Looking to buy a nice telescope for my father

[AstroNebulee]

Could you add the shim under the finder here instead, not sure if possible but may help keep it lined up longer. I had to do it for my old celestron 130eq. 

[Louis D]

2 hours ago, pointedstick said:

It still doesn't seem like the highest quality item; the zeroing knobs don't seem to have any way to lock them in place, so I imagine it'll need to be re-zeroed a lot. I may end up replacing it anyway. But at least now it's not a necessity.

If it gets to being a problem, run a strip of 3M blue masking tape over them.  That stuff comes right off again with no residue and is basically waterproof as well.

[Alan64]

It may be desirable to begin looking into a replacement for the ubiquitous red-dot straight away.  An optical-finder with a 90° diagonal would save the neck and back.  The higher the telescope is aimed above the horizon, the less of the chicken-broth of our blurring, swimming atmosphere to penetrate, and that's where a right-angle finder comes into play.

This is an example of one... https://agenaastro.com/gso-8x50mm-right-angle-correct-image-finder.html

Now, some don't like right-angle finders, but many do.  I don't know the ratio, however; something to research before considering.

[Starslayer]

I am actually. not finding the rdf an issue. The UK weather is an issue.  Had the moon to play with in day time today though and found the finder efficient with the standard 40mm lens supplied.  Learning curve for me re focusing etc but enjoyed the play nevertheless.  Roll on clear skies. 

[pointedstick]

I got the included red-dot sight dialed in and it hasn't been a problem since.

I'm finding that the StarSense Explorer phone app works very well on clear skies. ...Less so on partly cloudy skies. On a clear night it's really nice. I just tell it what I want to see and it shows me right where to point the scope. Being able to manually slew it when I want to look at something big and obvious like the moon is nice too. I'm glad I didn't go for a computerized mount with no manual slewing ability.

Alas, my poor dad is away and doesn't get to use it with me for a month, so for now I'm enjoying it myself and with my kids.

 

So at this point I think I'm more or less hooked, and I have just one more question. My Hyperion zoom lets me go up to 187x magnification. On the moon, everything is still razor sharp, so I'm wondering if there's room for even more magnification using a Barlow. I also ask because I tried looking at Mars last night and all I managed to see was a tiny orange dot. it was not super thrilling. Is this what I should be expecting, or can I do better?

 

Oh I lied, yet one more question: I have not tried collimating the scope; how would I be able to tell when it needs doing, and is there a guide anywhere for how to do it (other than YouTube of course)?

[Louis D]

When pondering maximum magnification, I calculate the resultant exit pupil.  Given your scope is an f/10, and 0.6mm is about the limit for small exit pupils before floaters become an issue for many folks, I'd say a 0.6mm*10=6mm eyepiece would be the absolute shortest usable focal length in your scope on most nights.  This would yield 1500/6=250x.  Rather than buy a 6mm and a 7mm eyepiece to search out your maximum usable power on any given night, I'd just buy a quality 2x Barlow for the BHZ to yield 4mm to 12mm, or there abouts.  I'll let other make currently available shorty Barlow recommendations since I don't own any.  If you come across a vintage Japanese made Celestron Ultima 2x, Parks Gold Series (GS) 2x, or Baader Triplet 2x Barlow, I can verify they are exceptional shorty Barlows.

Mars is receding away from us and is getting smaller by the day.  It was at opposition in October 2020 and won't be again until December 2022.  Other than for a few weeks on either side of opposition, Mars isn't all that great of a telescopic target.

Try defocusing a mag 2 star like Polaris once it is centered and highly magnified (the BHZ will be handy to determine the best magnification for this).  The Airy disk should show nicely concentric, smooth, round Fresnel rings on either side of best focus.

If the image shows poor collimation as on the right, you'll need to investigate SCT collimation further.  Since I don't own one and have never collimated one, I can't offer any further insights.  Just make sure the star is dead center.  Moving it off axis will make it look uncollimated.  You can defocus the star until its bloated image nears the field stop to better center it.

[Louis D]

1 hour ago, pointedstick said:

Alas, my poor dad is away and doesn't get to use it with me for a month, so for now I'm enjoying it myself and with my kids.

