AZ- GTI and The Infamous TalentCell battery pack

[vegaandarctures]

Hi all, I’m looking to hear from people who use this TalentCell battery to power their mounts, https://www.amazon.co.uk/TalentCell-Rechargeable-6000mAh-12000mAh-Lithium/dp/B0713T4XT9/ref=asc_df_B0713T4XT9/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=256464514719&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8883556746769517837&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006474&hvtargid=pla-421631113151&psc=1 more specifically anyone who uses it for the Sky-Watcher AZ-GTI.

I recently purchased the az-gti and upon reading another thread here, decided to get the TalentCell battery to power it. It seems quite a lot of people use it to power their az-gti mounts. 
 

So when I first plugged the mount into the battery, it seemed to work fine, Wi-Fi was working and I connected to the app, and it would move when I told it to. It was carrying my ED80 with ease and it was upon the 1.25” stainless steel tripod.

However problems started when I took it outside to try it out. First of all, the GoTo accuracy was dreadful, I tried every form of alignment possible but still it was always just outside the FOV. Also it just wouldn’t track, even when I told it what it was looking at and pressed point and track it still wouldn’t track properly. It was making a noise so it sounded like it was trying to track but the object was always slowly drifting up the FOV and out of site.

I gave up that first night eventually as hours had passed and I wasn’t getting anywhere. The 2nd night was exactly the same. However this time whilst slewing the mount unexpectedly died. I tried to power it up again with a 12V DC wall socket that I had lying around but nothing happened. Something in it had just given out.

So I emailed FLO and explained the situation. They kindly took it back and refunded me. They also told me that the TalentCell battery was likely providing insufficient power for the mount, and that the cable I was using (just a standard one from Amazon that another SGL user linked in another thread) was also not gonna cut it.

So I’m just wondering is the TalentCell battery enough to power this mount? Others on here seem to think so but FLO disagree. Or was my mount just a dud? Reason I ask is because apart from it not working, the mount was perfect for my needs and I’d love to get another one that works properly.

Apologies for this absolute mammoth of a post but I wanted to provide the whole story.

Any thoughts and advice would be much appreciated.

TIA

Thomas

[Elp]

It could be a dud battery but by the sounds of the mount performance and it not powering up again could also be a dud mount. The issue with batteries like these they're not really performance tested for providing a solid 12v out, usually for this sort of activity the voltage has to be stable, any drop and the mount will fail to respond.

I do however have this one:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/TalentCell-Rechargeable-11000mAh-20000mAh-Portable/dp/B06Y5G3C8Z/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=2C04UBWZ3ZF8C&keywords=talentcell&qid=1699189484&sprefix=talentcell%2Caps%2C200&sr=8-1

And it performs better than my "12v sustained" Celestron Lithium LTs. My ioptron mounts are quite picky as to the incoming 12v, this talentcell powers the whole AP rig fine. With my azgti AP rig it consistently provides 3-4 hours of power even on cold nights.

You mention target not being in the FOV, what power eyepiece were you using at the time? Alignment can also be a case where the original needs to be deleted and you start again making sure on each alignment the target star is dead centre, can be judged better if you defocus the star so it's a doughnut shape so it's larger and easier to see when centered in the eyepiece.

Shame about your experience with the azgti, it's great when it performs.

 

[AstroNebulee]

2 hours ago, vegaandarctures said:

Hi all, I’m looking to hear from people who use this TalentCell battery to power their mounts, https://www.amazon.co.uk/TalentCell-Rechargeable-6000mAh-12000mAh-Lithium/dp/B0713T4XT9/ref=asc_df_B0713T4XT9/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=256464514719&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8883556746769517837&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006474&hvtargid=pla-421631113151&psc=1 more specifically anyone who uses it for the Sky-Watcher AZ-GTI.

I recently purchased the az-gti and upon reading another thread here, decided to get the TalentCell battery to power it. It seems quite a lot of people use it to power their az-gti mounts. 
 

So when I first plugged the mount into the battery, it seemed to work fine, Wi-Fi was working and I connected to the app, and it would move when I told it to. It was carrying my ED80 with ease and it was upon the 1.25” stainless steel tripod.

However problems started when I took it outside to try it out. First of all, the GoTo accuracy was dreadful, I tried every form of alignment possible but still it was always just outside the FOV. Also it just wouldn’t track, even when I told it what it was looking at and pressed point and track it still wouldn’t track properly. It was making a noise so it sounded like it was trying to track but the object was always slowly drifting up the FOV and out of site.

I gave up that first night eventually as hours had passed and I wasn’t getting anywhere. The 2nd night was exactly the same. However this time whilst slewing the mount unexpectedly died. I tried to power it up again with a 12V DC wall socket that I had lying around but nothing happened. Something in it had just given out.

So I emailed FLO and explained the situation. They kindly took it back and refunded me. They also told me that the TalentCell battery was likely providing insufficient power for the mount, and that the cable I was using (just a standard one from Amazon that another SGL user linked in another thread) was also not gonna cut it.

So I’m just wondering is the TalentCell battery enough to power this mount? Others on here seem to think so but FLO disagree. Or was my mount just a dud? Reason I ask is because apart from it not working, the mount was perfect for my needs and I’d love to get another one that works properly.

Apologies for this absolute mammoth of a post but I wanted to provide the whole story.

Any thoughts and advice would be much appreciated.

TIA

Thomas

Hi Thomas. 

