Skywatcher 200P Dobsonian Extras.

[vvsloan]

Hi,

We will shortly be getting a 200P Dobsonian and I'm wondering what any of your recommendations would be if we were to get just 1 extra with it.

Knowing from a previous thread I started, the general consensus seems to be not to get one at all and I would make a better, more informed choice if I were to wait a while, however, this scope is going to be an Xmas present so whatever doesnt come in the initial package, (birthdays also being in December) we would not have the excuse/opportunity to acquire for another year. From everything I've read, it seems unlikely we would get the best out of our scope with just the stock 2 eye pieces for an entire year. So if you were to recommend just 1 extra, what would it be? (we already have a light filter).

Thanks,

Victoria.

[Charic]

v vsloan............Hi. the telescope is actually fine on its own. but as you stated, you could improve on the supplied lenses. The first thing I did was to buy a BST 8mm Starguider lens £49 ebay. I use this instead of the supplied 10mm lens. The BST is far superior, There are other lenses to,o as others will describe, and  as for the 25mm supplied, Thats an OK lens, keep using that, but sometime in the future, you may  want something with a wider view, or better build, and feel. But use the 25mm and upgrade the 10mm. Thats it.  As a freebie, down load Stellarium , this will assist your with discovering the Night sky. The Book `Turn left at Orion` is another favourite. With the 200P, collimation is an issue you`ll need to address at some stage. I would recommend studying the web site at Astro Baby. Use a dust cap or 35mm film case (all explained on her guide). At a later stage, you can spend on tools? The scope should come collimated( optics fully aligned ) however a few bumps and knocks during transit may upset the alignment, but the packing is substantial, and very very large (2 boxes ?) But overall, the scope works fine out of the Box, The 8mm BST will be a stunner, so If only one extra, for me, 8MM BST.

[rwilkey]

Hi Victoria, as the scope comes with a 10mm and a 25mm eyepiece I would rcommend something in-between, such as a BST Explorer/StarGuider 15mm, or the 18mm is very good here: http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xbst+explorer&_nkw=bst+explorer&_sacat=0&_from=R40, but there's no substitute for trying out the new telescope with what comes with the package.  A lot of people recommend a Telrad red dot finder here: http://www.firstlightoptics.com/finders/telrad-finder-astronomy.html - as the straight through finder that comes with the scope you have to contort yourself to look through it.  My personal recommendation would be a RACI (right-angled, correct image) finder as these are the ones I prefer to use, it means you don't have to contort yourself looking up the barrel of the telescope.  Hope this helps.

[Mad Taff]

You have received wise words regarding getting to know your telescope before buying upgrades or accessories. Having said that the first thing i bought fairly soon after getting my telescope was a replacement for the standard 10mm eyepiece. I went for an 8mm starguider - a very good quality eyepiece for the price - which i use to observe the planets. Anyway, i'm sure you will get a lot more advice today.

[vvsloan]

Thank you all.. Already have the Turn Left/Cheshire collimator/LED head torch. Have studied the Astro Baby collimating guide which enlightened, educated and terrified me in equal measure : )  Charic & Taff you by far not the 1st people I've seen citing the 8mm BST as a fantastic ep. Seems to be a winner.

I'm really liking the sound of the RACI. So much so that from your hint Robin, I've looked into them and have now started putting feelers out for a second hand Skywatcher 9x50 Right angled erecting finderscope. If I can get a 2nd hand one (which I actually think is unlikely, I'm sure they would tend to be sold along with the scopes they were used with) then I reckon I can stretch to 2 extras and get an ep aswell (I'm really feeling the 8mmBST..)

Thanks again everyone for your help and advice.

Any one else have any suggestions, advice, or choices of what their one extra would be?

[Paulhenry85]

All well and good having a selection of eyepieces but I would recommend before buying a EP you need to decide what you enjoy viewing the 2 EP's in the box will help you decide and are not that bad.

ease of use will have you using your telescope more than anything, so I personally think the Must haves are: Reference books e.g. Turn left at Orion, night watch ect, nothing worse than trying to guess and a Cheshire as using a cap with a hole in the center as the instruction recommend you do is fiddly to say the least. These are relatively cheap items and will serve you well. Hope this helps.

