vineyard

There is no such as thing as being overmounted  That's a lovely shot.

I prefer the second - much more delicate.  Lovely.

Great shots.  I've been playing with a Lunt 50 for a while and it's great.  Now I'm waiting waiting waiting for a Solar Quest to arrive from @FLO (patience is a virtue in these times!).

Had to laugh at the dovetail & scope thread mismatch - same thing with the Lunt 50.  I thought it was only me doing something silly, but clearly this must be a deliberate thing to upsell mechanical things.

Enjoy!

I really wasn't happy with the 2nd image above - truly awful processing.

So I tried again

I think this is better & I'm call it a day on this particular object (until I get a cooled camera - this mono image w a 10" shows the area much better 😂)

Cheers.

Hello,

So I added some more data last night to this, but with a CLS-CCD filter combined with a UHC filter (to try and mimic a tri-band).  Followed the same processing routine more or less (but can't remember the precise levels from last time).

It looks like there's more colour in this image.  Had to crop it a bit more b/c I didn't rotate the camera around for last night.  One day I'll get a cooled camera!

The processing is still butchery but the difference in tone seems palpable?

Cheers & stay safe all,

Vin 

Thanks all.  As per @Skipper Billysuggestion above, I've set up a separate thread for my ASC newbie journey to avoid hijacking this one too much!  Cheers & stay safe all.

Thanks all.  So I managed to spend some time on the roof yesterday afternoon - had to fix something anyway, and took some test shots from different locations.  Definitive conclusion: its got to be mobile.  The chimney pot would be extremely inaccessible and the image framing gains wouldn't be that great, whereas with a mobile box, I can put in different locations (including in a cradle like a satellite dish is mounted on) and actually get some interesting foreground features too.  That did get me thinking of more Qs but I will post those later as running late!

Cheers & stay safe,

Vin

1 hour ago, MarkAR said:

Hi Vin, I use Ekos with a Lakeside focuser.

If it can't find focus after a number of tries it goes back to its initial position and stops everything.  It should be the same with other focusers.

Thanks Mark.   I think the Lakeside is an absolute focuser b/c its a stepper motor.  So that would definitely be "safer".

I'm trying to see if I can keep using my pulse motor Focusmate without having to get a new stepper motor.  It can certainly work as long as a human is there to override, but I'm wondering what could happen if that wasn't the case at 0200!

Cheers

That double-stack is exquisite - I now see what the fuss is about DS!

Hello,

Hope everyone well.  I've posted this Q on the indilib forum as well, but I thought I'd check w SGLers too in case folks have used EKOS with a DC focuser (I think what EKOS would call either a "simple" focuser or a "relative" focuser in its options?).

I've got an old TV Focusmate, and so am on the verge of getting a Shoestring Astronomy FCUSB (although maybe FLO's latest acquisition Hitecastro's DC focuser would also do the trick).  I know EKOS supports both those from the dropdown options that appear.

Has anyone used those & what have the experiences been like?  My biggest concern is that during the night, clouds come in, it can't find focus, and heads off trying to find it which takes the focuser all the way in or all the way out and I wake up to burnt out motors (or worse).  Is that a stupid concern?  (For example will the software just make the focuser go back & forth since it gets worse in all directions?  Is it possible to set an override or shutdown flag on EKOS where if HFR deteriorates too much, it just closes everything & parks?).

If that is a possibility, then I would rather just set focus at the start and leave it (the way the Focusmate works, there's an O-ring on the motor that presses against the manual focuser and that is what makes the fine focuser change - it strikes me that if during the night temperature drops (in winter!) the focuser will still stay where it is because for it to move in or out it would have to be able to turn a switched off pulse motor which is unlikely (a bit like a v strong handbrake?)?).

Cheers & stay safe,

Vin

Hello,

At @Skipper Billysuggestion I'm starting this as a new thread so that other threads don't get hijacked!  Its also a good way for me to track my own thinking on this.

