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Good ccd??

Skooby

By Skooby
in Getting Started With Imaging

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Skooby

Skooby

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Hi guys I'm looking at buying a ccd camera what's a good ccd to get? I've been told that the atik 314l is a cracker but it's also quite expensive. Any ideas or shall I just hold out for this camera? Thanks.

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swag72

swag72

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Also, you need to know whether you want a mono or a One Shot colour.

As Steve says there are more considerations than just the camera. Have you looked at a field of view calculator to see how the 314L+ chip will fit with your scope? Is the field of view going to be big enough? Take a look here http://www.12dstring.me.uk/fovcalc.php and really put all possible combos and what you like to take images of through the calculator.

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lensman57

lensman57

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Hi guys I'm looking at buying a ccd camera what's a good ccd to get? I've been told that the atik 314l is a cracker but it's also quite expensive. Any ideas or shall I just hold out for this camera? Thanks.

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First step, define your budget.

Second step, decide what it is you want to image, widefield  nebulea, small galaxies, the planets, etc.

Third step , having decided what it is you want to image what do you want to use for imaging, ie the scope.

Then decide if you want to do it in mono-LRGB, or one shot colour.

After all this you can ask the question what is the best option for your needs.

CCD astro imaging is very involved and very expensive, better be prepared by doing a lot of research and asking a lot of questions.  BTW there is no such thing as the best CCD or the best scope different objects require different scopes, ccds and processing, it is all fun I guess.

Regards,

A.G

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Skooby

Skooby

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First step, define your budget.

Second step, decide what it is you want to image, widefield nebulea, small galaxies, the planets, etc.

Third step , having decided what it is you want to image what do you want to use for imaging, ie the scope.

Then decide if you want to do it in mono-LRGB, or one shot colour.

After all this you can ask the question what is the best option for your needs.

CCD astro imaging is very involved and very expensive, better be prepared by doing a lot of research and asking a lot of questions. BTW there is no such thing as the best CCD or the best scope different objects require different scopes, ccds and processing, it is all fun I guess.

Regards,

A.G

I'm looking at imaging galaxies dso's nebula and planets I will use my 250pds and 600d for some imaging but for the ccd camera I will be using a William optics 71ed as I've been told this is a very good scope. So I'm looking for the most compatible ccd for this scope sorry if I wasn't clear on this. And thanks for that fov calculator that will come in usefull. Thanks guys.

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GuillermoBarrancos

GuillermoBarrancos

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I'm looking at imaging galaxies dso's nebula and planets I will use my 250pds and 600d for some imaging but for the ccd camera I will be using a William optics 71ed as I've been told this is a very good scope. So I'm looking for the most compatible ccd for this scope sorry if I wasn't clear on this. And thanks for that fov calculator that will come in usefull. Thanks guys.

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But what is Your Budget for the CCD?

In case of the WO71. Then the Atik 420L one shot color might be an affordable fit. Or the Atik 320E if you want Mono.

When it comes to Mono CCD cameras, you also have to take into account a filterwheel + LRGB filterset as extra cost.

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Zakalwe

Zakalwe

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I'm looking at imaging galaxies dso's nebula and planets

All needing different cameras/scope combinations. No one camera can really do all three justice.

Planetary needs big aperture, long focal lengths and cameras that can take movie files (many thousands of frames per minute).

Nebulae (generally) need fairly wide-fields and long-exposure capable cameras.

Galaxies tend to be small (in arc-seconds), and need longer focal lengths.

Mono gives more flexibility, but is arguably harder for a beginner (IMHO- can of worms opened). You have to budget for filter (£200 for a decent LRGB set, new. Narrowband are more expensive- £120+ for each one) Plus a filterwheel.

Also consider that a CCD will need power. And a computer/laptop to run it, whereas a DSLR is "self-contained"

Lots to think about!

