My first telescope & accessories

[Steve187]

Good evening everyone,

I hope you are all keeping safe and well in these strange times we find ourselves in.

So, this week I am hoping to purchase my first, proper telescope and accessories to get myself and my family ready to explore the night sky. I say proper as I have an old traveller 76700 in the garage that I played around with many moons ago!

I've been reading lots over the past weeks on here and other places, I have to say there seems to be some incredibly knowledgeable people on here whose advice seems to be a great help. This is what I have decided on whilst trying to keep in roughly a £500.00 budget to get us started:

1. Bresser Messier 8" Dobsonian (seems for a little extra more this is a slightly better option than the Skywatcher 200p I originally intended to purchase)
2. Meade 4000 Super Plossl 9.7mm (as the scope comes with one 26mm eyepiece)
3. Skywatcher Deluxe Achromatic 2x Barlow (1.25)
4. Telrad Reflex Red Dot Finder (as I've heard the finder that comes with the scope isn't the greatest?)
5. Revelation ND96 Premium Moon Filter (1.25)

I hope this should provide the basics of a decent first attempt to get us off the ground and help us learn and explore. I also intend to get the Collins Guide to the Night Sky 2020 book as the reviews seem to say this is a guide to help us navigate the night sky.

As my wife has an old Canon 450D EOS camera too  I will also get a T-Ring, T-Adapter and a remote shutter release so we can take some basic pictures of what we're looking at. The main aim here is to learn, explore and understand with an eventual goal of maybe in 18 months / two years to then upgrade and invest in a proper 'Go To' setup. However, we want to learn and get to grip with things first.

Any advice / hints or tips would be really appreciated on if you think there is anything I should change / not bother with or add.

I do have two final questions as well (sorry!) that I'd appreciate any advice on:

• I have a Samsung Galaxy S9 phone that I'm so to upgrade to an S20+ - should I forget about using the Canon and look at mounting this as the camera on smart phones these days probably trumps the SLR or not bother for now?
• How important is it to adjust your eyes to the outside darkness? Should I refrain from bright screens / being indoors for 30 mins or so before starting my evening of exploring through the scope?

Thank you for reading and hopefully I haven't bored anyone / been of annoyance as I am sure you've all answered such questions numerous times before! I am really excited to get this all set-up and working in the coming weeks!

Thank you,
Steve.

 

 

[jonathan]

Your kit selection looks fairly mighty for a mere £500 budget, I'm surely you'll get a lot out of it (provided you have the strength or a flat surface and wheels to move it around!)

Personally I'm not sure about the barlow, you may find that under normal conditions it's not going to get much use (very steady and clear seeing is required for higher magnification), although it might give you another magnification option using the 26mm.  At super high mag you may not be able to nudge the dob accurately enough, perhaps leave the barlow until you're confident that you can get more out of the 9.7mm.

The Collins guides look good, I have a few of the small Philips guides and I really like the writing style and presentation, easy to read without being bombarded with facts I'll just forget in seconds.  I can recommend getting a Planisphere to help you learn the night sky and find things.

Night eye adaptation is very important, you should try to observe from a location that has no direct line of sight to any lights, even garden LED lights (these can usually be switched off).  When you want to observe something like a fuzzy nebula or a galaxy that's not much more than a faint misty patch, you'll need all of your night vision ability (use averted vision, it helps a lot).  Don't take your smart phone or tablet out if doing visual astronomy, it will reset your night vision in an instant.  Lunar and planetary observing is a bit different as those objects are usually fairly bright anyway so night adaptation isn't as important.  One tip might be to leave all the house lights off (make sure you can't see any upstairs windows or skylights) so that if you do need to pop back inside you're not confronted by any bright lights, use your night adaptation to see.  I've also pondered about the use of sunglasses to lessen the effect if I did have to turn a light on!

You should add a red light torch to your list, preferably one with a dimmer control - I have this Skywatcher Dual LED torch and it's excellent, it has a bright white torch for when you're packing up and a dimmer control, believe me you'll appreciate the dimmest setting once your eyes become night adapted.  There's nothing that annoys me more than people who walk up to me at an astronomy gathering with a full ultra-bright red LED head torch shining in my face!

You can get smart phone cradles for photographing what you see at the eyepiece, some get amazing results from this so it's definitely worth looking into; keep in mind that adding a smart phone and cradle may alter the scope balance a little.

