DSLR Options.

[Enceladus Dan]

Hello All, 

I already have a canon eos M3 which I’m using to learn the ropes with my 150pds. I was looking at the modified DSLR route and was hoping to get a 760D because it’s similar in specs to the M3 and send it for modification. I came across quite a few posts with people saying about banding on the 760D. From what I can tell it’s the Hybrid AF III sensor causing the issue. 
 

ive seen some beautiful Astro pics on astrobin so it isn’t impossible, also the M3 has the same Hybrid AF III sensor and I haven’t seen any banding in my pictures so far. This could be due to only achieving 1 min subs so far and maybe longer ones will bring out the banding. When the good old British weather clears I plan to take 2,3,4 & 5 min subs, knowing it will trail just to see if any bands appear. 

does anyone know if banding will always show or is it certain situations that make them happen? I don’t want to go for the 760D to find out I need to learn more processing to get round them as I’m just working out the basics with processing.
 

On the other hand I can go for the 600D which is cheaper and has a good reputation for astrophotography. But I don’t want to miss out on going newer with lower read noise and digic 6 etc if banding can be avoided on the 760D. 
 

hopefully soon I’ll have some (blurry) long exposures on my M3 just to see if the length of time make any bands appear. 
 

thanks in advance for any tips or personal experience with the 760D. 
 

Danny

[alacant]

1 hour ago, DannyST said:

I don’t want to go for the 760D 

Hi

Banding. Hands on with a selection of 24mp eos': some do, some don't.

If you want to be certain, all the 18mp sensors we've tried are clean. 600d, 700d, 4000d etc.

HTH

[Enceladus Dan]

Thanks, I’ll push my M3 and see if it happens but I might have to play safe with a 600D. 
 

thanks

Danny

[Clarkey]

13 hours ago, alacant said:

If you want to be certain, all the 18mp sensors we've tried are clean. 600d, 700d, 4000d etc

I have a 600D which does give some banding. I can just about remove it in processing but it is a pain. Most 600D's seem pretty good though - I think mine just has an attitude problem😂

[michael8554]

My 600D banded too, but only on hot summer nights.

Michael

[Enceladus Dan]

This is a minefield by the sounds of it, never know if the camera I get will have it or not.

From what I read it sounded like the cause was the hybrid sensor but canon website says that started with the 650D. 

I was skeptical as my M3 has the hybrid cos af iii sensor and I've seen no banding. Last night I aimed it to a dark corner with the lights off when I was at work. I did  five exposures at each of 3,4,5 mins with different iso,s none had any banding. 

I'm hoping to get clear skies this week so will try and get longer subs on andromeda or pleiades. My best so far is 45 seconds so need to nail my alignment. 

Thanks for the updates on 600d.

Danny

[Enceladus Dan]

Hello again, 

so I had a night of clear skies, while waiting for 1am (when the street lights at the bottom of the garden go out) I thought I would try to make these mysterious bands appear. I’ve included pictures from forums talking of this issue. The top one is from when I was looking to see if the 760D is good for astrophotography and they were calling it banding. The conclusion is it’s the hybrid AF sensor causing the issue. Now this shows how little I know about photography I assumed it was some sort of sensor lines in front of the cmos sensor blocking some of the light. The bottom picture is from another forum I found which explained a little more and its 7 rows of pixels used to check AF.

 

this is different to the typical banding I see people talk about on here which is corrected in post processing, I’m not to great at the processing yet and don’t like the thought of trying to remove these lines. 
 

So back to me trying to recreate these lines on my Canon M3, I took 1,2,3,4 & 5 min exposures thinking it could be the long exposure or sensor temperature. I played with different ISO settings and finally taking pictures in and out of focus. But I couldn’t get these lines to appear. But nothing. The following day to thought more about it and will next try taking an exposure with the continuous AF setting on as I keep all AF, NR, and stability settings off, but I wonder if this is what the cause is. If it’s on the camera is trying to use these rows to check the AF for the whole exposure? 
 

 

Although I had not found out the cause of these bands I have realised something else, I have only been doing 30-45 second exposures because I thought my polar alignment was bad, but from 1 min to 5 mins the trailing is not that much worse, also the 5 min exposure trails in two directions as if the camera had shook. Last time I photographed Andromeda I took 45 seconds and quiet a lot of exposure were not used because of trails I put this down to me walking on the grass near the telescope while it’s was taking photos. This time I used the patio and stood back on the grass to remove any shake caused by me. 
 

so I looked into camera shake and have learned a lot about the shutters, I never know so much went on inside a camera. I pictured it to be like the iris in a lens quickly opening and closing. I was especially shocked that there was more movements in a mirrorless camera than a DSLR, the mirrorless shutter is open by default then closes, exposure starts, Shutter opens, exposure ends the shutter closes and then opens again ready to repeat over and over. I believe my trails and from the quick closure and opening of the shutter just as the exposure starts, Some newer models can hold open the shutter and only close as it ends. 
 

So now my trail of thought over the choice of camera is much wider, I think for simplicity I’ll go for the 600d get it modified and carry on my learning journey, the 760D is still unclear if i get one will have those lines or not. My other thought was to go for a slightly rough round the edges but good working order 6D with low shutter count for the same price as a an excellent condition 760D. Going full frame will also widen my FOV as andromeda and Great Orion fill my crop sensor. 

Thanks

Danny

Edited October 9, 2021 by DannyST

[Alien 13]

On 04/10/2021 at 16:15, DannyST said:

This is a minefield by the sounds of it, never know if the camera I get will have it or not.

From what I read it sounded like the cause was the hybrid sensor but canon website says that started with the 650D. 

I was skeptical as my M3 has the hybrid cos af iii sensor and I've seen no banding. Last night I aimed it to a dark corner with the lights off when I was at work. I did  five exposures at each of 3,4,5 mins with different iso,s none had any banding. 

I'm hoping to get clear skies this week so will try and get longer subs on andromeda or pleiades. My best so far is 45 seconds so need to nail my alignment. 

Thanks for the updates on 600d.

Danny

I had the 650D which indeed had the hybrid sensor and did have banding under certain conditions, as all the following series were similar I moved to the 80D which has dual pixel AF instead as does the 60/70D models.

Alan

[Enceladus Dan]

14 minutes ago, Alien 13 said:

I had the 650D which indeed had the hybrid sensor and did have banding under certain conditions, as all the following series were similar I moved to the 80D which has dual pixel AF instead as does the 60/70D models.

Alan

Thank you Alan,

good to know it’s not an issue with the dual pixel AF models, I might look into cameras with this sensor like the 60/70/80D you mention.