[AlexB67]

Hello,

while an extra eyepiece will be nice, a telescope that is hard to use for a beginner may get frustrating quickly, with that in mind I would go for a terlad/Rigel or a red dot finder to go with it as a starter accessory.  The finder scope many find hard to use by itself, even seasoned astronomers, even one that shows a correct image I,e. not upside down or left to right without the aid of a telrad or one of those finders. 

The first accessory I bought for my 10 inch Dob was a rigel quikfinder, that was coming from a 5 inch small dob with a red dot finder that I found easy to use, suddenly I found myself searching targets a lot more having to use the finder alone,  instead of actually looking at them, the rigel solved that for me.  Whether you will prefer a telrad or rigel or red dot is a debate in itself, each come with their pros and cons, but there is plenty stuff on this forum and the internet to tell you about them.

Good luck

[AlexB67]

Here is a useful link

http://www.cloudynights.com/documents/9finders.pdf

for the various pointing devices to wet your appetite and compare them. I went for the rigel by the way owing to its small compact size and weighs virtually nothing. I am very very happy with it. Most will say the telrad will edge it though ( but there may be a little bias on some forums since a telrad is a bit of a fashion icon device these days, at least that is my feeling to some degree  ) , I've never used a telrad, in the end of the day both get the job done. 

[Charic]

...........A water butt stand of about 52cm (top surface width inside the rim) I think, gets the 200P up off the ground, which makes sighting through the finderscope a lot less neck breaking for some. The stand is not available to me locally,  but I do have a similar stand but not as stable, so i`ll have to order online, but that may help. The 9x50 isnt too bad. Set up the telescope on a Daylight target some distance away, align the finder to the same spot, then at night keep BOTH eyes open using the finder-scope. The left/right  (eye) image aligns much quicker , also saves squinting, and your done. The Starguiders are available on ebay, Alan is such a pleasant chap to communicate with. You can purchase more than one lens, and return any you feel are not suitable for a refund. His try before you buy offer ( only you actually pay up front, and refunded later if required.)  there are other lenses available, and  will be noted by other users, but for the value and clarity, Im really happy with that 8mm. My 18mm has been here all week, but cloudy skies here at present, and the 25mm is being posted today, that was auctioned from ebay, great price too.

[rory]

A drum stool / ironing chair or some other adjustable bottom rest. .

It simply makes observing more comfortable.

I sometimes observe for 3 , 4 hours at a time and I couldn't of done so stood up.

Raci finders telrad a and eyepieces are all good options but for only 1 option it would be the stool.

[Gosport_Graphics]

The best "extra" I bought for mine initially was a laser collimator. Now I can tune in a couple of minutes no matter where I am pitched up 

£25.00 on eBay ( ) but superb bit of kit!

Mark

[Reeny]

You have received wise words regarding getting to know your telescope before buying upgrades or accessories. Having said that the first thing i bought fairly soon after getting my telescope was a replacement for the standard 10mm eyepiece. I went for an 8mm starguider - a very good quality eyepiece for the price - which i use to observe the planets. Anyway, i'm sure you will get a lot more advice today.

I second Mad Taff and Charic with 8mm BST recommendation.

I use the 16mm and a 2x barlow the most (8mm equivalent)

It also means you can add the 5mm BST to the 8mm and 25mm later on = 48x / 150x / 240x magnifications

I have the 200P dob and,

The water butt stand is good, but too tall for Mrs R (it needs to stand back on the ground when both of us are using the scope).

The right angled finder scope is £65 plus - quite expensive when you can buy other gear instead.

I don't use a red dot finder - the stock finder scope is good enough.

The film canister collimator works OK to get you going.

I would go for the 8mm BST first, and look to getting more eyepieces at a later date.

I got the 2-inch 42mm revelation eyepiece for £36 delivered.

We are looking forward to better views of Andromeda, Plaiedes, double cluster, and the bits & pieces in Orion.

