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forget string theory...here's rope theory

EA2007

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ChrisEdu

ChrisEdu

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I think some people are focusing too much on the 'elasticity' of the rope...........forget the stretch (its a theoretical solid rope, with no stretch in it).............its solid; hence doesn't warp right!!

So, it's now a rod! :D

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ChrisEdu

ChrisEdu

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Thinking about the issue of whether something can be instantaneous, if nothing can be, surely it would mean that the speed of light must vary? Otherwise, photons would have to be travelling instantly at the speed of light, ergo it's instantaneous!

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EA2007

EA2007

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the speed of light does vary....depending on its medium.......in space (vacuum) its set at 186,000 miles per sec, a team in america slowed it in a lab down to 30 miles an hour and Cherenkov radiation is faster than light in a vacuum....apparently

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ChrisEdu

ChrisEdu

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the speed of light does vary....depending on its medium.......in space (vacuum) its set at 186,000 miles per sec, a team in america slowed it in a lab down to 30 miles an hour and Cherenkov radiation is faster than light in a vacuum....apparently

Yes, I know it varies depending upon the medium. So, I guess that might be the arguement used to say it isn't instantaneous; that when coming from whatever gives the photo its release, it travels more slowly than once released?!

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themos

themos

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"Cherenkov radiation is faster than light in a vacuum....apparently"

Cherenkov radiation is what you get when a charged particle travels in a medium at a speed that is greater than the light speed in THAT medium. But it's still less that the speed of light in vacuum.

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Sam

Sam

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So you move the door with your rod, how can you tell if it moved instantaneously? You can't look at it, or use a radio transmitter or even see the light come through the open door.

I suspect you'd need two rods tied to the door, move one and watch the other one.

Kaptain klevtsov

Good point KK, it would be a hard experiment to measure.

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acey

acey

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OK, in theory, you're absolutely right: if, in theory, you could have a perfectly rigid rod/rope/body then, in theory, you could have instantaneous transfer of energy/information - and it wouldn't matter about seeing what's going on at the other end because you'd feel it instantaneously in your theoretically perfect rod/rope/body.

In practice you can't do it.

And in one particular theory (relativity) you can't either.

Apart from that you're absolutely right.

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Theinvoker

Theinvoker

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If it was 10 light years away it would take 10 years to get there, and 20 light years for us to see it assuming no intervening matter. ANY information in this context no matter if it is pushing a door or temperature cannot travel faster than the speed of light in a vacuum. I can see where people get the idea and 6 or 7 years ago I would have probably thought the same, but alot in physics isn't intuatative.

As for the speed of light must of occured instantaniously arguement, you are confusing its maximum speed with its actual speed. The speed a photon is travelling is not the limiting speed for a medium as was discussed. It is the actual speed of 186,000 miles per sec ish that is the limit. Therefore they could happily start at one speed then gain the apporiate energy to accelerate to the maximum.

Im not saying I wouldn't accept in some way it maybe possible, however you would need to find a flaw or something that needs reassessing in current physics. It may even be possible on the quantum level but nothing on the scale of a rope or rod over light years.

And in one particular theory (relativity) you can't either.

Apart from that you're absolutely right.

lol I think we are on the same wavelength. If you ignore relativity it would work I agree, Albert who? :D

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Theinvoker

Theinvoker

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OK guys, just tried this out for real. Big problem though, I couldn't shift the rod as it was too heavy. Who'd have thought that a zillion mile long rod thick enough to have a suitable slenderness ratio to not buckle would weigh so much!

Kaptain Klevtsov (I didn't really really do it!)

We can tell, as assuming the other planet is the same size as our, its weight on Earth would be 0 as the gravity of the other planet would pull it upwards as much as much as the Earth is pulling it downwards.

That and where can you find a shop open who will supply that much imaginary material at this time? :D

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Catanonia

Catanonia

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yup u are forgetting Einstien or namely number 1 that you pull the rope happens instantly.

Yes in short periods it does to your eyes, and hence your mistake.

No1 is false and hence the rest of theory is. Nice attempt thou :headbang:

Like it :)

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