Intro to CMOS vs CCD

[SteveA]

My interest in acquiring a CMOS camera remains high and tbh most of the comments here have convinced me that its probably the way forward, at least in my case. There do seem a few drawbacks, but these don't really put me off and I think its likely to be the technology of the future. If Sony are dropping development of CCD's how long before other manufactures follow the same course and maybe spelling the ultimate demise of the CCD?  I have to say I'm mainly attracted because of the price, allowing me to get a big sensor for what seems like a fairly reasonable price tag, I think its definitely worth a go.

Steve

 

[gorann]

Kodak stopped developing and making CCD chips years ago and if Sony does the same the future obviously lies in CMOS since further development will make them surpass CCD in all respects. However, right now, it is mainly a price issue as Steve says, and if you want a big mono chip with big wells then there is only CCD. I, like many others, are probably just waiting for the first large (at least APS-C) mono chip.

So, please Sony (or another manufacturer) why can you not produce a line where you skip putting on the Bayer mask? Yes, I know, there is just not enough of us but would it not be relatively easy to do? And we would love you forever.

[SteveA]

50 minutes ago, gorann said:

Kodak stopped developing and making CCD chips years ago and if Sony does the same the future obviously lies in CMOS since further development will make them surpass CCD in all respects. However, right now, it is mainly a price issue as Steve says, and if you want a big mono chip with big wells then there is only CCD. I, like many others, are probably just waiting for the first large (at least APS-C) mono chip.

So, please Sony (or another manufacturer) why can you not produce a line where you skip putting on the Bayer mask? Yes, I know, there is just not enough of us but would it not be relatively easy to do? And we would love you forever.

Hi Goran,

Excuse my ignorance here...what is an APS-C chip?  I just Googled it but I'm still not sure, is it CCD or CMOS...or is APS-C something entirely different?

Steve

[Knight of Clear Skies]

6 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Excuse my ignorance here...what is an APS-C chip?  I just Googled it but I'm still not sure, is it CCD or CMOS...or is APS-C something entirely different?

It's a standard sensor size, here's a handy guide.

The sensor size and the focal length dictate the field of view, provided the image circle of a particular scope is large enough to cover the sensor. Here's a field of view calculator.

The 1600MM Cool is a 4/3rds sensor, so a bit smaller than a crop-sensor DSLR.

[SteveA]

Ah...okay..so these are at the heart of the expensive DSLRs....but I guess these are also CMOS chips right? So really we are just talking about the size?

Steve

[Gina]

Yes.  Just the size.

[gorann]

14 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Ah...okay..so these are at the heart of the expensive DSLRs....but I guess these are also CMOS chips right? So really we are just talking about the size?

Steve

Yes, all chips in DSLRs are CMOS, and the APS-C chips are those in the normal consumer range of DSLRs. Most professional DSLRs have full frame chips (like the Canon 5D and 6D). However, most of us would not have much use of such big chips as we do not have the expensive scopes that can light up such a large chip without considerable loss of light in the corners (vignetting). So an APS-C would be fine with me (that is what I have in my Cannon 60Da) and if I could match that with a cooled mono CMOS to collect luminosity and narrow band data I would be very happy!

[wimvb]

2 hours ago, gorann said:

...

So an APS-C would be fine with me (that is what I have in my Cannon 60Da) and if I could match that with a cooled mono CMOS to collect luminosity and narrow band data I would be very happy!

Have a look at this thread from the qhy user forum

http://qhyccd.com/bbs/index.php?topic=6052.0

[gorann]

3 hours ago, wimvb said:

Have a look at this thread from the qhy user forum

http://qhyccd.com/bbs/index.php?topic=6052.0

So, QHY promise that a monochrome full frame size sensor is coming next year! Glad I have been waiting.

[wimvb]

QHY may not have much of a say in this. If Sony, Panasonic, etc decide not to produce mono cmos of that size, then QHY may have to hack a colour sensor...

The main market in mono cmos seems to be for security cameras, and these don't need to be aps-c size.

[Adam J]

They have been mucking about with removing the filter matrix on the 168c but I am not so sure that is a great idea from testing I did on sensitivity about a year back, you dont really gain much if anything due to the removal of the micro lenses.

[wimvb]

The trick is to remove the bayer pattern but leave the microlenses. Which in practice means removing both and making new lenses. This is a process that can only be done in a fab.

If the market for mono is large enough, camera manufacturers can request mono chips to be produced. My guess is that it just isn't.