Current magnifications = 28x / 50x / 100x / 160x / 210x - with the 160x being used the most.

[vvsloan]

Thanks to everyone for your help/advice/links/suggestions.

Having conveniently decided something to sit on doesn't constitute an extra (and have picked up a great adjustable multi-seat for half price at Amazon Warehouse due to the box being damaged) its now a painful contest between the 8mm BST and a Telrad, although due to the fact that it comes supplied with an existing finderscope, I think the eye piece pips it to the post...Still,I really like the sound of the Telrads ability to '–  spot a star in the night and point your telescope – “there”.' (Astromag.co.uk).  You have no idea how much agonising I'm doing over whether to just buy a Telrad aswel as the eye piece...:/

Anybody else with a 200P Dob got anything to say on the difference between just using the supplied finderscope or how much easier it is (or not, as the case may be) with a Telrad?

Thanks!

Victoria.

[ScottS]

I cannot comment on the Telrad finders, but I have found it really easy to get on with the supplied finderscope. You do need to twist your body about a bit though, especially when viewing anything near zenith.

[rory]

Telrad or Rigel finders are worth every penny. I was getting within the area of sky I wanted within seconds. I initially chose a seat as my ONE extra , but as you have chosen to take a seat as a non extra ( lol like it ) I would have chosen a telrad or Rigel next .

[AlexB67]

The problem with a finder scope alone is where to initially point the scope. You can imagine pointing it to somewhere in the sky and hope you are in the right area by looking over the top, doing the best job you think you can,  once you are there and recognise what you see in the finder it is fine.  Perhaps some are more skilled at this aligning than others and are therefore happy with the finder alone, but even a red dot/ rings in a telrad gives you that much more accurate starting reference to work from, then zone in using the finder.

For me the process is

1. use  telrad/rigel or red dot to rough in region
2. Use finder to refine search ( if needed, the more complex targets will need this, some easier ones will not)

IMHO, neither are exclusive and both the finder and telrad complement each other. Personally if I had to make a choice which one had to go it would be the finder scope, since with a with a wide angle eyepiece low magnification eyepiece the more detailed work can be done to zone in, and in my ( limited) experience it is amazing how accurate the rigel/telrad is to get close to where you want to be, once you know the bit of the sky you are looking, that will come with practice.

[Paulhenry85]

I have a telrad, a 200p dob and the SW right angle finderscope. It saves so much time trying to find stuff in the night sky, so for that reason they are worth every penny as clear nights and time are scarce. The supplied finder does the job but i personally am terrible at working inverted (the whole up being down and right being left thing) plus the image is magnified which doesn't help when trying to get the scope in roughly the right spot. You will find you will need to star hop from one bright star to another which in its self is a skill!! While doing this you'll be craning your neck the tire time.

It took me a while before buying the telrad, but I wish it had been one of my first purchases, plus for the cost it's well cheaper than any half decent EP and Without knowing what you like to view/observe, some if not all DSO's are a bitch to find with a high mag (low focal length) EP or they just don't fit in.

Hope this helps.

[vvsloan]

A Telrad it is then, now ordered along with shiny new scope, with a BST next on the list. 

Many thanks again all for your invaluable fab advice, you've all been more than helpful..

(If I wake up with a new EP on the mat before Xmas this will have been the lamest attempt ever at a 'One Extra' )

Victoria x

[Charic]

vvsloan..........Ive just this Week experienced a much darker viewing site on a quiet, little used public road?  and because the site is much darker,  compared to my own back yard, what I saw through the 9x50 was darker too. I believe under these darker conditions, the Telrad would be a benefit. I also  wished that I had the 52cm water butt stand to raise the telescope of the ground a little, and an adjustable seat that night.  Remember the Telrad still needs to be sight aligned to the telescopes line of sight, but I also believe that the Telrad finder reticule would be an effective aid to Start hopping for the darker conditions.

The BST is a no brainer, you wont be disappointed. BST`s  go upto 25mm ( I got a nice one at auction the other day (good price too) but cant get the whole of M31 Andromeda  into view, its just a large entity, not seen until you get to darker site and skies.