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Skooby

Skooby

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I'm looking at around £500 maybe 6? And yes I'm aware of the price of filters with a mono and that there is more detail with mono ccd's I don't really know much about one shot colour what are these like then?

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Skooby

Skooby

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All needing different cameras/scope combinations. No one camera can really do all three justice.

Planetary needs big aperture, long focal lengths and cameras that can take movie files (many thousands of frames per minute).

Nebulae (generally) need fairly wide-fields and long-exposure capable cameras.

Galaxies tend to be small (in arc-seconds), and need longer focal lengths.

Mono gives more flexibility, but is arguably harder for a beginner (IMHO- can of worms opened). You have to budget for filter (£200 for a decent LRGB set, new. Narrowband are more expensive- £120+ for each one) Plus a filterwheel.

Also consider that a CCD will need power. And a computer/laptop to run it, whereas a DSLR is "self-contained"

Lots to think about!

yes it's all money but I have a 250pds and 600d for some imaging and il be getting a William optics 71ed with a ccd both will be mounted on an neq6 pro mount. I've budgeted for colour filters etc its an expensive hobby I know which can have no end to the equipment.

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lensman57

lensman57

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I'm looking at imaging galaxies dso's nebula and planets I will use my 250pds and 600d for some imaging but for the ccd camera I will be using a William optics 71ed as I've been told this is a very good scope. So I'm looking for the most compatible ccd for this scope sorry if I wasn't clear on this. And thanks for that fov calculator that will come in usefull. Thanks guys.

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I suggest that you use the DSLR for imaging first, the size of the DSO on your sensor is only a function of the FL of your scope ie: it will be the same size be it a DSLR sensor or a small sensor of a cooled CCD. The 600D has pixels with a size of 4.3 Microns which make it suitable for a small widefield Apo ED such as the WO ZS71, I do have one with 0.8X and 0.6X Reducers. I think that you should perhaps get the scope and just use the DSLR untill you have gained some experience and then think about the CCD. If you want true widefield imaging then the size of the CCDs sensor becomes a factor as the larger nebulea need a lot of real estate on the sensor, the larger the size of the sensor the more expensive the CCD as a rough guide you'd be looking at £1700.00 ~£2300.00 for a CCD. As the WO71 is about 420mm of FL you'd need a sensor with relatively small pixel size for the scale to be correct that is why I suggested using the DSLR first as it has perfect pixel size for the FL of the WO71. You can even get Astronomic NB clip filters for the camera if you to enhance the emission nebulea with some Ha LUM and these cost about £150.00 a piece. The DSLR will still be usable with the 250 but without getting too technical you'd be heavily oversampling the data so perhaps at a later date you could look at a Cooled CCD with a larger pixel size than 4.3 Microns, off the top of my head you'd need something in the region of 7.5 microns to bring the sampling down, I think an Atik 4000 is about close to this but that would set you back about £2300.00 in the basic form. The DSLR now begins to look like a bargain.

Regards,

A.G

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GuillermoBarrancos

GuillermoBarrancos

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I'm looking at around £500 maybe 6? And yes I'm aware of the price of filters with a mono and that there is more detail with mono ccd's I don't really know much about one shot colour what are these like then?

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One shot color means you don´t have to invest in filterwheel and LRGB filters. Saving Money if you are on a tight Budget.

Mono CCD cameras are more sensitive and have more options With filters, like Narrowband imaging, like Ha and OIII. Tho there are People that do use Ha filter succesfully on One shot Color CCD cameras too. You just need to collect more data / longer exposure times.

So if you are on a tight Budget, start With a One shot color CCD camera. It will still blow any DSLR out of the water.

Tho 500-600 as Budget won´t cut it I am afraid. Unless you can get one from the 2nd hand market.

Like I said in earlier post. New you are looking at at least 879 pounds.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/atik-cameras/atik-420l-ccd-camera.html

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ollypenrice

ollypenrice

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For the small WO refractor a CCD with small pixels would be best and you'd gert a reasonable field of view on a small chip. Lots of 'smalls' in that sentence. But a short FL like that of the little Apo won't get you close to more than three galaxies.

