Minimum Aperture for DSO's in light polluted city ?

[wesdon1]

Hi all. Just wondering, does anyone have enough experience to tell me what the minimum aperture is to atleast see "Faint Fuzzy" when using your telescope in a urban city light polluted environment? I have managed to make out M42 Orion Neb with my 130mm/900mm Newtonian Reflector, and basically saw grey fuzzy patch around dim stars? I now own a 200mm/1200mm Newtonian Reflector as well and i haven't yet used it due to no mount for it yet ( This is being remedied this week! lol )  but was wondering will i be able to see any Galaxies, Neb or DSO's in general? I can't wait to see M42 Orion Neb through it though cos i got very satisfying views of it with my 130mm/900mm so i'm cautiously optimistic that i'll get a substantially better view through the 200mm/1200mm? Obviously M42 won't be back until winter, as far as i'm aware? But i can't wait to see it through new bigger 'scope! Any comments/advice etc would be greatly appreciated! Thank you all ! 

Open Skies to all...

 

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, wesdon1 said:

will i be able to see any Galaxies, Neb or DSO's in general?

Congrats for seeing M42, and the fact that you could means you should be able to see a few DSO from your site. Pick the brightest ones when they are high up- M31, M13,M81/M82 all come to mind with the VG 200mm reflector.

To see the ones listed I would try upping the mag a fair bit- what eyepieces do you own?filters?

[Trikeflyer]

With my 8 inch f6 reflector I have seen galaxies M31, M81/82 from my back garden in suburban light polluted skies. Have tried others and failed miserably (which are easy from dark sky) but not urban skies eg M51 and a host of others. 

I find Globular clusters are probably the nicest objects in this scope in urban skies M13, M92, M2,3,5 and a host of others. 

Other objects you will get are some other nebulae eg M57 ring nebula, M27 Dumbell, possibly M17 swan nebula - one of my favourites. M42 of course will look amazing. I have managed the faintest hint of M1 Crab Nebula from my suburban skies but it was only just visible with averted vision. 

Open clusters will pop in this scope so they are worth looking at, M 11 one of my favourites will look stunning as well as some of the other fainter messiers eg M52, M 56, M72, M103 to name but a few.

Enjoy the scope and if ever you can get it to dark sky your mind will be blown.

Let us know how you get on and what you manage to find.

clear skies

Steve 

 

 

[Mr niall]

I was at a reasonably dark sky over the weekend (bortle 4) and easily - easily - picked out M13 and M27 in my 60/700 refractor.

In light polluted area's globular clusters are probably the easiest to pick out, followed closely by open clusters, then planetary nebula. Galaxies are the most challenging but you should still be able to see M31 / M81 / M82 without too much difficulty.

Lots of fun stuff to be seen with your scope don't worry!

Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr niall

[wesdon1]

On 28/08/2019 at 15:33, jetstream said:

Congrats for seeing M42, and the fact that you could means you should be able to see a few DSO from your site. Pick the brightest ones when they are high up- M31, M13,M81/M82 all come to mind with the VG 200mm reflector.

To see the ones listed I would try upping the mag a fair bit- what eyepieces do you own?filters?

Thanks for great reply/advice! I own plossl eyepices in following sizes-10mm, 20mm, 25mm, 32mm and a 3.6mm. 2 x Barlow. 5 x Barlow. SW Light Pollution Filter. Moon Filter/Green. Thanks again sir!

[jetstream]

52 minutes ago, wesdon1 said:

Thanks for great reply/advice! I own plossl eyepices in following sizes-10mm, 20mm, 25mm, 32mm and a 3.6mm. 2 x Barlow. 5 x Barlow. SW Light Pollution Filter. Moon Filter/Green. Thanks again sir!

You're most welcome.

Excellent selection of eyepieces and they will serve you well. A good addition to view planetary nebula such as M27 and M57 will be a tight OIII, such as the new Astronomik version. The tight OIII's will greatly enhance your views of M42 and planetary's M27/M57 and espc from your skies.