Become the resident expert on the equipment and the sky so you can quickly get your dad up to speed upon his return.

[Starslayer]

I too have wondered about the collimation issue but since we have not had a break in the cloud in the 8 days I have had the scope then frustration is the ongoing dessert of the day. 🙃 May sound silly but when defocusing does it matter which way that goes?  Not withstanding any other upgrades my solar filter has been ordered ready for 10th. Odds on clear skies?  Knowing my existing luck - Mmmm. 

Edited May 25, 2021 by Starslayer

[Louis D]

As far as defocusing goes, use whichever side yields better Fresnel rings.  My APO has near textbook rings on one side and near mush on the other:

[pointedstick]

Let me provide a brief update: everything is working smoothly. The app is functioning very well on clear nights. The position it sends me to is not often 100% accurate, but it's in the ballpark and I'm not having any difficulty finding it in the region where it's directed me to. However I find myself using the app in a different way: once it's gotten its bearings, I point the telescope to things I can see in the sky and use the app to tell me what it is that I am looking at. Then I can zoom in on the screen and see what's nearby but not not visible to the naked eye, and see it with the telescope. This is a lot of fun, and I'm quickly learning the sky by sight. I can find Polaris, Arcturus, Spica, Antares, Vega, Sadr, Albiero (which is beautiful) and a few others on my own now. The Baader Hyperion zoom is really nice too. I'm using it exclusively and not touching the included 40mm and 10mm eyepieces. I managed see Jupiter in the early morning after trying and failing to see the super blood moon. That was an interesting experience. I watched the moon become eclipsed and disappear entirely! I think the cloud cover prevented enough light transmission. But while I was out, I saw Jupiter up in the sky and got a decent view of it in the telescope! That was cool.

On the other hand, I haven't had amazing experiences looking at the Messier objects. The Hercules Globular Cluster is just a dim blurry smudge. Other globular clusters are not so thrilling either. Bode's Galaxy is practically invisible. I haven't been able to see any nebulas.

I haven't stayed out much beyond midnight though. I'm wondering if things simply aren't high enough in the sky to get a good view at this time of year, or if this 150mm aperture f/10 telescope is just not up to the task.

I think Celestron would make a bunch of money if they sold the tripod and mount separately. Once I hand the whole rig off to my dad in a few weeks, I am going to get my own telescope, but I feel like I want to keep using the app navigation feature.

[Louis D]

27 minutes ago, pointedstick said:

On the other hand, I haven't had amazing experiences looking at the Messier objects. The Hercules Globular Cluster is just a dim blurry smudge. Other globular clusters are not so thrilling either. Bode's Galaxy is practically invisible. I haven't been able to see any nebulas.

The best views will require you to either get up around 3 in the morning or wait another month or two.  The summer Milky Way is coming.

I recommend pushing the magnification up to around 200x to resolve large GCs like M13 and M22.  You may need to buy a Barlow to increase your magnification.  150mm should be enough to begin to resolve them.

If you missed the Orion nebula, you've missed the brightest emission nebula.  Try looking for M17.  It looks kind of like a cigar at first.  You might also be able to see M16 or M20.

Try looking for M57 and M27.  Again, crank up the power on these small planetary nebula (PNs).

Start looking for M6, M7, NGC 6530 within M8, and other open clusters.  They're quite beautiful.

I assume you've already bagged the Double Double since you mentioned Alberio.

Being in NM, you should be far enough south to get good views of Sagittarius and Scorpius which have a lot of objects.  Scan back northward along the Milky Way toward Cygnus for more objects.

[Stu]

54 minutes ago, pointedstick said:

On the other hand, I haven't had amazing experiences looking at the Messier objects. The Hercules Globular Cluster is just a dim blurry smudge. Other globular clusters are not so thrilling either. Bode's Galaxy is practically invisible. I haven't been able to see any nebulas.

A 6” SCT should be capable of showing you plenty. M13 is high up towards midnight so should show well, despite the lack of full darkness. In my 4” refractor it shows resolution around the edges at least, more if conditions are good particularly with averted vision. My Heritage 150p does a little better due to the additional aperture, so I would certainly expect you to be able to achieve some resolution on it. Good collimation, a well cooled scope and accurate focusing are all important in being able to pull these details out.

