What's value money? And quality?

[tko1502]

As some of you might know I'm very new to this and some of the words people are saying are totally losing me! I'm not the brightest spark going! (ha), but iv just had a little girl and now money is very tight! I don't want to pay out extreme amount on my first telescope, but iv been to my local optics (rother valley optics, Rotherham, England) and he's suggested to me that I could start with a celestron 70 or 90 but I like the look of the celestron 130eq-md??? But is it ok? I can't seem to find many reviews on google, and obviously I don't want something that I'm just going to be wanting to take back within a week!!! Any help would be greatly appreciated!

[Deneb]

If your limited in funds, have you thought about buying a good set of binoculars instead.

They can be doubled as an observing tool for terrestial use, astronomy & being cheaper, then buying a scope. They will give nice views of the Moon & widefield objects like Star Clusters & the Bright DSO (Deep Space Objects) like M45- The Pleiades Cluster.

Something like these for example:

Celestron - Celestron Skymaster 15x70

Cheers

Nadeem.

[tko1502]

Hi Deneb, yes I did think about some but with them not being as sturdy as a telescope, unless I bought a stand for them, but then I'd be better off with a telescope! The celestron 130eq-md is up for sale at £159, with no Barlow lens, and only 2 eye pieces! I wouldn't want to spend much more than this as obviously from looking around on this site I'd have to buy moon and other filters, and eye pieces also looking at carry cases for when I do travel!

[Deneb]

Don't forget if your looking to buy a reflector scope, you would also be required to buy a collimator they usually start from £20.00 - Thats a Chesire Collimator. Laser collimators are higher in price.

In a nutshell, You have to collimate the optical mirrors of the scope, so they align properly, otherwise your viewing quality will suffer.

Nadeem.

[russ]

Ask Rother Valley about the Skywatcher Skyliner 150P. It's a serious telescope that could last years. It will provide good views of all targets but especially the moon and planets. It's extremely easy to use and setup. It is a little more than the Celestron but at £179 it fits the title of your thread perfectly.

[dweller25]

I would keep it simple to start with ....

Evostar - Skywatcher Evostar 90 (AZ3)

It's a good quality refractor on a simple manual tracking mount that you can take outside and use almost straight away - it will not require the optics to be aligned (collimation) as in a mirror system.

As you grow with the hobby you can buy a much better mount that will track automatically and put this telescope straight onto it.

It will give you great views of the Moon, the planets and the brighter galaxies and globular clusters.

You will love the perfect sharp star light points that only a refractor can give.

HTH

[tko1502]

Is they huge differences between the refractor and reflector? I really like the reflector as it's shorter and would be easier for me, but all info is greatly appreciated!

[Capricorn]

A refractor is generally more robust.

As a reflector has just one face ground they are cheaper to produce. 2 lens have 4 faces o be ground.

Refractors will often produce a sharper image, however you lose out on the aperture size.

If the 90 is f/5 I would be a little careful. An f number down there needs good quality glass and usually an ED glass to reduce the CA. It will also need decent eyepieces which again cost a little more. If it is around f/8 (possibly f/7) then I would say it is a fair option, still some CA.

I would also suggest that you consider the same f numbers when looking at a reflector. SW produce a 150P and a 150PL. I would suggest the 150PL over the 150P simply for the longer focal length.

[tko1502]

Hi there thank you very much for your imput but I'm lost with the "f" and CA and ED, al 150p or 150 pl??? Sorry as I said totally new to this but I'm very greatfull for u taking ur time to help me

[brantuk]

The 130eq md is a nice little scope. My partners uncle got one recently and it works very well. the "eq" means it's on an equatorial mount, a "P" designation indicates a parabolic mirror (this is desireable as it focuses light better). "CA is cromatic abberation where some scopes exhibit a thin whispy circle around the object which can be red, blue, etc - a scope that corrects for this is better. "pl" is a parabolic mirror with a longer main tube.

So if you get the 130eq - ensure it has a parabolic mirror. The "md" means it has a motor drive on the "Right Ascension" axis (good one for you to lookup - along with "Declination"). The eyepeices it comes with are average and the barlow I don't rate. But they'll be enough to get you going with reasonable views until you've saved for better quality ones.

"ED" is extra dispersion optics - to do with lenses and coatings it usually applies to refractors - the 130eq is a reflector.

Generally - you should look for largest aperture within budget. Reflectors give better value for money (vfm) for the same aperture. Eg a 130 reflector might cost circa £150 whereas a 130 refractor (same size but using glass lenses) will set you back £400-£500.

Enough for now - hope I've helped a bit

[brantuk]

Oh btw - the 130 is the aperture size in mm and the "f" numbers refer to focal ratio - and bear in mind you'll need a field battery for the motor drive (around £30 at Maplins) - get googling lol

[tko1502]

That's great many thanks, in ur honest opinion what would you buy at that price range? As some are saying skywatcher? The more feedback I get thebetter chance I'll get my decision right! And apart from Barlow lens, what sort of others is they that do the same thing? You guys are great!

[tko1502]

The focal ratio on a 130eq is 5? But im still none the wiser to if this is a good or bad thing!

[eddy]

Short F ratio (ie. 5 or lower) Will give you a sharper, but SMALLER image.

Higher F ratio's (ie. 8+) will give you bigger (higher magnification) lower Field of view images. Example. In my 80mm Refractor i can see M31 (with a 20mm SWA EP) (swa = super wide angle) (ep = eye piece)

The scope is F6 (ish)

With a Higher F ratio you wouldnt get it all in as the FOV (Field of view) is a lot smaller on Higher F's. BUT....