It does sound like a bit of a dud mount if the 12v d socket didn't work. I've used this 12v 3A talentcell battery pack and had it for 2. 5 years now and still performs brilliantly for my alt az visual, lunar and planetary imaging sessions. I do use the lynx astro cable and it it's perfect. 

It could be both a dud mount and battery pack. 

Cheers 

Lee

[Celerondon]

This problem may not have been caused by your battery pack.  For months I used one that was similar to Elp’s battery with no ill affects other than a surprisingly low average voltage output.  I do have one suggestion about choosing TalentCell battery packs for our astronomical applications.  Stick with the LiFePO4 models that (always) have 4S internal construction.  Here is why I think that this is best.  Batteries that use LiFePO4 cells in a 4S array inherently provide a stable flat voltage that remains constant until they fall below 20% of capacity and above 12 volts until they are almost empty!  I prefer the LiFePO4 chemistry because their steady voltage output persists without the need for voltage regulation.  Despite their similar impressive capacity numbers, unregulated Lithium-ion batteries have less desirable voltage curves.  In fact, unless they are regulated, the voltage output of regular Lithium-ion battery packs will drop below 12 volts almost immediately once a load is supplied!  Now I use a LiFePO4 battery and monitor my output voltage with a power meter.  
 

There is a chance that your problem was caused by your power cable, your connections, or some other issue. Exactly which cable do you use, and how is it connected?  
 

Don 
 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Celerondon

[vegaandarctures]

47 minutes ago, Celerondon said:

There is a chance that your problem was caused by your power cable, your connections, or some other issue. Exactly which cable do you use, and how is it connected?  
 

Don 
 

 

Thanks all for the replies so far! Much appreciated. This is the cable I was using: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Extension-Security-Standalone-Surveillance-Adapter-Black/dp/B09BQ81DSS

Perhaps this cable isn’t good enough. I do want to make sure I have a good power supply for when I buy another mount. I’m wondering if maybe the mount was damaged from the power supply issue? Maybe I somehow burned the motor out. I don’t want to damage another mount if that is the case.

It does say on the mount specs that it takes between 7.5 - 14v to power to power the mount. So if it does drop a bit below 12v surely to that shouldn’t be a problem? I don’t really know much about electricity to be honest.

[rnobleeddy]

I wouldn't rule out the battery, but I never had any issues with that combination.

[vegaandarctures]

1 minute ago, rnobleeddy said:

I wouldn't rule out the battery, but I never had any issues with that combination.

The battery works fine for a bunch of other things I plugged into it. Charged my Bluetooth headphones fine. I think it probably was the mount. Although FLO thought otherwise.

[Celerondon]

On 05/11/2023 at 07:17, vegaandarctures said:

The battery works fine for a bunch of other things I plugged into it. Charged my Bluetooth headphones fine. I think it probably was the mount. Although FLO thought otherwise.

I agree!  It seems like everyone is guessing, including FLO.  Let’s stop guessing and start collecting data.  
 

If you had a meter, a male cable, and a female cable, then you would know exactly how much voltage that your Talentcell battery supplies under load and also how much amperage your equipment uses when tracking, slewing, or idling.  I think that your cable and that Talentcell battery are both fine but I can’t prove it.  That plug-and-play meter setup that I just linked for you could enable you to prove something by Thursday or Friday, at the latest. 
 

Don

[PhilB61]

It could also be voltage drop from the power cord. I had a very similar cable, also sold as suitable for dvr cameras etc, which I wanted to use for my CEM25P mount but it constantly showed a low battery warning when slewing, changed to a heavier gauge cable and issue was resolved. I actually tried using the cable for another application and cut the connector off to fit another type and was surprised how thin the inner core was, so not surprised it couldn't deliver enough current. 

[Celerondon]

Right PhilB61!  Checking the voltage under load could reveal a voltage drop. 

Those Lynx Astro cables are supposed to be pretty good.  I haven't used them but like many others, the manufacturer doesn't specify the internal wire gauge.  

 

Don

[Celerondon]

On 05/11/2023 at 07:03, vegaandarctures said:

Thanks all for the replies so far! Much appreciated. This is the cable I was using: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Extension-Security-Standalone-Surveillance-Adapter-Black/dp/B09BQ81DSS

Perhaps this cable isn’t good enough. I do want to make sure I have a good power supply for when I buy another mount. I’m wondering if maybe the mount was damaged from the power supply issue? Maybe I somehow burned the motor out. I don’t want to damage another mount if that is the case.

It does say on the mount specs that it takes between 7.5 - 14v to power to power the mount. So if it does drop a bit below 12v surely to that shouldn’t be a problem? I don’t really know much about electricity to be honest.

This is entirely correct!  You know more about electricity than you think.  Most consumer electronics, especially 12 volt devices, will operate properly across a defined range of voltages.  A safe range for our equipment should be from 11 volts to 14 volts.   (AZ-GTI = 8-14 volts and ASIAIR Plus = 11-15 volts)
 

When I noticed that my regular Li-ion TalentCell battery was dipping below 12 volts it bothered me but it never affected my mount, ASIAIR, or cameras.  When we refer to a “Voltage Drop” as an electrical problem it sounds similar but it is actually quite different.  The electrical fault known as a voltage drop is caused by excessive resistance in a circuit.  This type of problem is detectable when the electrical circuit is closed and under load. 

Don

Edited November 10, 2023 by Celerondon