So, where I live the houses & flats are quite tall - which means only limited patches of sky visible (enough to keep me occupied but not enough for an ASC in or near the garden).  However, get up to the roof and its a different story.  Huge sky in all directions (only obstructions being chimneys) - with nice views of distant skyscrapers too.

I currently have an ASI178MC (which comes with a 170degree lens) and am hoping at some stage to move to a cooled camera.  Which of course leaves open the possibility of an ASC.

I'm v much at early stages so here is my current deliberating.  (Hopefully this journey will eventually complete - although there's no rush as I need the 178 for my normal AP practicing still).

1.  Don't really want to buy off the shelf finished product - where's the fun in that.

2.  @Gina's blog is an amazing starting point (thank you!).  I don't have the sophistication for all of that yet (it'd be a fun learning curve?).  And what I notice is that all those items add up to quite a total.

3.  Permanent or mobile?  That's the first Q.

4.  If permanent, then I need to figure out getting power, temperature control, and of course data-retrieval.  One possibility that comes to mind is having a camera put in on top of a chimney pot with the dome over it, and running the USB down the flue!  Total height is too long for a normal USB cable, but maybe a Startech style solution of having USB2 over Cat5/Cat6 extender?  The remote USB2 can then power the camera & a dew heater, and and bring the data back.  Those cables can transmit 300mA of current to the remote side - an uncooled ASI178MC apparently runs at 170mA, and a dew heater module like this (via Gina!) runs 0.23A, so that would total to 400mA though - will that discrepancy be too large?  For cooling, if the dome is on top of a chimney, those typically have good thermal stability characteristics (as long as made of earthenware or something like that), and if the bottom is open (eg: the camera & USB2 remote hub sitting on a tough open mesh of heat resistant plastic) then the air column in the chimney flue would take heat away sufficiently to avoid overheating?

• The Cat5/6 extender will be pricey, but compared to everything else that is needed and if it can be got 2nd hand, maybe that's still cheaper?
• As an aside on this, is it possible to coat a dome with anti-UV, anti-IR film (a bit like filters!) to cut down on energy ingress?
• This way, the base USB hub can be connected to an RPi which can also be removed & used for other things when needed?  And data retrieval v easy.

6.  If that won't work (and the downside is that the camera is v difficult to retrieve), then something mobile in a box.  That can only be put up in the evening & retrieved in the morning (and can of course be put in different locations or taken on travels).  So a normal power source like a mobile phone charger pack, or a Tracer (since everything can be unboxed and used), to power the RPi, the camera & the dew heater?

• Can solar panels be used to provide enough charging to a battery that can power this?
• If not, can a junction box type of setup be used where the charging point for a battery, and a USB point for a pen drive (for data) can be accessed from the outside (say by rotating or folding up waterproof flaps) so that the box would not need opening up unless for dramatic maintenance?
• Can a more basic RPi (like a Zero) be used to sufficiently drive the image collection & retrieval - b/c that would allow it to be permanently left in the box - although a 3 isn't that pricey anyway to be fair.  I'm not sure whether EKOS or Stellarmate would work on anything less than a 3 though, so maybe then other software would need to be used (like some of the other threads on SGL) - if so which would be most stable?  If a Pi3 then can a Stellarmate licence be used on multiple RPis?

Ill stop there for the time being.  I have no idea how far this idea will go for me, or how long it will take!  But I know the views from the v top of the roof are quite something (if I could perch a small wide-angle permanent set-up, like an astrokraken & a wide-angle lens, on a the roof of a flat dormer I would but that ambition is way beyond my current level of expertise!).

Stay well all,

Vin

15 hours ago, Adam J said:

It is about another £300 for some cheaper LRGB filters and a ZWO 5 position wheel ~£160 to start out with a mono camera. It will cost you more than that if you buy an OSC and then trade it in as you will have lost money on it. When I started with mono I litterally got the 80 pound baader beginer LRGB filter set given to me by a friend and to be honest they where still better than a OSC in terms of colour balance.

Once you have an electronic wheel then you can just cycle LLLRGB, LLLRGB....and you will always get an image in a single night and it will always be a better imagin in the same time as you would have than with a OSC.

