Jump to content

NLCbanner2024.jpg.2478be509670e60c2d6efd04834b8b47.jpg

Solar fast frame camera options?

ollypenrice

By ollypenrice
in Imaging - Solar

Recommended Posts

ollypenrice

ollypenrice

Posted
Posted

Hi All,

I'm really a deep sky imager but offer solar imaging in a Lunt 60. At the moment I have a DMK21 but the small chip is a bit frustrating. I'm not clued up on fast frame cameras. I'd like a bigger chip, at least so that I could do whole disk images in two panels (rather than four), though one would be nice! Could you give me any pointers towards recent cameras that I probably haven't heard of? Is there anything affordable that could do whole disk in the Lunt? I'm not up for buying a Skynix. I'm in the £600 bracket.

What's out there, is really what I'm asking.

Thanks,

Olly

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ollypenrice

ollypenrice

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You're welcome ...

You get one of those bolted onto a 100mm "Solarscope" and I'll stop saving for an Ha set-up and start saving for a month at Les Granges ... :grin:

If I went round buying 100mm Solarscopes I think my revised prices might put you off! :eek:

Olly

Link to comment
Share on other sites
madjohn

madjohn

Posted
Posted

Hi Olly. Glad to see your enjoying solar imaging again like myself in the current spell of good weather here in the UK. I'd go for a DMK 41 camera, although it has a lower frame rate (15fps) it does have a larger chip size which means you should be able to create a full solar disc with just two images :) You might also find this comparison review of the DMK 21 - 31 - 41 informative reading from two of the worlds most experienced (at least IMHO) solar imagers. http://www.stephenramsden.com/solarastrophotography/reviews/DMK%20review.pdf Hope your well and everything is going great at Les Granges :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ollypenrice

ollypenrice

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hi Olly. Glad to see your enjoying solar imaging again like myself in the current spell of good weather here in the UK. I'd go for a DMK 41 camera, although it has a lower frame rate (15fps) it does have a larger chip size which means you should be able to create a full solar disc with just two images :) You might also find this comparison review of the DMK 21 - 31 - 41 informative reading from two of the worlds most experienced (at least IMHO) solar imagers. http://www.stephenra.../DMK review.pdf Hope your well and everything is going great at Les Granges :)

What a nice post. Thank you, John. You are quite right about the DMK41. One of our favourite guests was kind enough to turn up with a 41 and the 2 panel solution is incredibly easy to process because the amount of overlap is so large. A seamless finish is easy to acheive. This was with our guest's DMK41.

Sun%20full%20disk%20Nov2%202012-S.jpg

I'd be happy with that but, even so, a one shot full disk would be nice. There are large chip DMKs which look as if they might do that. I have no plans to get invvolved with planetary imaging so an ultra fast frame rate is not essential.

I'm all ears when it comes to the options...

Many thanks,

Olly

Link to comment
Share on other sites
madjohn

madjohn

Posted
Posted

Nice image by your customer there Olly.

There are many options available but I'm only recently bitten by the solar bug!

Hopefully someone else here can advise Olly with more experience of fast solar rate cameras?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JamesF

JamesF

Posted
Posted

When I was toying with the idea of a dedicated solar cam it seemed that most people were using the DMK41. The other suggestions I saw were for some of the Point Grey range, but I got the impression with those that if you need to ask the price then you can't afford them.

James

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Montana

Montana

Posted
Posted

Lots of people love the DMK51 with the Sun, Chris Schur and Pedro Re both love it. I think if you can afford the 51 then go for it, the IS cameras are very good and reliable. If you are feeling even more rich then a Point Grey Grasshopper 3 seems to be the bees knees at the moment, it has a huge chip and resolution but the software is Rubbish and Firecapture can be a bit temperamental but the results coming out in solar are superb http://solarchat.solarastronomy.org/index.php/en/this-is-solar-chat/6-this-is-solarchat-/74713-big-prom-1st-july

Alexandra

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hunterknox

hunterknox

Posted
Posted

If you haven't seen the upcoming Imaging Source/Celestron USB 3.0 offerings then they're worth a look. Similar chip specs to the current IS cameras but faster frame rate if you've got a USB 3.0 laptop. If I had the money I'd be all over this - essentially a DMK 51 with a faster frame rate. If I had even more money I'd go for the Grasshopper (mentioned above).

