with roofing? 🤣

Nice set of Morpheus EPs! Baader products are solid in general, and the Morpheus line in particular seems to be a brilliant line of EPs. The 17.5mm is my go-to EP for the Horse Head when I'm lucky enough to get out to a dark site. The 17.5mm Morpheus is brilliant and I wish they did the Morpheus line in 2" EPs, I'd be very interested. This is my 'field case', c.90% second-hand from ABS, SGL or less frequently these days, ebay. I also worked my way up, but ended up going 'back down' a bit by selling two Ethos (21mm/13mm) and a Leica WW ASPH wide-angle zoom which hurt, but money was tight and it let me buy the three APMs and a Unihedron sky-quality meter plus some Helios 15x70s and Quantum 20/40x100mm obsy bins. My case sees a lot of internal padding around EPs and other items when travelling in a vehicle, but has pretty much everything I need to get the party started. The WO binoviewers and plossl pairs now live in their own box and a plastic tub holds 2"/1.25" adaptors, Nikon adaptor, hex keys, screwdriver, LED headlamp. Power cables and Synscan controller live in a Tesco bag 🤣 and stay at home if I'm using the 300p flextube. The closest thing I have to a complete set of EPs are three of the Lunt/APM XWAs 9/13/20mm in the lower right frame which are great, but the rest is a bit of a hodge-podge, though I also have three Baader EPs, a 31mm asph, 17.5mm Morpheus and 10mm BCO. The Seben zoom was dirt cheap and I was going to sell it, but for the money decided it's handy to test seeing conditions/max mag for different targets. I'm pretty happy now with what I have now except my widefield EPs - a 42mm Revelation and a 31mm Baader Aspheric, which I'd like to sell and replace with a single EP for fast scopes in that range, probably the 30mm APM UFF, but it wouldn't get used a lot probably. BTW, if you want a cheap 'contrast booster/dark adaption helper' for every eyepiece you own, as Gerry mentions, a parka hood, a dedicated observing hood or even just a towel can improve any EP from a £20 Revelation to Tele Vue and even binoculars, especially with external filters. My mil-spec Arctic snorkel hood (£12) is a little over the top perhaps, but the ears do stay warm 🤣

Thanks Gerry, you and everyone on here have helped a ton. Great forum. Wish I'd bought mirror grinding supplies for this summer, but still plenty of other non-astro things to fix and with all the time I'll save not chasing holes in the clouds around NE Scotland, I'll be able to catch up on reading! Lunar will still be on, looking forward to that, and might even try to see what DSOs I can tease out in May just for laughs.

This is fascinating, never thought I'd be this interested in low light vision and detection, etc. PS, I'm a bit embarrassed to say it, but two nights ago was the first time I observed M51, and thought you fool, why didn't you look at this before! It was spectacular even under 20.20-30 SQM and I can only imagine what it looks like in proper darkness. I can see how you could spend a lot of time studying it with different magnifications. Wishing we have a few more clear nights before the moon is back in control, but there is still a very small window of time under next month's new moon from midnight to c. 2:30am.

This image is pretty interesting too, a good illustration of perception and contrast. I was just thinking, even though I sold the Leica to help buy the APMs, I still have a Seben 8-24mm that is ok to use. It doesn't have clickstops so I might try to steadily zoom in on 3003 or any other relatively low surface brightness object and note how changing mag impacts the views and detection.

Sure! 👍 I haven't read the Clark site fully but see surface brightness decreases with mag which makes sense, but contrast remains steadfast though our eye sees it differently based upon size in the EP.

Thanks Gerry! I should have dropped to the 13mm or the 20mm for a look at 3003, I bet the exit pupil and lower mag would have made a significant different in hindsight. Even when I had my Leica zoom, I'd rarely go above maybe 150x and that night I'd used almost the 10mm and 9mm exclusively, so 200x and 222x, a lot more than I normally go except lunar and planetary nebulae. I'd like to read up on how green led light affects dark adaptation, I tend to use this a bit more than red when setting up. I did see somewhere it has a similar effect as a red LED, but takes a bit longer to adapt. I think perhaps LEDs in general seem to have a harsher impact on adaptation, though I've no evidence at the mo to back this up. Thanks for the links to Clark & Blackwell. I love reading about the physiology as much as the gear and mag/exit pupil etc. Still pretty new to the galaxy hunting for sure. Good stuff Gerry! Hoping for another bash, set up the 300p last night based on totally conflicting weather forecasts, and the cloudy one won!