On M42 with OIII your 32mm is a superb combo IMHO

and M27/M57 will be great in the 10mm and 5mm (barlow) with the OIII. These ones will take much more mag (planetary's) than nebula like M42.

On M81/M82 try the 10mm after finding them

Great hunting to you!

[wesdon1]

16 hours ago, jetstream said:

You're most welcome.

Excellent selection of eyepieces and they will serve you well. A good addition to view planetary nebula such as M27 and M57 will be a tight OIII, such as the new Astronomik version. The tight OIII's will greatly enhance your views of M42 and planetary's M27/M57 and espc from your skies.

On M42 with OIII your 32mm is a superb combo IMHO

and M27/M57 will be great in the 10mm and 5mm (barlow) with the OIII. These ones will take much more mag (planetary's) than nebula like M42.

On M81/M82 try the 10mm after finding them

Great hunting to you!

Thank you so much for the excellent advice sir! I never realised an OIII Filter would be any good for visual astronomy so that's definately something i'll buy! I just thought they only served Astrophotography so there's more exciting possibilities for visual! I'll heed your advice on the "M" objects and stick to the brighter types. I haven't purchased a GoTo yet because i'm only 10 months and 3 'scopes in and i want to learn my craft first and hunting is much more interesting than simply pressing a button and having my targets handed to me on a proverbial plate! lol. That's not to say in the future i won't utilise such fabulous technology. I will let you know how i get on in coming weeks and months sir! Thank you so much! 

[wesdon1]

On 28/08/2019 at 16:59, Trikeflyer said:

With my 8 inch f6 reflector I have seen galaxies M31, M81/82 from my back garden in suburban light polluted skies. Have tried others and failed miserably (which are easy from dark sky) but not urban skies eg M51 and a host of others. 

I find Globular clusters are probably the nicest objects in this scope in urban skies M13, M92, M2,3,5 and a host of others. 

Other objects you will get are some other nebulae eg M57 ring nebula, M27 Dumbell, possibly M17 swan nebula - one of my favourites. M42 of course will look amazing. I have managed the faintest hint of M1 Crab Nebula from my suburban skies but it was only just visible with averted vision. 

Open clusters will pop in this scope so they are worth looking at, M 11 one of my favourites will look stunning as well as some of the other fainter messiers eg M52, M 56, M72, M103 to name but a few.

Enjoy the scope and if ever you can get it to dark sky your mind will be blown.

Let us know how you get on and what you manage to find.

clear skies

Steve 

 

 

Thank you so much for your advice sir! I've seen the Plaeides ( Open? ) Star Cluster and that was amazing! So many stars close together! M42 was faint grey fuzzy with my 130mm/5.1 inch reflector and still beautiful! So with the 200mm aperture i hope to see more detail! I will let you know how i get on! Thank you again so much sir! 

Wes

[alacant]

On 28/08/2019 at 12:19, wesdon1 said:

won't be back until winter

Hi

Early morning/late night from around 5am if you want to catch it now.

Cheers

[wesdon1]

6 minutes ago, alacant said:

Hi

Early morning/late night from around 5am if you want to catch it now.

Cheers

Hi

 

Oh right? I didn't even think i would have a chance to see it again until longer nights? Thanks so much for the advice/tip! 

Cheers, Wes.

[Trikeflyer]

9 hours ago, wesdon1 said:

Thank you so much for your advice sir! I've seen the Plaeides ( Open? ) Star Cluster and that was amazing! So many stars close together! M42 was faint grey fuzzy with my 130mm/5.1 inch reflector and still beautiful! So with the 200mm aperture i hope to see more detail! I will let you know how i get on! Thank you again so much sir! 