The 3000A is a tiny sensor more for lunar and solar imaging to be honest. Maybe closeups on smaller galaxies with medium focal length scopes. You dont want that for DSO imaging. Although you are correct in that a OSC will half the resolution of a mono camera of the same sensor.

You need to check out FOV simulator to see what you will fit onto the sensor with your scope.

I would strongly push you towards a mono camera, yes the initial outlay is a little more but to be honest its well worth it in the long run.

If you like the looks of the Moravian cameras (and I do to) then really only the C1+12000A will give you a decent FOV unless your specifically looking to image smaller targets only the 3000 and 5000 are much smaller sensors and I dont thing they will do what you want.

The 9000e well depth is not a problem as they are quoating that at 1.8e read noise and 2.2ADU per electron so the dynamic range with be similar to a ASI1600mm pro at unity but i need to work it out properly.

Like I said above if it was me and I was going mono I would give this camera a shot, but I think that if you really want to go OSC I would actually recommend the ASI533mc pro.

Adam

 

 

Thanks Adam, you've given me a lot to think through.  I suspect it will boil down to price (& hence patience...or not...on my part).

The 533 has poorer resolution than the C1+12000A (9MP vs 12MP even before colour factor thrown in - I had thought it reduced by 2/3 rather than 1/2 but obviously misunderstood that, doh).  Similar FOV (albeit differently shaped) for the two.

The ASI2600MCPro seems to be more closely comparable to the C1+12000A in terms of resolution (once colour factor thrown in).  So then it seems to be a shootout between them - zero amp-glow w 2600MCp & bigger FOV/sensor but 10% pricier when compared to C1+12000A w EFW & filters.

Both way above where I was thinking - ah well, whether to be patient or not.  Luckily I have budgetary time to research more, & keep a weather eye for people upgrading 😂

Cheers,

Vin

Hello,

Sorry to intrude on this thread - I am starting the process of researching a home-made all-sky cam as well and so this & a few other threads are making interesting & helpful reading (I hope to be able to upgrade my camera to a cooled one later this year, which may leave me an ASI178MC knocking about).

This is probably a daft question, but has anyone ever just secured a sealed dome with the camera on top of a chimney pot and run the USB lead down the chimney (obviously a non-functioning chimney!)).

Thank you,

Vin

59 minutes ago, Philip R said:

From what I have read on other astro-forums; the Chinese branded/manufactured William Optics EZ-Touch are/were not that good. 

Hello, yes I suspect you're right about those ones.  However (and I didn't realise this until I stumbled across one) the first EZ-Touches were made in Switzerland by AOK.  I know from Beat Kohler that he only made c 300 of those before WO switched to Chinese production.  Happily, the one I have is one of those 300 and is even co-branded "Made in Switzerland by AOK"   Solid & smooth!  Cheers.

EDIT: Oops sorry @Philip R I just realised I'd already said that in previous post - apologies, clearly lack of clear skies driving me bananas. Here's a photo of it sitting atop an old Vixen AL tripod - I need to find wooden legs to replace the aluminium ones!

Hello,

I'm a newbie to imaging (& processing), so with those caveats, here are some I've taken with a Lunt 50 B400.  (The white one is a deliberately maxed-out gain image).  These were all taken on an alt-az mount as far as I can remember - I think the data would have been better for processing on an EQ or solar-tracking mount (EDIT: the maxed out gain one was taken on an EQ).

If you haven't already bought it, you might want to check out what @Highburymarkis selling (a Lunt 60 for not much more than what the list price of a Lunt 50 B600 probably is) - I've noticed SGLers take a lot of amazing images  w a Lunt 60.

Cheers,

Vin

2 hours ago, Adam J said:

What makes you want OSC? 

I've been asking myself that a fair bit (need to make sure I make the right decision).  I think it boils down to (a) convenience & (b) economics.

On the economics side, clearly no need for 3-4 filters, filter wheel (although I'd probably do without a wheel & just pop one filter per clear night and image different targets).