Edited April 28, 2020 by jonathan

[Steve187]

Thank you for your response and advice Jonathan, much appreciated.

Do you think it might be better then to forget the Barlow for now and maybe get another eyepiece instead? Or perhaps even just remove the Barlow and get the red light torch instead?

Thanks again,
Steve.

[jonathan]

14 minutes ago, Steve187 said:

Thank you for your response and advice Jonathan, much appreciated.

Do you think it might be better then to forget the Barlow for now and maybe get another eyepiece instead? Or perhaps even just remove the Barlow and get the red light torch instead?

Thanks again,
Steve.

I would definitely choose a red light torch over the barlow to start off with, consider the barlow later.  Think also that a barlow is another piece of glass in the chain so you don't want to be chucking just anything in there, a cheap one could ruin the view.  I haven't bothered with them personally, although I do own one (Baader 2.25x Barlow for Baader Planetarium Zoom, which I also own and use with my solar telescope, never actually used either for night time astronomy).

Wrt red light torch, I see the Skywatcher seems to have a few bad reviews, I would agree that the build quality it's brilliant but mine works fine.  Whichever one you choose, one with a dimmer is going to be a worthwhile investment.  They have a very simple circuit inside so if something does go wrong it should be easy to fix (if out of warranty).

Edited April 28, 2020 by jonathan

[JOC]

FWIW I get on very well mounting my non-modded cannon on a T-ring to take a few a-focal photos

[johninderby]

Hi

The Bresser is a good choice. As it uses tube rings adjusting balance is as easy as moving the tube up or down a bit in the rings.

The Rigel Quickfinder might be a better choice than the Telrad for an 8” dob as it is small and compact so finding room for ot is a lot easier.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/search/for/rigel/

Would suggest one of the BST Starguider eyepieces as they are a very good eyepiece but not too expensive.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/search/for/starguider/

A smartphone is a good place to start with. Just a cheap smartphone holder and you can get pretty good results although being a dob it will be best suited for lunar and planetary use.

This is a good but cheap holder.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Gosky-Binocular-Spotting-Smartphone-Adapter/dp/B075N8J438/ref=sr_1_10?dchild=1&keywords=smartphone+telescope+holder&qid=1588068204&sr=8-10

 

Edited April 28, 2020 by johninderby

[Steve187]

Thanks Jonathan, a red light torch is on the list now so I will definitely get one before I get started.

I think I am going to get the Canon mounted to the scope and get used to taking a few images with it, thank you Joc. Do you have any specific tips to get me started in taking some basic pictures?

Thank you John, I will certainly have a look at the quickfinder you've mentioned there. I've had a quick look at the BST Starguider eyepieces and they do seem to have nothing but positive reviews on here and elsewhere. I think I will look at also maybe getting a Starguider 12mm too.

[johninderby]

The 26mm eyepiece that comes with the scope is actually a reasonable quality eyepiece and quite usable unlike some of the eyepieces that come with a scope. 

[JOC]

22 hours ago, Steve187 said:

I think I am going to get the Canon mounted to the scope and get used to taking a few images with it, thank you Joc. Do you have any specific tips to get me started in taking some basic pictures?

I think I'd suggest trying to take a decent picture of the moon (I don't know if it's decent, but I took the one in my avatar).  You will find the hardest thing is achieving sharp focus.  You can use a Bahtnitov mask on the telescope, I've got one, but have never tried it - plenty about them online.  I find that I am better off hitting the LCD display zoom in and watching that (but you don't get forever to do so before you need to click it again).  If you want to take night sky photos I've found it's almost more satisfying to dispense with the telescope and just to put the camera and wide angle lens (with the lowest F stop you've got) on a tripod, add an electronic cable release and wander outside (you can get a Bahtinov mask for your camera too).  You might want the zoom in feature again and focus is often just before the maximum twist.  Then go and see if you can get in a whole constellation or star area.  You can get free stacking software and it's a revelation to take say 20-30 shots of a few seconds and then ask the computer to stack them - all of a sudden loads of new stars that you can't see suddenly appear.  There is lots of help on SGL if you want to give it a try, but it does add a little interest to every day oberving and you can share the pictures with the folks that have stayed inside the house.   I've asked for help several times 

 In this thread below I got some help on a picture of the moon - a-focally 

 

 

[Steve187]

 