I'm using the Point Grey Chameleon, which I think is a sensible "budget" choice (that's "budget" as in cheaper than an Imaging Source equivalent, but not actually cheap). Same number of pixels and frame rate as a DMK41 but a 1/3" chip rather than 1/2", so better resolution at your native focal length but it requires a bit more stitching to do a full disc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Luke

Luke

Posted
Posted

I thought I heard some Lunt 60 owners use a 0.8 reducer with the DMK41 to get a full disc?

re: Grasshopper 3, Sarah and I have the 2.8MP ICX687, though we are new to this game. I wasn't going to reply as it's over budget and also I didn't think you'd get the whole disc on at 500mm focal length once you allow for proms and some breathing space. But having tried a resize in Photoshop, it's nearly there. But would you risk cutting off a whopper prom? :eek:

For the "budget" 2.8MP mono versions, in the UK it was about £1050 inc VAT for the ICX687 and £1600 inc VAT for the ICX674 (which has larger pixels, so would have oodles of space) a few months ago when we checked.

Left image is a full frame (resized, of course!) with my solar max 60 (400mm focal length), and right is a simulation of 500mm (I resized the sun with 125% - hope I got the maths right!).

gallery_2875_2665_12531.jpg

The moon fits with spare using my 500mm ED80, but of course, no proms to worry about.

Info here:

http://grasshopper3....B3/Grasshopper3

Frame rate is 26FPS full frame and it does region of interest. I've captured at 50FPS with ROI, so hope this can double up for planets (though in your case you already have a solution for planets?).

I actually quite like the included capture software having got used to it, though I am not used to other capture software. I did try to use other software with this but couldn't get it working, so stuck with the included one.

With these cams, it's probably best to check your hardware is suitable (I get about 12GB of video in a minute), I believe there are some tech notes on the site somewhere.

I first thought I almost have too much spare space on the chip with my SolarMax 60, but it works out nicely for four tiles with a 2.5x powermate to get the full disc at a higher resolution. And it works out nicely on tripods with no tracking. I can get up to about 2500 frames undriven at prime focus by rotating the camera as needed and letting the sun drift longways, though that may be drifting it well out of the sweetspot, so currently I take about 1000 frames undriven and they seem okay when stacked, but are pending final processing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
riklaunim

riklaunim

Posted
Posted

Cheapest with big diagonal would be e2v sensors (1/1.8" like in DMK51) - one of Ximea xiQ (USB3) or IDS Imaging UI-1245LE-M-GL. Around 300 EUR nett price (sapphire e2v sensor). You will pay more for NIR version (UI-1240LE-NIR with newer e2v ruby-line sensor).

For most demanding there are USB3 Ximea cameras with 1" CMOSIS sensors at 1400-1600 EUR (but also 90 FPS at 2048x2048).

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
DrRobin

DrRobin

Posted
Posted

Hi Olly,

I use a DMK41 with a 0.5x FR on a very short (sawn off) nosepiece and can image the sun in one go on my Lunt 60. It was my standard photo but has now been replaced by a 1.5x barlow and 12 pane mosaic.

I think when I checked that the DMK51 and Lunt 60 is fairly tight in getting the disc in one go, the cost and lower frame rate (12fps) doesn't make it look very attractive for solar Ha.

I can't see enough of an advantage in the IS/Celestron Skyris for Solar Ha either. I have no practical experience of using the Point Grey Cameras, but if I was looking to upgrade they would be the ones I would choose. Ideally, I would like the same or more pixels, but at least 30fps and the PG Flea will get me there.

The other thing to consider is the size of the sweetspot (the area that is correctly tuned), my Lunt 60 in single stack looks pretty even over a DMK41, but add a double stack and I would say that this reduces to about half the frame or less.

For me the ideal camera would be slightly more pixels, but a lot smaller, so I don't have to use a barlow and fast frame rate. Oh something that is fairly sensitive as well so I can use fast exposures, sounds like the holy grail again doesn't it?

Robin

Robin

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Psychobilly

Psychobilly

Posted
Posted

Following this with interest as I am trying to decided to use on the Stage 2 modded Lyra optics 4" f11 setup with the BF-15...

I had been looking at the Skyris range including the big on the 274 as I have An I5 laptop with USB 3.0...

At 1000mm fl it will still need a few panels..

Hoping the clouds that Kev packed with it will clear and I can try it out...

Peter...

Link to comment
Share on other sites
riklaunim

riklaunim

Posted
Posted

Following this with interest as I am trying to decided to use on the Stage 2 modded Lyra optics 4" f11 setup with the BF-15...

I had been looking at the Skyris range including the big on the 274 as I have An I5 laptop with USB 3.0...

At 1000mm fl it will still need a few panels..

Hoping the clouds that Kev packed with it will clear and I can try it out...

It would be hard to fit the whole Sun at 1000 mm. Aside of much more expensive CMV4000 sensor (or ~1" Sony sensors) there is no other option. If you are looking at the 274 Skyris check it if it's gives artifact-free image at max speed (20 FPS). You can also look at slightly bigger e2v sensors in IDS/PGR/Ximea cameras.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.