First light. Kind of alright....

[northernnutter]

Hey all,

Just thought I'd share my first experience observing..( I use the term lightly.. ), with my new 200p Dob.

Ok, so...last night, clear skies, scope out for a good while before use, red torch, bino's and lots of enthusiasm!!!

First thing I wanted to do was get used to moving the thing...no biggie, but being my first scope, this in itself was quite challenging. Had the tension handle far too tight to start with, but gradually got a feel for how loose I needed it to be able to move smoothly.

Next then.....aiming at some targets!! Now I have been observing the sky using my bino's for months, and thought I knew my 'back garden ' sky quite well!! ( Can find all the visible constellations etc,), so thought I would start on , (what I thought) would be easy targets for me....mizar and alcor, the beehive cluster, saturn!!

Hmmmm....suffice to say, I didn't find any of them. Even looking through the finder scope left me very disorientated...could see lots of lovely stars, but had no idea which they were! And the view through the finder scope seemed much nicer than the view through the scope itself, using the 25mm eyepiece provided?? Sharper...clearer....I fear I may be doing something wrong!

Decided to try and find saturn, think I found it, but looked no different than in me bino's,...( a shiny dot)..it that right? Didn't try the 10mm eyepiece as, to be honest, wanted to keep things as easy as possible first time out.

Now...this may all sound a little negative...but, despite all, I had a blinking great time!! Moving the scope around, getting used to the feel of the thing, seeing new patterns of stars... Didn't 'find' anything...but, hey, just leaves more to look for next time round!! I'm sure I'll get there.....definately a little more practice is needed... (and possibly a Telrad. )

Clears skies....

Vicky.

[nicnac]

cant have been Saturn, even with the 25mm, i get a fair peek and know it for what it is.

you have a well regarded telescope there

[Nexus 6]

Hi Vicky, I am sure it will come to you in time, I am about to take up the dob route myself so will be in the same boat soon

What is your lowest power eyepiece? I would start with that for sure.

Saturn will be unmistakable when you see it, a check with stellarium should help

[northernnutter]

cant have been Saturn, even with the 25mm, i get a fair peek and know it for what it is.

you have a well regarded telescope there

Thanks for the clarification. Wishful thinking on my part then...

Hi Vicky, I am sure it will come to you in time, I am about to take up the dob route myself so will be in the same boat soon

What is your lowest power eyepiece? I would start with that for sure.

Saturn will be unmistakable when you see it, a check with stellarium should help

I only have the two eyepieces that came with the scope...10mm, and 25mm. Forgive my ignorance...lowest power? That's the 25mm right??

[Ad Astra]

Hi Vicky!

Sounds like you had a good first night learning 'telescope skills', now its time to go on to 'observing skills'. Oh, and no more of the "I'm with stupid" stuff, even in fun! (I hate that thing!). Stupid folks couldn't come up with a cogent question to save their lives! You are a very intelligent, curious person, learning a new, demanding and rewarding hobby that the truly stupid would never take up.

On to help out a bit!

1. Let's start with that finder. Your dob works perfectly well during the day, so start there and see if you can focus on a steeple, power pole, or something like that perhaps a mile away. Use your 25mm eyepiece (yes, it is the lower power one!), and center your target in view. Now, without moving the scope, adjust the finder in its holder so that the same object is centered in the cross hair (or red dot!). You can refine the aim by switching to the 10mm eyepiece and re-centering your target, then recheck the finder's aim. With it adjusted this way, finding things in the night sky is a snap.

2. Now that you can point your machine, it is time to learn how to move it about the sky in a precise and controlled way. Let's start with Ursa Major, the Big Dipper or Plough is easy to find, and everyone knows the iconic shape of the thing. Start by pointing your scope at a star at one end, and practice hopping your scope from one star of the dipper to the next, back and forth until you have it. Try this while looking through the finder, then again while looking through the scope. Soon, you will feel comfortable enough to trace any constellation, or star hop to find your favorite DSO's.

Star hopping is an excellent skill to master, and you will discover many wonderful sights along the way. The difference between the naked eye view and the eyepiece view will soon become so commonplace, you won't even think consciously about them anymore. But the only road to that perfection lies in practice. Lots and lots of lovely eyepiece time.... mmmmm!

Let me know how you get on, and when you have your next question, I'll be glad to help if I can.

Dan

[Nexus 6]

Thanks for the clarification. Wishful thinking on my part then...

I only have the two eyepieces that came with the scope...10mm, and 25mm. Forgive my ignorance...lowest power? That's the 25mm right??

yes it is. I would try and get hold of a 32mm widefield or there abouts for using when I first started off, it will help you in trying to detect any targets you are trying to find

[banner001]

Thanks for the clarification. Wishful thinking on my part then...