Wes

There are so many open clusters to view. So many, the list is endless really. All will look great in an 8 inch scope. If you don’t have sky safari or other suitable app, then it’s worth getting this. Also a telrad or alternative rdf is a must in my opinion as this will help you get into the right area of the sky before using a traditional finder, thereby saving you hours of endless time searching for stuff. You will find your own way of finding stuff but a good electronic app and a red dot finder are worth the investment. Also worth signing up to the binocular sky newsletter by Stephen Tonkin (see binocular observing section on this site) as although it’s designed for bins, many of the targets look great in a scope at relatively low mag and it might give your observing some structure.  I use GOTO a lot as I can quickly get frustrated with looking for stuff in light polluted skies when it’s difficult to see the stars that allow you to hop to them. Using GOTO means that Also I can be pretty sure that the target in the eyepiece is the thing I’m looking at as opposed to any open cluster in the general area that I think is the one I’m aiming for (that may not be important when the targets are distinctive eg NGC 457 the owl cluster - it’s obvious that you have the right target in this case as it can be easily identified. The trouble for me is that many open clusters can be easily mistaken for others when they are less distinctive. Not everyone will agree with that opinion and neither should they, it’s just my view. Don’t worry about GOTO for now though, it will either be relevant to you when you are ready, or it may never become a tool you feel is valuable. Either way, rdf and electronic star map are very very handy bits of kit in the observing armoury so to speak. 

Can’t wait to hear how you get on.

Steve 

[wesdon1]

16 hours ago, Trikeflyer said:

There are so many open clusters to view. So many, the list is endless really. All will look great in an 8 inch scope. If you don’t have sky safari or other suitable app, then it’s worth getting this. Also a telrad or alternative rdf is a must in my opinion as this will help you get into the right area of the sky before using a traditional finder, thereby saving you hours of endless time searching for stuff. You will find your own way of finding stuff but a good electronic app and a red dot finder are worth the investment. Also worth signing up to the binocular sky newsletter by Stephen Tonkin (see binocular observing section on this site) as although it’s designed for bins, many of the targets look great in a scope at relatively low mag and it might give your observing some structure.  I use GOTO a lot as I can quickly get frustrated with looking for stuff in light polluted skies when it’s difficult to see the stars that allow you to hop to them. Using GOTO means that Also I can be pretty sure that the target in the eyepiece is the thing I’m looking at as opposed to any open cluster in the general area that I think is the one I’m aiming for (that may not be important when the targets are distinctive eg NGC 457 the owl cluster - it’s obvious that you have the right target in this case as it can be easily identified. The trouble for me is that many open clusters can be easily mistaken for others when they are less distinctive. Not everyone will agree with that opinion and neither should they, it’s just my view. Don’t worry about GOTO for now though, it will either be relevant to you when you are ready, or it may never become a tool you feel is valuable. Either way, rdf and electronic star map are very very handy bits of kit in the observing armoury so to speak. 

Can’t wait to hear how you get on.

Steve 

Hi again Steve. Again thank you for such awesome advice sir! I did recently download Stellarium, and that has given me some great pointers for which general direction to look for interesting objects. It's a fascinating app, even telling me where satellites and meteor showers are. I have a Red Dot Finder ( Is that the RDF you mention? ) and this saves me so much hassle as i initially never used to use it, not knowing how to or it's importance, and would be driven desperate trying to find something that was right up there staring back at me but for the life of me i couldn't get it in the 'scopes field of view! haha I do believe i will eventually buy GoTo as it looks amazing plus i believe it can be linked directly to my Stellarium Programme and you can literally pick an object on the screen and it will command your 'scope to slew directly to said object? If this is true, that would be amazing! I will definitely look up the Binocular newsletter as it's another great way to receive relevant up to date info on current objects available to find and view. As for phone apps, i have one called "Star Walk 2" which i use to identify constellations. I find though that it sometimes says a constellation that i know well, is much farther to the left or right than where i can actually see it? I'm guessing this is due to my phones positioning being out in some way? I can't recall if i mentioned, but i'm 10 months and 3 'scopes in, and have so much to learn, so the expertise advice from people such as yourself is invaluable and is infinitely appreciated, so thank you again Steve! 

Wes