First telescope EQ or Goto Altazimuth

[iapa]

On 25/02/2017 at 01:31, Ewalks77 said:

Hello all this is my first post here and I just had some questions about my first telescope/mount I'm probably buying in the next couple weeks. I have done a lot of research on what scope may be best for me and with me living in a well lit area (Lansing, MI) I've pretty much decided that I will be getting a refractor. With that being said and my budget being somewhere between $400-$700 (with mount included) I have narrowed it down to 2 telescopes that I'm looking very intently at. First being the NEXSTAR 102SLT with Goto Altazimuth mount (around $500). Reason being is it's my first scope and I believe I may need the Goto to help me find my way around the skies as I've heard using an EQ mount is very frustrating and complicated for someone to first learn with. My second scope is the Celestron Omni XLT 120mm, from the reviews I've read it is a great scope, much better than the 102, but does come with an EQ mount. I can afford both but don't want to buy the better scope if it really is that hard to learn the sky. 

My main goal at first with getting a scope is just observing some planets and the moons. Eventually I will get into DSO's and whatnot but have heard that I will need a place with low light pollution and a bigger aperture.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated especially from someone who has purchased one, or both of these scopes before.

 

I hope to hear your feedback soon. Thank you

 

Hi, if you are just start with an aim at imaging, I would suggest the Alt-Az goto with refractor.

EQ mounts, without GoTo, can be a pain as a starter scope I would say.

If you had decided you were going to get a reflector I would have suggested an EQ mount with goto (an AltAz mount .will rotate the tube, and thus the eyepiece which can become unreachable. Not an issue with a refractor as the eyepiece is at the rear.).

[iapa]

18 hours ago, Stormbringer said:

you can buy Stellarium for your android phone or tablet off google playstore i think it is about £4 it may also be available on I Phone etc

Can confirm that a port of Stellarium is available for IOS devices. It does seem to be lacking a few things, Ive not been able to find where to a mount

[N3ptune]

You should be sure if you want to watch DSO at the begining of the process of choosing whatever the mount, the instrument and if you are willing to drive your car to a dark spot --> To secure the true goals and prevent mistakes.

This is a test only:
If you are interested in DSOs, then you should set your minimum / maximum aperture size relatively to the weight, the handling and portability, these factors are a major influence on motivation. Most people say it's good to have 6" minimum for DSO observation, I would go to a store and lift a few 6,8,10,12 (GOTO, EQ, Dobson, altazimut) just to assess the possibilities. (ignoring the prices, budget and the fact that your are interested in the planets for now)

Because.. DSOs are really captivating, at least equally with the the planets.

Meditate on your level of motivation and the time you can spend on astronomy, evaluate your courage to get out at night, those are good questions to set things straight. If you don't have time, a family and 3 childrens, then goto is probably the obvious choice, otherwise a manual Dobson or an instrument on Altazimut mount is rewarding because you work your way around the sky using the finder, you truly learn the sky.

If you want to track at high magnification for sketching and for visual at the lowest price and with maybe a bit more aperture (reflector) then goto, the EQ with 1 axis tracking could be a good choice too. Manual EQ should be more reliable then full electronics but much more complicated to use.

I hope this will help.

[Ewalks77]

47 minutes ago, N3ptune said:

You should be sure if you want to watch DSO at the begining of the process of choosing whatever the mount, the instrument and if you are willing to drive your car to a dark spot --> To secure the true goals and prevent mistakes.

This is a test only:
If you are interested in DSOs, then you should set your minimum / maximum aperture size relatively to the weight, the handling and portability, these factors are a major influence on motivation. Most people say it's good to have 6" minimum for DSO observation, I would go to a store and lift a few 6,8,10,12 (GOTO, EQ, Dobson, altazimut) just to assess the possibilities. (ignoring the prices, budget and the fact that your are interested in the planets for now)

Because.. DSOs are really captivating, at least equally with the the planets.

Meditate on your level of motivation and the time you can spend on astronomy, evaluate your courage to get out at night, those are good questions to set things straight. If you don't have time, a family and 3 childrens, then goto is probably the obvious choice, otherwise a manual Dobson or an instrument on Altazimut mount is rewarding because you work your way around the sky using the finder, you truly learn the sky.

If you want to track at high magnification for sketching and for visual at the lowest price and with maybe a bit more aperture (reflector) then goto, the EQ with 1 axis tracking could be a good choice too. Manual EQ should be more reliable then full electronics but much more complicated to use.

I hope this will help.

This did help and has helped me make my mind up. For now at least I will be going with the AltAz mount with Goto I do work nights and it is hard for me to find a whole lot of time. Also I did hear that with a Dobsonian I would need dark skies for it's full potential, if I live in a city (like I do) a refractor would be a better choice. Is this true in your experience? 

[rockystar]

dark skies are better for any scope. I use my 8" dob in my pretty light polluted garden but I try to take it out to a dark site every couple of months.

And another alternative view: I have a family and young kids and for me a dob is perfect for plonking on the ground and observing when time is short

[iapa]

13 minutes ago, Ewalks77 said:

This did help and has helped me make my mind up. For now at least I will be going with the AltAz mount with Goto I do work nights and it is hard for me to find a whole lot of time. Also I did hear that with a Dobsonian I would need dark skies for it's full potential, if I live in a city (like I do) a refractor would be a better choice. Is this true in your experience? 