I only have the two eyepieces that came with the scope...10mm, and 25mm. Forgive my ignorance...lowest power? That's the 25mm right??

correct, 25mm is a lower power EP than the 10mm.

a 25mm EP will give you 48x magnification (probably 4x that of your binos) and the 10mm EP will give you 120x magnification.

i can see saturn easily in my much smaller scope at 40x magnification, it looks like a small ball with a line through it. at 120x you will see saturn, rings and should see titan depending on your atmospheric conditions, and ambient light.

[northernnutter]

Dan....thankyou for your wonderfully informative and encouraging post. I feel more confident already!!!

I will definately tackle the finderscope issue, and hopefully get to grips with this 'star hopping malarkey'.

Progress report pending.....

yes it is. I would try and get hold of a 32mm widefield or there abouts for using when I first started off, it will help you in trying to detect any targets you are trying to find

Thankyou nexus....Seems like a bit more cash, with a keen eye on the 'for sale' section is in order....

correct, 25mm is a lower power EP than the 10mm.

a 25mm EP will give you 48x magnification (probably 4x that of your binos) and the 10mm EP will give you 120x magnification.

i can see saturn easily in my much smaller scope at 40x magnification, it looks like a small ball with a line through it. at 120x you will see saturn, rings and should see titan depending on your atmospheric conditions, and ambient light.

cheers Banner,...now at least I know what I 'should' be seeing!

[NickK]

Next then.....aiming at some targets!! Now I have been observing the sky using my bino's for months, and thought I knew my 'back garden ' sky quite well!! ( Can find all the visible constellations etc,), so thought I would start on , (what I thought) would be easy targets for me....mizar and alcor, the beehive cluster, saturn!!

Hmmmm....suffice to say, I didn't find any of them. Even looking through the finder scope left me very disorientated...could see lots of lovely stars, but had no idea which they were! And the view through the finder scope seemed much nicer than the view through the scope itself, using the 25mm eyepiece provided?? Sharper...clearer....I fear I may be doing something wrong!

I started on the vixen - 80mm f11.4 - and felt I knew my way around.. switching to the 105mm f6.38 left me completely disorientated as if the sky was a completely different location!

If takes time to get to used to the difference in appearance of the brighter stars and see through the mass behind them. Soon you'll be back to zipping around the stars but for the first few nights it's very disconcerting!

I can just echo what others have said about EPs. My bundled vixen 20mm is 1/2 the brightness of my 13mm Baader Hyperion, even with the difference in focal length! (usually you'd expect the 13mm to be half the brightness of the 20+mm!)

On the plus side - EPs can move with you between scopes. Just take your time and have a think about the level of magnification that you fell would be good. Getting along to a star party of astro club bash is a great idea for experiencing other peoples EPs (even through your own scope).

[northernnutter]

I started on the vixen - 80mm f11.4 - and felt I knew my way around.. switching to the 105mm f6.38 left me completely disorientated as if the sky was a completely different location!

Soon you'll be back to zipping around the stars but for the first few nights it's very disconcerting!

Getting along to a star party of astro club bash is a great idea for experiencing other peoples EPs (even through your own scope).

Hi Nick, It's great to know that others have suffered the same 'affliction', and come out on the other side!

Difficult for me to get to Astro clubs...(I work wierd shifts...lates/ nights), but I am booked on the Peak star Party. But wether I can hold off from splashing cash on more lovely EP's till then will be a challenge!!

[Nexus 6]

Yes, to confirm what Nick has said, at least the eyepieces you buy can stay with you if you do change the scope at any time in the future. A decent widefield low power is pretty much an essential so should be a keeper, not a goalie though , but one to never get rid of

[northernnutter]

the eyepieces you buy can stay with you if you do change the scope at any time in the future. A decent widefield low power is pretty much an essential

What is classed as a 'decent' widefield?? I've done a little research, and prices vary quite a lot! Do you have to pay a couple of hundred quid for a 'decent' keeper, or do cheaper options suffice for a newbie just starting out like me??

[JamesC]

Ad Astra has some good tips there. Sounds obvious but taking time to align your finder scope really helps. You need something like a distant steeple or mast or something to do this. Don't use the stars - they move! I found the straight through inverting finder scope that seems to come as standard really hard to use. Not only did it give me a crick in the neck but the whole inverting thing is the last thing I need when trying to find something. I now use a right angle erect image finder, although a red dot finder is also a good choice.

[northernnutter]

Not only did it give me a crick in the neck but the whole inverting thing is the last thing I need when trying to find something. I now use a right angle erect image finder, although a red dot finder is also a good choice.

Crick??....not half!!!!

Being 5ft nowt, big scope....thought I would be quite comfy!!

NOOOO!!!! BAck's awful today!! But looks like I'll have to persevere at the mo, 'cos the budget just 'ain't there for extra's at the mo!(But a different finder is definately on the cards!!)