That's amazing, small world!

Rugby is a rough one for sure! I'd last about 30 seconds tops. Sorry to hear about that, both of the dobs you mention are held in high esteem by the 'dob mob' here I would imagine, I'd love to look through either one. Rural Scotland can be great when conditions are right, but of course pretty hit and miss with the cloud cover and the jet stream never seems too far away. I've always been a casual stargazer, but only really started appreciating properly dark skies after a string of camping trips here, which ultimately led to my interest in astronomy. I'm actually from Indiana, but have lived in the UK for around 20 years. I played little league, but it's been many, many years. My pitching arm was better when I was 14 than it is now! I was in Vegas once in 1993, some friends and myself worked in Alaska for a summer and took the 'long way' home. We were driving through the pitch-black desert at night, and all the sudden we went over a crest on the highway, and there it was, surreal, lights to the horizon, the contrast with the desert could not have been greater. We won about $400, ate some pizza and ran before we lost it all. It wasn't a huge amount, but needed four new tyres the next day so that came in handy, haha, good times. I was wondering about Mt Wilson vs light pollution from LA, the conditions are still so good as you mention it's well worth a look. That would be amazing. I'd like to do another road trip next time I'm in the States and go out west again and combine it with some observatory stops. Lowell would be another one for sure. We've two little ones, so it may be some time! It's a really good group here, I've learned so much in the relatively short time I've been on this forum, it would have taken me years and years otherwise to figure much of it out through trial and error. 👍

Indeed! My LED headlamp requires me to cycle through blue, then green until I get red, so I close my eyes for two clicks, but often end up on green. The red LED is quite bright as well and on more than one occasion, have accidentally hit the main bright beam which really is a bit of a shock to the eyes at night. I've taped over the coloured red LEDs, but it can still pump out the light, especially if I'm holding the atlas up to my face checking objects. I bought an arctic snorkel hood mainly for my binoculars with filters, because the filters are external they will reflect any light whatsoever. I'll dig it out tonight, it's hilarious looking, but definitely like sitting in a tunnel! I think in hindsight, it's a lot trickier here getting dark adapted in town than I've considered. Lots of good points here Gerry and Mark, thank you both!

Solid gold! Thanks again. I was hopping around a lot last night, even nipped into the house to check Stellarium on my desktop but installed a red filter on my desktop thinking I'd re-adapt pretty much instantly. I did finally settle a bit towards the end of the session, but still was using the red LED intermittently maybe once every 5-10 minutes to make sure my power cable didn't get pinched when the scope slewed. When I'm out at a dark site, it's a different story and think I am getting dark adapted much better there than here on the edge of town. I'd heard of rhodopsin but not opsin. I'd even ate more carrots once I'd read about rhodopsin, though the carrot aspect may have gained an element of myth from British WWII pilots who claimed it gave them increased night vision because they didn't want the Germans to know about the success of radar apparently!

Haha it is a proper lump of steel for the size isn't it? One thing that jumps out is despite its size, it has a bit of heft to it which suggests they put some effort into it. It's going to be a cold one here tonight, I'll probably notice it now you mention it 🤣 Actually I didn't notice it much last night, but perhaps that's down to eye placement which needs some fine tuning?

PS I should have tried it with the 13mm and even perhaps the 20mm or 17.5 Baader, wondering what various exit pupils/mag will do on these sorts of objects. Was also thinking if I had just popped the BCO into the focuser, that meant I had my red LED on nipping over to the EP case, so there's a good chance I didn't settle with it enough to re-adapt fully. That's another question I was going to ask about sometime, regarding red LEDs/LP and 're'dark adaptation, but I'll give everyone a break for a bit, lol. I have lots of reading to do on various aspects connected to this which I thought I already had a decent grip on, but then again, that's part of what I like about astronomy. I also think my definition of very faint might be someone else's 'decent', haha. I've still not had much luck with the smaller PGCs, but never really got into a groove this year, most of the clear nights here have been way too windy to really chase these sorts of objects.