On the convenience side, the ability to get a colour image to show to family quicker   With the number of clear nights uncertain, gathering 3-4 bands of data on an object may take who knows how much longer (if you work on say needing 4-8 hrs of data per band?).  Although the flip to that is that it's better to do something well, and as I have restricted views eventually over the years the number of targets will be more or less the same so it'd be worth being patient...

I'd also have to learn a bit more Pixinsight wrt multi-channel combination, but that's doable.

As you can see, I ebb & flow on this choice!

Certainly with an OSC the nominal mega-pixel advantage I guess disappears once you spread it across 4 - eg if I'm understanding things right, per channel the Moravian C1+3000A is about the same as the 294MC (& a lot cheaper, although with a shallower full well still?).

What's tipping me in particular towards OSC is the argument that the tri-band filters (or a similar combination, like an Astronomik UHC+IR) with an OSC can go a long way towards closing the gap w mono?  But since I've never used any of these yet, I can't vouch for that first-hand, although the next clear night I may well try and compare UHC+IR vs "traditional" OSC just to see if there is a palpable difference.

All thoughts & suggestions v welcome!

3 hours ago, Adam J said:

I would say that the build quality of Moravian is better than ZWO they have nicer features and you dont have to send it to china if something is wrong.

I think that you would only really go for this in OSC over the ASI294mc pro is you really wanted the smaller pixels 3.45um but did not want to go so far as a ASI183mc pro.

My personaly opinion if that this is more interesting as a mono camera than a OSC camera.

It is smaller than the 1600mm pro or the 294mc yes but bigger than the 183. Something to bear in mind is that both the 294 and the 1600 sensors have some niggling issues with them. The ASI1600mm pro has a problem with microlensing and the 294 has issues with calibration due to uneven cooling that is effected by the ambient temperature meaning that you can get residual background artifacts after calibration (it also has horrible amp glow).

Adam

Thanks re the 294 issues - luckily I'm quite away financially from pulling the trigger so will keep researching!  I'd prefer staying between 3.45-4.8 um pixel size for sampling purposes w my set-up.  The C1+12000A FOV seems decent enough vs the 294, although its full-well seems m-u-c-h lower (is that why you think it might be better as mono?).

Comparing a bit more to other ZWOs based on your warnings about the 294, the 071 (second hand only!) or even the 533 appear more interesting now vs the 294.  Ah well, must keep sleuthing (& saving!).  If only Moravian come out w more in the meantime

Cheers,

Vin

At least you saw some sunshine @Rusted - nothing but rain here for the last 12 hours!

Thanks for the head's up @Adam J.  V topical as I have my eyes out for a cooled OSC CMOS.  Currently ASI294MCPro is top of the wishlist.  The C1+ does look v interesting.  When I put in its details as a Custom Camera on astronomy.tools the FOV for even the largest C1+ seems much smaller than the 294MC or 1600MM though.  I'm a newbie to this level of cameras - is there a build quality difference between Moravian & ZWO that explains that (smaller FOV C1+ as expensive if not more than 294MCPro)?  Thank you, Vin

Oops sorry, I meant the North pin on an HEQ5 tripod.  From the drawings it looks like that would get in the way & the tripod needs to be completely flat & unobstructed around the 3/8 thread?  Anyway, I think the whole thing should be light enough for a photo tripod to handle comfortably - will find out in a few days I hope.  Cheers

Stunning.  If that filaprom could be done as a GIF! 

3 hours ago, Steve Clay said:

I use an Ed80, 2inch diagonal with quark and Ep's . The mount is sat with it's extension on an eq5 tripod. All up weight on the head is just a tadge over 5kg.

I found the center of gravity by suspending it with thin rope and marked the dovetail at that point.

I've had no issues at all. 

Finds easily and literally tracks all day.

Steve

Thanks Steve.

I've taken the leap and ordered it form FLO - apologies to everyone in advance for the next few days of cloud.

Am going to try it out on a camera tripod to start with - does the extension fit with a N-pin (it doesn't look like the SQ mount itself could accommodate a N-pin?)?

Cheers,

Vin

5 minutes ago, Davey-T said:

My LS60DS pressure tuned weighs 5.625 kilos with dust cap which is metal, plus a bit more for camera / eyepiece.