Lets take Jupiter for example, on the Higher 8+ Scopes you will resolve MORE DETAIL than my little F5 (BECAUSE THE HIGHER THE RATIO THE MORE MAGNIFICATION YOU CAN GET AND RESOLUTION DUE TO LARGER MIRRORS) BUT....its not all about Magnification.

Sorry for the lack of depth and detail but that (as im aware) is the general basis.

Hope that helps a bit

Eddy

[tko1502]

Hi eddy that's perfectly fine mate, you've simplified it so it makes perfect sense to me, some of these books I'm reading make non what so ever! Haha, I really do have my heart set on the 130eq-md, but now iv got doubts to as is it going to give me what I want?? Also what extras will I need to start with?

[brantuk]

The Celestron 130eq is a good general reflector that many choose to start with - the Sky Watcher 130 is roughly equivalent but I don't think the differences are significant - either is good. It's a low cost starter scope and if looked after should retain 50%-60% of it's value on the second hand market (should you decide to upgrade or sell up later). It'll show the moon, planets, and a lot (but not all) deep sky objects.

The only limiting factors are it's aperture size, and supplied ep's. If you can stretch to a 150 (6") then all the better - but the 130 with good quality ep's is a very nice little scope in my opinion. My partners uncle is delighted with his Skywatcher one.

[eddy]

You'll be suprised at just how good it is for the money. Ive not used one but have read about them a fair amount, and understanding telescopes a little always helps things along. Like brantuk said, you will see LOTS with it, and im sure you'll see more than you imagined with the scope and have a great time using it. Let it be the start of the learning curve and will let you upgrade some point in the future. Once you start, you'll want more (Aperture fever!) lol

Just enjoy which ever scope you chose, learn about what your looking at, where it is, how BIG things are and just be patient, like i said my 1st scope was a 127mm MAK with a super huge Focal length (1500mm giving an F ratio of 11.8) So it was great on planets, but i didnt use it enough on the things i now want to look at, i sold it and forgot about the hobby for a few months, only for my other half to get me some gear and got me back into it.

The bottom line is, get what you can but dont burn your pockets, enjoy what you have and make the most of it, share you knowledge and learn about the sky, picture it, draw it what ever you want to do, which ever scope you get you will not be dissapointed (Unless its a £5 jobby from a Supermarket with "SUPER MEGA 600X" stamped on it!) Steer clear of those bad boys!

All the best

Eddy

[tko1502]

Well everybody iv managed to fond a celestron 130eq-md at 132.98 and my local store rother valley optic have matched the price bringing it down from 159, which I think is very good of them, so this will be the one I will now purchase in the morning!

[brantuk]

Congrats tko - let us know how you get on with it and don't hesitate to ask if you need any questions answering

[tko1502]

As you are aware by now I'm not very bright and I know I'm going to find this new hobby of mine very hard as I'm normally a hands on person and once someone has showed me something I pick it straight up but with no one to show me I just know it's a long road ahead!!! My question is what's PLOSSL???? and what's with the difference in mm???? The higher the better???? Please help thanks

[FraserClarke]

Plossl : A type of eyepiece design. Plossl's are a solid value for money eyepiece most people use. Not as wide a field or long eye relief as more expensive designs (if you don't know what they mean -- don't worry about them! ) A Plossl will serve you well for many a year.

mm: The magnification is telescope focal length (mm) / eyepiece focal length (mm). So, as your telescope focal length is fixed, different focal lengths of eyepiece give different magnifications.

higher=better: No -- just different magnifications. horses for courses... If the conditions allow, you'll want high mag (short fl) for planets etc. For most other objects, you'll probably stick to a longer fl (lower mag) eyepiece. It's easier to make longer focal length eyepieces, so the performance tends to be a bit better -- but not always.

[brantuk]

Hi Tko - as teadwarf says - it's a question of magnification. To determine magnification take the size of an eyepiece and divide it into the focal length of the scope. E.g. a 650 mm fl scope with a 10mm eyepiece would yeild a magnification of 65 times (650/10) - a 25mm ep yields 26x (650/25) - a barlow lens will double these.

But magnification is a sensitive measure. Don't go mad with it. Some retailers advertise maximum mags of 300 or 400 times. In the UK you'll be lucky to get clear views at much over 200x due to the weather. The "seeing" conditions are critical. On a clear night with a high object you'll "see" better than a low object on a humid day. The higher the object the less atmosphere you're looking through.

Also the quality and type of the ep plays a part. A low/medium quality ep won't perform as well as a good quality ep. Glass is expensive and ep's can cost between £15 and £600. Spend time learning about them before you buy and when you know what you want, look for second hand - you'll get good bargains for "good condition" ones.

I generally aim at about 80% of the quoted maximum magnification of any scope for my personal maximum. Also a good quality barlow will double the magnification thus doubling the number of ep's in your set. The supplied ep's are usually average at best.

Cheers

[tko1502]

Could you recommend some reasonable eye pieces? Or Barlow lens? As I have got a clue where to look or second hand ones! Other than eBay but I'm very dubious about buying this sort of stuff from there! This site doesn't have a for sale or wanted section iv noticed unlike many other forums iv been on or other things!

[FraserClarke]

It does once you've got enough (50) posts...

There is a regular trade in eyepieces going on there; and the transactions are not as faceless as than on the 'bay...

[Mr Spock]

This site does have a buy/sell section, but you will have to increase your number of posts to see it (this is to discourage one off traders).

My suggestion would be to get used to your new scope first before buying anything else. Get a good look at the moon, jupiter, stars etc before taking the next step. Hopefully by then you should have gained enough knowledge (and posts here) to be able to make a second hand purchase and to know what you want.