One thing to bear in mind I suppose, is that when people say 'Dobsonian' they are not really giving much away.

The erm does not specifically define the optics.

Mr Dobson, apparently, was aiming at all cost, lightweight mount for reflectors. Didn't actually define what reflector using would be used. So, it is possible that one could prepare a 20" reflector on a dobson in mount with light weight trusses and shroud that does not necessarily need particularly dark skies.

See, e.g. http://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/forum/reflector-or-dobsonian-t126362.html

[Ewalks77]

1 hour ago, iapa said:

One thing to bear in mind I suppose, is that when people say 'Dobsonian' they are not really giving much away.

The erm does not specifically define the optics.

Mr Dobson, apparently, was aiming at all cost, lightweight mount for reflectors. Didn't actually define what reflector using would be used. So, it is possible that one could prepare a 20" reflector on a dobson in mount with light weight trusses and shroud that does not necessarily need particularly dark skies.

See, e.g. http://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/forum/reflector-or-dobsonian-t126362.html

Oh ok. I believe I misspoke then. What I meant to say was that reflectors will a large aperture would need a darker area. As they are cheaper per inch of aperture usually. 

[iapa]

2 minutes ago, Ewalks77 said:

Oh ok. I believe I misspoke then. What I meant to say was that reflectors will a large aperture would need a darker area. As they are cheaper per inch of aperture usually. 

Can't speak for observing, but I've had, to me, reasonable success with an 8" f5 reflector and a DSLR.

I've not done much imaging since I took a photo, with mobile phone, through the eye piece of my 130mm reflector, of Jupiter, a white dot with 4 smaller blobs alongside.

That 'forced' me down the imaging route.

Anyway, I digress from the topic of best OTA for viewing.

[Ricochet]

2 hours ago, Ewalks77 said:

Oh ok. I believe I misspoke then. What I meant to say was that reflectors will a large aperture would need a darker area. As they are cheaper per inch of aperture usually. 

A larger aperture telescope isn't going to stop working if there is a bit of light pollution around. What a large aperture does is to have the potential to see deep space objects that are best (or only) seen from dark sites. From a light polluted site you can look at the objects visible from that location with either a large or small aperture telescope. The best reason to choose a smaller telescope over a larger one would be if the easier transportation of the smaller scope makes you more likely to get it out or take it to a dark location. 

[N3ptune]

3 hours ago, Ewalks77 said:

This did help and has helped me make my mind up. For now at least I will be going with the AltAz mount with Goto I do work nights and it is hard for me to find a whole lot of time. Also I did hear that with a Dobsonian I would need dark skies for it's full potential, if I live in a city (like I do) a refractor would be a better choice. Is this true in your experience? 

I would not really go with your first choice (for visual), the Celestron Nextstar 102 SLT refractor because it's short and will not provide enough magnifications for the planets. With a 5mm eyepiece you get 132x which is limit to enjoy Jupiter and Saturn, not enough for Mars and the aperture is kind of small for the DSOs..

Now, can a 120 mm refractor outperform a 8 inches Dobsonian for planets in heavy light pollution, that I can't say.

[Les Ewan]

HI Ewalks,

Judging by the number of replies you've had proves you'll never get a group of astronomers to agree about equipment! I'm glad your considering binoculars as well as a telescope.A decent set needn't cost a fortune and it would be a pity not to have them from the outset,something most of us would agree on.

After your new scope arrives will open up new discussions on seeing conditions what eyepieces to use and of course the dreaded dewing problem.

[N3ptune]

@Les Ewan

I would put a Like on your message on the other forum, if I could!

by les » Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:30 pm

[Ewalks77]

1 hour ago, N3ptune said:

I would not really go with your first choice (for visual), the Celestron Nextstar 102 SLT refractor because it's short and will not provide enough magnifications for the planets. With a 5mm eyepiece you get 132x which is limit to enjoy Jupiter and Saturn, not enough for Mars and the aperture is kind of small for the DSOs..

Now, can a 120 mm refractor outperform a 8 inches Dobsonian for planets in heavy light pollution, that I can't say.

That's really my worry. I didn't know if the smaller scope would excite me enough lol. But my main issue is the larger scope only comes with the eq mount. I wish there were a good way that someonecould display an image of what Jupiter would actually look like through various scopes without being a edited image if that makes sense. 

[N3ptune]

I see here many people use Dobsonians for planets and they get great results.

You can get the traditional Dobsonian, fast to install for maybe for less money then the first goto Celestron 102 SLT for something much more powerful. Plus, you can use it for DSOs, and you still have the money for 1 or 2 eyepieces. With a 6mm eyepiece you have 200x for the planets, no problems, and with a 28mm 2 inches eyepiece you get 40x for the DSO's. All rounder.

https://www.amazon.com/SkyWatcher-S11610-Traditional-Dobsonian-8-Inch/dp/B00Z4G3PRK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1488151701&sr=8-1&keywords=8+inches+dobsonian