[twotter]

You don't have to spend hundreds on EPs, though some do

The first EP I bought to add to the standard ones you have was a GSO Revelation 32mm plossl. Cost about £35 if I remember rightly, last year, and was my favourite, not to mention most used, EP.

As well as adding to my EP collection, I couldn't get on with the 9x50 finder, so replaced it with a simple red dot finder. Star hopping is now much easier for me, in combination with Stellarium and Turn Left at Orion.

Sympathies for your back & clear skies

[JamesC]

I also have a GSO 32mm plossl. It's a really good eyepiece. Won't be a lot different to your 25mm, but the extra field will help a bit and it also has the widest field possible in a 1.25" eyepiece. A decent 2" eyepiece will probably cost well over 100.

[kris h]

Had a look at saturn last night with 80mm refractor & with 32mm

e p you could just about make out its rings at that Mag like Nick

said, so it must of been a star On my first light with my scope &

mount i dropped a counterweight on my foot & didnt tighten one

the tripod legs enough i was stood there putting the finder scope on

& it started to tilt & pushed against me it is quite heavy didnt have

a clue what i was doing but did find jupiter last part of your post

made me laugh hope you get out again soon saturn will be a

lovely sight in your Dob

Clear skies

[NickK]

I also have a GSO 32mm plossl. It's a really good eyepiece. Won't be a lot different to your 25mm, but the extra field will help a bit and it also has the widest field possible in a 1.25" eyepiece. A decent 2" eyepiece will probably cost well over 100.

Baader make very good EPs. They are expensive but I had a single EP for a while.

The best way to go about it is spend some more time with your scope and EPs (too early in my view to jump at buying a random EP). Then when you're getting used to zooming around you'll start thinking "wish I had something about *here* between these to Eps". Do the following with your EPs and scope:

scope focal length / eyepiece focal length = magnification.

So for me, bearing in mind my 105mm aperture limits the magnification for DSOs, my three Eps give:

675mm / 3.5 = x192 magnification (planets and lunar)

675mm / 13 = x51 (this is my workhorse for finding DSOs)

675mm / 31 = x21 (this is a big 2" EP with 72deg FoV)

For you, the resulting magnification for the Eps would be completely different due to your scope focal length. Bear in mind that in perfect seeing in the UK, you'll not get above x270, usually the max limit is x225-250. Just take your current EP magnifications and then think what you want in terms of magnification then simply use the formula in reverse to get the EP focal length.

EPs have a very marked effect on the image you see - no two manufacturers 13mm appear the same. Price is a diminishing return but that depends on the scope optics and your eyes (along with the wallet/purse!). I tried several EPs of the same focal length at SGL6 and the Nagler made saturn 3D, the baader was better than the William Optics in my opinion (and eyesight!) due to the level of detail presented.

[MissMessier]

Hi Vicky!

Sounds like you had a good first night learning 'telescope skills', now its time to go on to 'observing skills'. Oh, and no more of the "I'm with stupid" stuff, even in fun! (I hate that thing!). Stupid folks couldn't come up with a cogent question to save their lives! You are a very intelligent, curious person, learning a new, demanding and rewarding hobby that the truly stupid would never take up.

Dan

[northernnutter]

Thanks all, for all the great advice and encouragement!

Nick.....I think your advice is very sound! Think I'll stick to the EP's I have for the moment and master those first, After all, what's the point of buying more when I can't find stuff with the one's I've got??

Plus, I've gotta figure out basic stuff like 'glasses..no glasses...eye relief...oh my!!!

James and Twotter......when I 'do' move on a bit, it sounds like the 32mm GSO would be a great 'first step'....nothing like personal reviews to give confidence in buying! (And the price sounds just about right!)

Kris...your first light experience sounds great!! Only way is 'up' from that!!

Funnily enough, the first 'extra' I could be getting is a shed!! (Obsy!!!??)

The OH said we'd better get one to get the 'blinking missile launcher' out of his beloved garage!!!

Vic.

[Vicky]

Sounds similar to how I expect my first night to go- I want to get a feel for how telescopes work- how to move. I love Dan's star hopping idea. I was going to buy Turn Left at Orion but thought I'd use between now and August (when the next one comes out- spiral bound) to twiddle and just enjoy seeing what I can see.

Thanks for sharing Vicky

[Vicky]

And I also now know I need to practice in the day time before it gets dark.

[bombassa]

As stated by above - correct adjustment of the finder scope is really important. Finding stuff with the binos is relatively easy because of the large field of view. The scope on the other hand only gives you about 1 degree with your 25 mm eyepiece (I think) so being in the right place at first makes it a whole lot easier.

Don't give up.

If I can learn so can you.

Clear skies.