Thanks Mark, that backs up Gerry's view on conditions, there certainly could have been some high wispy cloud sneaking past which would explain it disappearing a bit at times, plus there's more LP here than I'd hoped once I took a proper reading. I'm actually hoping to get the 300p out tonight as the weather shows a bit of a window, should have kept the 500p out but started sleeting here this morning. If conditions cooperate, I'll go straight back to 3003 and get relaxed and see if I can flush it out and experiment with the 10mm BCO some more. I don't use the winged eyecup on my other Baaders, but the one on the BCO works great, don't need a hood at all, except for temperature, pretty low today!

Thanks for the information, a lot of new info really. Log scale sounds right, I've seen (detected) the HH with the 300p under 21.6, but never got it with the 20" at home on the best nights. Flux mag is a totally new one for me, at least I have more time at the moment to read up on all of this. Might even have to blow the dust off my scientific calculator if the ancient battery hasn't eaten the inside yet!

Thanks Gerry! It was fairly large actually at c.200-222x. I think the LP here is much worse than what I am used to with the 20", which generally only sees dark skies. I was teetering on the ladder last night, couldn't get a level placement, so it was quite wobbly looking through the EPs. The 10mm BCO is very sharp! I'm definitely keeping it and am hoping to get more time with it. I am completely new to orthos as well. Conditions combined with my overall inexperience I think were showing a bit last night, didn't see any of the small PGCs shown on Stellarium, but only had the S&T Atlas outside. I wish the synscan controller had PGCs in the catalogue, but will start using SAO stars to get as close as possible.

Hi all, Last night I set up the 20" dob at home for a clear three hour weather window which was accurately predicted by MetOffice down to 15 minutes! I usually use the 300p flextube at home and save the 500p for dark sky trips, but these days, well, you know... So anyway, I did a Synscan align on Capella and Pollux which turned out rather good, and as a result, started hoovering up a lot of the solitary outlying galaxies in Leo and UMa shown in the S&T Pocket Atlas. Skies were decent for my location - Unihedron SQM-L read 20.20 to 20.34 SQM and no high cloud was detectable. All neighbouring lights were off (love it). I really enjoyed being able to fairly easily located these faint fuzzies with the GOTO, but one in particular stood out - or rather, barely stood out - NGC 3003 which is between Leo Minor and the 'head' of Leo (top of p.35, S&T Atlas). Using the 9mm APM, I slewed across and quickly caught it with averted vision, then once settled in, was able to see it with direct vision but it was a seriously, seriously faint edge on galaxy, especially in comparison to the other NGCs in the S&T Atlas. In my scope around 11:20pm, it appeared as a nebulous extended narrow faint streak orientated vertically with no hint of structure or detail. Swapping to the 10mm BCO, I noticed, as with other galaxies last night, the background sky seemed a lot brighter and less contrasty. Using the 10mm BCO on NGC3003, it actually frequently went in and out of vision and was quite difficult to see over the 9mm APM which seemed more forgiving. I reckon the 10mm can be explained with higher light transmission combined with a bit of LP, perhaps a try at a really dark site will let it shine. Anyway, my curiosity now going, I went in afterwards and checked Stellarium which says it is mag 18.34 with surface brightness of 19.41! No way I'd be able to see this in theory, right? And what's it doing in the S&T Pocket Atlas then? Hmm... So for a second opinion, I went to Telescopius which gives a mag of 11.9 and 22.8 surface brightness. Wikipedia says 10-something mag? Q: Has anyone observed NGC3003 before, and what do you reckon on these mag estimates? The numbers seem all over the place and beyond the reach of my dob which goes to about 16.4mag in theory (for single point light sources I presume). I've attached a screenshot from Telescopius for some idea, though of course through the eyepiece the surrounding stars were much brighter than this very faint but intriguing (to me) fuzzy...