On 29/04/2020 at 10:53, JOC said:

I think I'd suggest trying to take a decent picture of the moon (I don't know if it's decent, but I took the one in my avatar).  You will find the hardest thing is achieving sharp focus.  You can use a Bahtnitov mask on the telescope, I've got one, but have never tried it - plenty about them online.  I find that I am better off hitting the LCD display zoom in and watching that (but you don't get forever to do so before you need to click it again).  If you want to take night sky photos I've found it's almost more satisfying to dispense with the telescope and just to put the camera and wide angle lens (with the lowest F stop you've got) on a tripod, add an electronic cable release and wander outside (you can get a Bahtinov mask for your camera too).  You might want the zoom in feature again and focus is often just before the maximum twist.  Then go and see if you can get in a whole constellation or star area.  You can get free stacking software and it's a revelation to take say 20-30 shots of a few seconds and then ask the computer to stack them - all of a sudden loads of new stars that you can't see suddenly appear.  There is lots of help on SGL if you want to give it a try, but it does add a little interest to every day oberving and you can share the pictures with the folks that have stayed inside the house.   I've asked for help several times 

 In this thread below I got some help on a picture of the moon - a-focally 

 

 

Thank you for this Joc, that is a great help. The threads also have some invaluable information in them too.

I think the best idea is to just get out there and snap away and see what happens, best way to learn I guess.

[Carbon Brush]

No harm in keeping the stock finder for the moment.

Finder scopes are very much a personal preference. It may be better to see how you go first, then spend.

For what its worth I like a RACI finder and a Rigel Quickfinder.
Straight through red dot finders differ considerably on quality and usefulness.
I hate striaght finders on newton scopes and sold a Telrad that came with a scope.

Others will have very different views (no pun intended) on finder choices.

Enjoy the experience and keep asking the questions.

David.

[JOC]

I have a Y shaped adapter for my telescope and on one branch I put an optical RACI and on the other a cheap RDF with this combo I can have the telescope on anything I can by eye in <30 seconds.

2 hours ago, Steve187 said:

I think the best idea is to just get out there and snap away and see what happens,

That's what I did - have fun!!

[Pixies]

Hi Steve,

I'm getting the same scope - in fact, just ordered it today (looking out at the rain). Have bought a couple of EPs from the classifieds here, and thinking about a Rigel/Telrad. I'll see how things go with the 6x30 finder that comes with it. You getting it from FLO?

I'd prob better get a red torch. But first the streetlight in the lane at the end of the garden needs to have a little accident!  

 

Keep in touch and let's compare notes. Used to live in Norwich.

 

Neil.

[johninderby]

More Bresser dobs. Like it. 😁😁😁

[cloudsweeper]

10 minutes ago, johninderby said:

More Bresser dobs. Like it. 😁😁😁

Yeah, they are very good.  Nice and stable in the all-important altitude axis.  I recommend the brand, also having two of their fracs.  

I have a Rigel and a RACI with my Bresser Dob - never took to straight-through finders, and - just my view - the Telrad is a bulky thing, whereas the Rigel is light, tall, and has a small footprint.  (The adhesive pads aren't great, so I drilled a hole in the tube to secure it with a self-tapping screw.)

Doug.

[Steve187]

Thank you David for the advice. Yes I guess it's each to their own. I might just have a play around with the one it comes with and see how it goes. 

I am definitely going to look into the Y adapter Joc and the set-up you have there. Sounds like a good idea. 

Hi Neil. Excellent, yes we'll have to compare notes and see how we get on with the scope! I'm just on the outskirts of the city (Costessey) and the light pollution near me isn't too bad luckily. I'm getting my scope from Rother Valley Optics. Best of luck with that streetlight! 😉

Thanks Doug. Everyone seeems to have positive comments about these Bresser dobs so I'm really looking forward to getting it and getting outside. 

[Nerf_Caching]

Hi! I appreciate that many would say that deep-sky imaging is not possible with a basic refractor on an alt-az goto but I have tried it many times and it can be done using 30-second exposures, so if you want to dabble in astrophotography I would spring for perhaps a short refractor on an alt-az goto if you don't mind the chromatic aberration!

PS: I mounted a skywatcher apochromatic refractor(the 72ED) on my Nexstar 5SE mount to take this picture without using the built-in wedge.

Edited May 4, 2020 by Nerf_Caching