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Disappointed with DSO views? I have the answer!

Bazzaar

By Bazzaar
in The Astro Lounge

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DoctorD

DoctorD

Posted
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If you are looking at alternatives to the samsung camera the things to look for are:-

Senestivity

0.05 no SENS-UP

0.0001 SENS-UP x512

Just to be clear smaller numbers are better!

Some cameras on go to x128 - or about 2.5 seconds integration, x512 will give you upto about 10 seconds.

You also need to be able to have some manual control over the SEN-UP - you may want to reduce the integration time when trying to fond the target object.

The Samsung SDC435 and SBC2000 are one of the best models - especially when you use the in built noise reduction.

Hope this helps

Paul

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DoctorD

DoctorD

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Hi Psychobilly

The SBC 2000 is exactly the same as the SDC435 - Samsung changes their model names.

The other is the 1/2" CCD version - bigger chip size so greater field of view and even more sensitive - otherwise should be just as good if not better than the SDC435.

The problem is that as theprice icreases you stat to get near the bottom end dedicated astro CCD - mind you I think that the SCC-A2333P will make a great astro camera.

Clear skies

Paul

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Bazzaar

Bazzaar

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Yes Peter thats the one Paul just mentioned in his post, except he has the letters transposed, its SCB 2000, or the 2001. (a minor revision change.)

The SCC-A2333 must be the ultimate of this range, even better sensitivty! the SCB 4000 is an equivalent model. Also its important to note that these last two have 1/2" sensors, so will cover more sky with their greater fov.

The SCB 2001 is the one that produced the images I posted.

Barry

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Psychobilly

Psychobilly

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Cheers guys...

Got car tax and inurance in the next few weeks so that will dictate where I go camera wise...

Must admit the more expensive 1/2" one would be my prefered choice...

I have an ION Video 2 GO for display and capture on the laptop...

The SBC according to the specs are running a newer version of the processing software...

Thanks again for all the info in the thread...

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Psychobilly

Psychobilly

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Chatting to one suypplier and they recommend the

Samsung SCB-4000P A1 Series 1/2" True Day/Night 600TVL High Resolution Camera 12/24v as its a newer model camera

Samsung SCB-4000P A1 Series 1/2" True Day/Night 600TVL High Resolution Camera 12/24v

instead of the Samsung SCC-A2333P A1 Series 1/2" Super High Resolution 600TVL Ex-View Day/Night Camera 12/24v

Samsung SCC-A2333P A1 Series 1/2" Super High Resolution 600TVL Ex-View Day/Night Camera 12/24v

Which according to the spec sheets is more sensitive... but the same when comparing apples with apples rather than the headline figures...

They recommend a 12V 1A psu for it which they sell for about a tenner..

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Bazzaar

Bazzaar

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Samsung SCC-A2333P A1 Series 1/2" Super High Resolution 600TVL Ex-View Day/Night Camera 12/24v

Which according to the spec sheets is more sensitive... but the same when comparing apples with apples ratehr than the headline figures...

I thought the sensitivity spec was confusing too, until I worked that cameras have a IRE system which specifies the percentage of output level for a lux light level, so you had the miss matched specs, one telling you its lux sens at 15% ouput against another at full output! grr. marketing tricks, you gotta keep your wits about ya, they'll fleece ya fer 2 bob!:)

Barry

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Psychobilly

Psychobilly

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Just got to decide between the 1/2" or 1/3" sensors (ccdcalc session called for) and a wideangle fast(ish) lens for metor watching...

I almost pushed the button earlier but a weekend of research is called for...

I already have the adaptors to use my M42 lenses... and t-thread ones...

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Bulkins

Bulkins

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Hi Psychobilly

The problem is that as theprice icreases you stat to get near the bottom end dedicated astro CCD - mind you I think that the SCC-A2333P will make a great astro camera.

Paul

Perhaps someone who is more technically minded than me can explain what exactly the dedicated astro cameras have that a Samsung doesn't (using the SCB-4000 with a 1/2" chip as a comparison - which can be had for £220 inc VAT). I'm not convinced that there isn't a very large, possibly unjustified, premium attached to the 'astro' label.

Modern Astronomy have tech specs for some Mintrons and Watecs but to my untrained eye these don't seem to have anything that the Samsungs don't. I certainly don't see anything that suggests specially cooled cameras but, as mentioned above, I am no expert here and would be happy to be corrected by better qualified persons.

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Bulkins

Bulkins

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The Sensitivity is it Apples with Apples?

Looking at the specs it does seem very hard to compare. Is there one particular specification listed for each (or even a combination of 2/3) that could reasonably be used to compare sensitivity? Also, the Samsung spec includes a number of items that are not listed for the astro cameras, e.g. image stabilisation - do these not exist on the astro cameras or do they add nothing in an astro context.

I get the feeling that it's too difficult to answer without proper objective tests. However, with the massive additional cost for the Watec 120N I would be very surprised if it doesn't have something going for it - but I still suspect it is carrying a large 'astro' premium. I wouldn't be surprised if there is nothing in it with the Mintrons.

Anyone want to volunteer to buy both the Samsung and Watec and conduct an objective comparison? :D

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Psychobilly

Psychobilly

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Even Samsung use differnet methods for listing the sensitivity specs.. hence the origianl confusion and "apples v apples" :D

I'm looking for a multi use product that will be useful when its not on the back of the scope... Setup on the "Bird Cafe" .. the feathered variey not the other type :p

The Samsung's look ideal...

Peter...

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Bazzaar

Bazzaar

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The image stabilisation of the Samsungs may help take out small amounts of image drift between frames. This needs confirming.

I think it is a little unfair to compare state of the art cameras like the Samsungs, with Mintrons and Watecs where the design is from generations ago.

Also the price, Samsung, HUGE multinational knocking out millions of units for a price critical market, ie video survialence, when the other companies are smaller manufactures in specialist markets, machine/industrial imaging. We are taking advantage of hardware from disparate application that do not normally compete with each other.

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Bazzaar

Bazzaar

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Just got to decide between the 1/2" or 1/3" sensors (ccdcalc session called for) and a wideangle fast(ish) lens for metor watching...

I almost pushed the button earlier but a weekend of research is called for...

I already have the adaptors to use my M42 lenses... and t-thread ones...

hmm, meteor watching, these cameras have an intruder/motion alarm system that you might be able to set up to give you a signal every time you get a meteor. You could set a PC to use that signal to save the current frame, nice bit of automation?

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MLyons

MLyons

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Hmmm.....unfortunately, I don't qualify yet for access to the buy/sell part of this forum.

If I did, I could tell you that I have an A2333, a SDC 435 and 2 SCB2000 cameras with remote control mods and 1 1/4 nose pieces available - ready to just pop into a focuser and off you go...........but I don't, so I won't.

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