That's a great solution with the Kaiser caps, I'd never heard of them before. Coming up with a suitable mount will be another story! I'm self-employed and thus unemployed, so on a total spending freeze at the moment, but when I do have a little bit coming in, I will make up for it no doubt 🤣. I do some light metalwork and welding as a hobby of sorts when something needs fixing and do my own MOT repairs, so would like to fabricate a 'presentable' DIY fork mount with some scrap I have and only order in any bits like star knobs or stainless fasteners. I had an AZ4 which was ok with some 4.5kg 25x100s, but doubt it would hold still at high angles with the Quantums, but I'll cobble some monstrosity together... Thanks Darren!

Actually your description at the top is quite similar to what I saw. A lot of times things in a big dob like the 20" aren't necessarily massively brighter, just perhaps larger due to increased focal length and being a fast scope, I can't really use very low-mag EPs beyond 30-32mm without exceeding a reasonable exit pupil. For example, I tried a 42mm 'finder' EP on Markarian's Chain after seeing it with the 20mm Lunt last night, expecting to see a wonderful view of dozens of galaxies hovering in space, and could only see two extremely faint smudges along the entire chain and the sky was all washed out - no contrast. Swapping directly after that to the 13mm APM was like looking through a different scope in different skies, they were spilling out everywhere and quite large and 'contrasty'. I didn't think to leave the synscan on the suspected comet and see if it went out of view, but my tracking was a little sluggish last night anyway near zenith. I reckon you saw the comet, anything else in that part of the sky galaxy-wise would have been extremely faint I think! 👍 PS I recognise the three stars in your sketch that form a right angle, that was one set of 'guide stars' I was using, so we must have seen the same thing.

I was going to ask the same thing Mike! Last night I used a 20" dob under 20.30SQM to chase it, thought it would be an open and shut case. I used SkyLive to find its location and punched in the number of the nearest SAO star into synscan and then started trawling back and forth with a 20mm 100deg EP at 100x. There were two sets of triple stars and if you followed one set down, it was supposed to lead straight to the comet at that exact time. Eventually, I came across a faint fuzzy which by all appearances, resembled a galaxy with a bright core and a faint outer shell, but couldn't see a tail. I checked Stellarium again and I wasn't fully convinced of course, and there were no galaxies where I was looking but there were a few really faint PGCs in the general area and NGC 2787 not terribly far away. I doubt very much I would have seen this in my smaller 12" dob which is still quite large aperture really, so I am really dubious now I have actually seen the comet, think it might have been a PGC, but whatever it was, it wasn't too obvious unless I somehow mistook it for a star and slewed right past. I was in a bit of a rush because cloud was approaching. I'll try again tonight to confirm if weather cooperates!

Hermes here used to be shockingly terrible, but have improved immensely. I think 90% of this was down to the local agent. They used to leave my packages at random addresses in town and the surprise recipients would find our house and bring them to me. Still amazed at that. The best was when the former Hermes courier delivered one small parcel and said 'I have your other one in the van, but you didn't request the faster delivery option, so I can't give it to you now' and marched away. She waited a week, and sent it to me via second class Royal Mail. Now 'new and improved' Hermes sends texts with a delivery slot time and safe place option like DPD and the old agent is, not surprisingly, gone off to spread their joy elsewhere 🤣 That being said, all the the delivery drivers and posties I know work very hard and are always moving at Mach 2.

I had the Celestron 25x100s, they were ok, quite good optically but no good with eyeglasses, no field of view. Without eyeglasses, the dioptre adjustment was only +/-4 or 4.5, so couldn't reach focus for one of my eyes. I'd buy an 8" dobsonian instead for similar money, much more versatile than a fixed mag binocular, unless you already have a scope. If you really want binoculars for deep sky, I'd look at second hand Helios Apollos as they accept nebula filters which are excellent, especially under dark skies. I have the 15x70s and Quantum 5.1s 20/40x100mm which I made filter holders for. PS don't forget a good tripod like an AZ4 is needed for the bigger binoculars. That's another c.£120 or more new. Hope that helps.

The Telementor is very cool! These are fairly hard to come by I take it?