I echo the comments about adding some power to see more, provided you don’t go too far and make the object too dim. Practise and experience all help, as will the return of Astro darkness after the summer.

[Starslayer]

26 minutes ago, Stu said:

A 6” SCT should be capable of showing you plenty. M13 is high up towards midnight so should show well, despite the lack of full darkness. In my 4” refractor it shows resolution around the edges at least, more if conditions are good particularly with averted vision. My Heritage 150p does a little better due to the additional aperture, so I would certainly expect you to be able to achieve some resolution on it. Good collimation, a well cooled scope and accurate focusing are all important in being able to pull these details out.

I echo the comments about adding some power to see more, provided you don’t go too far and make the object too dim. Practise and experience all help, as will the return of Astro darkness after the summer.

Is this maybe different with Nate being in NM not Surrey?  😉

[Stu]

10 minutes ago, Starslayer said:

Is this maybe different with Nate being in NM not Surrey?  😉

Hmmm, now let me see. Oh yes, from Surrey M13 gets to 75 degrees, from NM it gets to……….. 89! Even better, although observing at the zenith can be a pain so it’s often better to catch it before or after. Either way the views should be very good.

[Starslayer]

1 hour ago, Stu said:

Hmmm, now let me see. Oh yes, from Surrey M13 gets to 75 degrees, from NM it gets to……….. 89! Even better, although observing at the zenith can be a pain so it’s often better to catch it before or after. Either way the views should be very good.

This novice bows to your knowledge sir. 😉 … and another lesson under the belt.

[Stu]

2 minutes ago, Starslayer said:

This novice bows to your knowledge sir. 😉 … and another lesson under the belt.

For greater knowledge read…. an ability to ask SkySafari for the answer 🤣🤣

[Louis D]

3 hours ago, Starslayer said:

Is this maybe different with Nate being in NM not Surrey?  😉

The biggest loss for those of us fairly far south (NM and TX) are the northern skies.  Circumpolar objects never get very high in the sky, so they never get out of the murk.  I haven't seen the Little Dipper clearly in years.

[pointedstick]

Cool, I'll check out that list of targets once it's darker out. The smoke from Arizona's wildfires seems to have mostly passed by now. http://www.cleardarksky.com says that conditions are almost perfect! I might hike over to a nearby hill too, and see if the view is any better over there. I'm lucky enough to live within walking distance of a good tall one. And it seems like my itch for a Barlow is on the money. Baader makes an optically-matched screw-on 2.25x one for my Hyperion zoom, but it seems like it might be a pain in the butt to put on and take off compared to a regular old 1.25" one?

[Pixies]

On 09/06/2021 at 02:54, pointedstick said:

Cool, I'll check out that list of targets once it's darker out. The smoke from Arizona's wildfires seems to have mostly passed by now. http://www.cleardarksky.com says that conditions are almost perfect! I might hike over to a nearby hill too, and see if the view is any better over there. I'm lucky enough to live within walking distance of a good tall one. And it seems like my itch for a Barlow is on the money. Baader makes an optically-matched screw-on 2.25x one for my Hyperion zoom, but it seems like it might be a pain in the butt to put on and take off compared to a regular old 1.25" one?

The issue with the Baader zoom barlow is that you can only use it by screwing it in to the bottom of an eyepiece barrel. So if you are wanting to swap between different EPs, it takes a little more effort and time. With an untracked mount, that might mean losing the target.

However, with the zoom, that doesn't matter.

[pointedstick]

To close the loop on this, I've handed the telescope over to my father and he's very happy with it. We got to see a lot of things together and it was great fun. The PushTo smartphone app feature remains awesome and useful!

Ultimately I ended up replacing the stock tripod with a smaller, lighter, more portable, and more stable carbon fiber model: https://store.sirui.com/collections/tripod-legs/products/sirui-am2-series-am-284-profilegs-carbon-fiber-big-tripod. That worked out very well. It is a very suitable tripod. I liked it so much that I eventually got one for myself to hold my own telescope, now that I've been bitten by the astronomy bug too! Views of Jupiter and Saturn are wonderful even with my little 80mm refractor.

Edited July 27, 2021 by pointedstick