Works OK on the Solar Quest the only tricky bit is balance which needs to be about right otherwise it won't align with the Sun, just buzzes and doesn't move so I find the point of balance roughly before putting it on the mount then once up and running you can see if it's front or back heavy as it will slowly lose the Sun as it drifts up / down, then move the dovetail a smidgen until it tracks OK and mark the dovetail with an indelible marker, mine is very sensitive to balance with the overload so have to move it slightly when changing from ZWO ASI178 camera to heavier Leica zoom.

Dave

 

Thanks Dave - thats really helpful.  I only have a little Lunt 50 so that should be well within the weight, but am trying to see if (crazy idea) the SQ could also handle an old Vixen 102M for WL.  Weight wise that combination should come out around 4.1kg but the scope is so l-o-n-g that it will be interesting to see what happens!

Cheers again,

Vin

Hello,

I was wondering whether any Solar Quest owners had tested the upper load limit (for visual and/or imaging) please?  The specs say 4kg - does that have wiggle room above it or is it already v toppish?

[EDIT:] Asking in particular b/c I think a few folks use it with a Lunt 60 (maybe even double-stacked) based on images posted?  Lunt's website shows the Lunt 60 tilt tuned as weighing 20lbs (ie 9kg) - can the Solar Quest handle loads like that? I now realise that is the packed weight (doh!) and the actual scope is about 3kg - which I guess would rise a bit with a mono & a double-stack.  I'm trying to figure out whether a 4-5kg achromat for WL could be carried by the little SQ?  Thank you

Thank you,

Vin

Hello,

Hope this finds everyone safe & well.

I'm in the process of consolidating mounts - need to create space & also have a cooled OSC to shoot for

Just sold the belt-modded go-to Vixen GP2 (sniff sniff, but it seems to be going to a good home) as I have a beefier  HEQ5Pro as the main imaging mount (...for the time being, just out of curiosity what is the Vixen comparable step up from GP2 that would rival or beat the HEQ5Pro? 😜)

And so now need to (perhaps) make a choice on the alt-az side.  I was using an old WO EZTouch (the original version made by Beat Kohler from AOK - he apparently only made 300, its co-branded WO & AOK, and looks and works strangely v much like an Ayo II).  I've put a Baader EQ Clamp on the other side, so that it becomes a dual mountable alt-az mount (OK not as nice as Rowan AZ100 but it'll do for me!).

So far so good.  Then my father gave me his old Vixen SP mount.  Its solid & smooth.  I've put on some old Vixen brass dual-axis motors on both axes - they are so quiet its ridiculous, and have manual clutches so I can disengage them to use the manual control knobs if I want (although in practice using the motor control pad is far easier, more precise and doesn't involve touching the rig).  I've got it set in alt-az configuration, and it works a treat (I can of course always turn it back into EQ).

So now I'm wondering - if I were to consolidate alt-az mounts, which one to keep?

EZTouch: pros are its physically smaller & lighter, and can handle two scopes (although how often would I actually do that - only thing I can think of is solar Ha & WL).  Cons are no slow motion controls, so you have to move the scope by hand as you view a target; for objects at the zenith you can have to tighten the knobs even for a balanced scope due to unbalanced moment-forces (unless the balancing is done perfectly) & so there can be a slight backlash then (although in fairness this can be user-calibrated so it is v much user-choice).

SP in alt-az: pros are solid & stable, no need to touch the set and more precise movement possible, objects at the zenith are fine & stay dead-centred b/c the motor cogs (or manual control knobs) stop any slight over-shooting due to unbalanced moment-forces.  Cons are its bulkier, the counterweight arm sticks out (but equally can be used to help balance if I ever put heavier scope on); and no dual-scoping (although in fairness I could just mount a little Lunt 50 on top of the tube rings of the normal scope and the counterweighted arm would still maintain everything in shape).

Figured I'd ask the far more experienced SGLers: if you were only going to keep one, which one would it be?

Thank you & stay safe,

Vin