Confused about Saturn.

[coxie]

luke let me know if you manage to find a combination which works better for viewing saturn i had the same issue as you.

[LukeSkywatcher]

When trying to identify a cetrtain planets moons i firstly observe with a scope and then refer to Stellarium. Works fine for me with Jupiters moons so should be ok with Saturn.

NOW................regarding my very first post about the size of Saturn (equatorial diameter) as seen through my 130P Dob compared to how it looked 2 yrs ago in my 90EQ.

Early this morning i got another chance to observe Saturn in my 90EQ. It was much lower down then the first time (2 yrs ago) and much further west (1st time round it was high in the East)......................but no matter.

I am now happy (not sure i am really happy) but the equatorial diameter of the planet as seen in my 90EQ was about the same as i saw 24 hrs previous in my 130P Dob.

The setup (magnification) on my 90EQ was exactly the same as it was 2 yrs ago.

So i think i can safely say that when observing Saturn when it rings are open to any degree makes the planet appear much larger then it appears when its rings are edge on (or close to).

I could have sworn that the planet disc was about 3 times as big 2 yrs ago when i observed it with rings open to about 25%????

Also...........................maybe i have fanciful memories of my first observation of Saturn. YES it was FANTASTICALLY amazing..................but the more i think about it the more i cant help but remember that on the night i first observed it i posted a comment on the S@N forum saying "OMG........Saturn is TINY in my 3.5" scope but perfectly formed".

It really WAS one of a couple of WOW moments. Its ring system was open wide enough in Feb 2008 to knock a first time observers socks off.

[LukeSkywatcher]

luke let me know if you manage to find a combination which works better for viewing saturn i had the same issue as you.

I dont know if this is really the done thing but I TRIED IT.I have a cheapo Celestron EP kit 2X barlow and i have a slightly more expensive TAL 2X barlow that i bought from FLO a couple of weeks ago.

The TAL 2x runs rings around the Celestron 2X.

I read here a few months ago that you can stack barlow lens ontop of each other (2X+3X+EP=6X).

Just for fun i tried stacking both my 2X barlows plus any EP..............

It actually DOES work. 2X+2X=4X.

The image degrades as you magnify but to compensate that i found that using a lower power EP works pretty well............

So if you use a 15mm EP with a 2X barlow.................use a 32mm EP with two 2X barlows stacked.

If you use a 10mm EP with a 2X..........................use a 20mm EP with both barlows stacked.

This is fine if you actually own two Barlows.

4X barlow (2X2) is a bit too much for my scope. It could probably handle 3X...............but i thought that was too much so i only bought a 2X TAL.

I hope this makes sense.

[LukeSkywatcher]

I had another chance to observe Saturn early this morning (damn these early morning sessions are KILLING ME).

Under the same/equiv magnification in both the 90EQ and the 130P..........Saturn looks identical.

So i really honestly can only say that Saturn 2 yrs ago with its rings somewhat "open" played tricks on my mind and made it appear bigger then it was.

It knocked my socks off. I can remember my exact words when i saw it for the 1st time but can not repeat them here.

[mdstuart]

I saw Saturn last night in my 10 inch and with a 6mm ortho x200 it was small but very sharp. The disk did look small, like Mars but a tad bigger. The rings were pretty edge on still but I could make out the line of the rings accross the disk. There was little detail like banding etc but I think a filter may help on that front as the planet is almost too bright..

It is still a special sight. It just seems to hang there in the sky..

If you ramp up the power above x200 to x250 I suspect you can make the planet bigger but it will generally get fuzzier and so yield no more detail...

Mark

[LukeSkywatcher]

I saw Saturn last night in my 10 inch and with a 6mm ortho x200 it was small but very sharp. The disk did look small, like Mars but a tad bigger. The rings were pretty edge on still but I could make out the line of the rings accross the disk. There was little detail like banding etc but I think a filter may help on that front as the planet is almost too bright..

It is still a special sight. It just seems to hang there in the sky..

If you ramp up the power above x200 to x250 I suspect you can make the planet bigger but it will generally get fuzzier and so yield no more detail...

Mark

That is exactly the result i get get by stacking both my 2X barlows. ..........bigger image but **** all detail

.

[John]

...Edge on rings are excellent opportunities for seeing Saturn's fainter satellites, which get washed out by the glare from rthe ring system when it's well presented.

Good point - I managed to see 6 moons the other night with my 10" newtonian, the best I've managed to date

[coxie]

had anymore luck with this in the last few days luke?

[LukeSkywatcher]

I have not been out for a week now because i fell over and made a mess of my shoulder (bruised all muscles/tissue severely). I've only been able to use my arm since today really but will be out of action for a few more days.

I found that a yellow coloured filter helps views. It doesnt make the size any bigger (obviously) but it drags out a bit of detail such as the rings crossing front of surface.

[Steve1976]

My first sight of Saturn using the Mak 127 at x60 magnification looked like the 3rd very small picture you posted. When I used my 10mm (x150) it looked very slightly smaller than the 1st picture you posted (the one through a 3 inch scope). I'm buying new EP's to try and get more power but I also, while still pleased about seeing Saturn at all, was a little dissapointed with the size (also with mars). I just wonder what magnification was used in the first 2 images you posted. If I can get it like the second image I will be delighted!!!

[John]

My first sight of Saturn using the Mak 127 at x60 magnification looked like the 3rd very small picture you posted. When I used my 10mm (x150) it looked very slightly smaller than the 1st picture you posted (the one through a 3 inch scope). I'm buying new EP's to try and get more power but I also, while still pleased about seeing Saturn at all, was a little dissapointed with the size (also with mars). I just wonder what magnification was used in the first 2 images you posted. If I can get it like the second image I will be delighted!!!

It's difficult to do a direct comparison between images and what you see through the scope. I'd say the second image is similar to the view I get using 340x magnification and my 10" newtonian although the contrast differences of the features is a little higher in the image than can be seen visually.

[coxie]

i guess this is the beauty of astronomy, every night is different and its a challenge learning