Olly

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Skooby

Skooby

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One shot color means you don´t have to invest in filterwheel and LRGB filters. Saving Money if you are on a tight Budget.

Mono CCD cameras are more sensitive and have more options With filters, like Narrowband imaging, like Ha and OIII. Tho there are People that do use Ha filter succesfully on One shot Color CCD cameras too. You just need to collect more data / longer exposure times.

So if you are on a tight Budget, start With a One shot color CCD camera. It will still blow any DSLR out of the water.

Tho 500-600 as Budget won´t cut it I am afraid. Unless you can get one from the 2nd hand market.

Like I said in earlier post. New you are looking at at least 879 pounds.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/atik-cameras/atik-420l-ccd-camera.html

what would you say then to get say I paid the 900 is a one shot good on detail?

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Skooby

Skooby

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Yes those are good cameras.

Ofcourse you can get the mono version for same price and just start shooting mono images at first and save up for a filterwheel and filters later on.

Choice is yours.

But if you are on a tight budget I would just go with a one shot color.

But thats just me.

Yeh it sounds good to me what other one shot colour ccd's are on the market for around the £900 mark what's had good reviews? Thanks

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ronin

ronin

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Beginning to suspect that slow down and collect more information is a good idea.

You need to look at the cameras, Atik, SBIG, Starlight Express, Image Source and the ZWO cmos options.

It can be a real minefield and as cameras are fairly costly I would take the time to look across the field.

Difficult to say find a club with an imaging section, the section could be full of people with ccd's costing several thousands instead of several hundreds.

One thought about the ZWO is that if you expect to get into AP more seriously then the ZWO would be a reasonable first start with an upgrade later. Thinking £280 now and £2500 later instead of £800 now and £2500 later.

No choice is really going to be the obvious one.

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GuillermoBarrancos

GuillermoBarrancos

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Beginning to suspect that slow down and collect more information is a good idea.

You need to look at the cameras, Atik, SBIG, Starlight Express, Image Source and the ZWO cmos options.

It can be a real minefield and as cameras are fairly costly I would take the time to look across the field.

Difficult to say find a club with an imaging section, the section could be full of people with ccd's costing several thousands instead of several hundreds.

One thought about the ZWO is that if you expect to get into AP more seriously then the ZWO would be a reasonable first start with an upgrade later. Thinking £280 now and £2500 later instead of £800 now and £2500 later.

No choice is really going to be the obvious one.

Why buy a CMOS planetary camera, when he already has a DSLR camera? Other than if he wants to do Planetary imaging.

Starlight Express start at a higher pricepoint. And lets forget about SBIG cameras, unless you got a couple thousand lying around.

Both QHY and Atik offer very good entry Level CCD cameras with their QHY8L and Atik 420 series. I don´t see how he could go wrong with any of these cameras.

I think it´s much better to start out with an entry Level CCD around 900 pounds, then dropping a whopping 2500 on a camera when you are just starting out. Unless you´ve got Money growing on your back that´s easy to spend.

Unfortunately for the most of us, we do not have that kind of luxury.

To the OP (forgot to add it earlier), here is a series of videos from Astronomyshed on the QHY8L (I think he is using it on a large Newt with EQ6. Pretty much similar to the setup you already have):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw8i5DMZ4SQ

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Blazar

Blazar

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Have to agree with Johnrt.  Even when you have read the book (twice), then you can investigate what you want to do and make informed decisions. I have read the book  (more than twice) and the pages are falling out now...and yet I have not quite finished my investigation...a year later.

However I am nearing the end and have a scope and set-up in sight..its just cash-flow now....as always. Then the real learning curve can begin...

Don't waste your hard earned cash until you understand WHY you should buy something and what it will give you....just my Ten pennies worth of course.

Good luck.

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