PST's and DSLR's

[Smeg]

Why on earth do Lunt or Coronado design the PST's to not allow DSLR attaching to them?

Is there any specific reason? I wonder how many sales they are losing because of this.

[Stephen]

Why on earth do Lunt or Coronado design the PST's to not allow DSLR attaching to them?

Is there any specific reason? I wonder how many sales they are losing because of this.

Possibly none? I thought solar required lots of images stacked (as per planets) - which is more typical of webcam / planetary cameras than DSLR cameras?

I'm not familiar with the scopes, what prevents a DSLR being connected?

[Smeg]

Hmm can I use a 32mm projection eyepiece that is supplied with the revelation kits?

I keep getting mixed reports on attaching DSLRs to the PSTs. some say its not possible to focus, others do modifications.

Basically I have held off buying one purely because of the uncertainty of connecting my DSLR to the scope, plus they have special eyepieces for sale for the PST's that just puts more doubt about using regular eyepieces in the scopes.

[JB80]

It is possible but you need an eyepiece with a t-ring adaptor for best results. I use a Hyperion zoom and it works really well but can't comment on any other makes. The eyepieces sold for the PST are no more special than regular eyepieces(EP), to the best of my knowledge they are regular eyepieces so you can use any that you already own with it.

If you have an EP which has the t-ring thread and you can visually focus then focus is not an issue for imaging with a dslr, no modifications needed.

For an idea of what I have been getting I have some pics here....

http://stargazerslounge.com/imaging-solar/150856-4-8-11-pst.html

Still need to get it nailed though.

For an even better idea of what is possible checkout some of Kev's attempts...

http://stargazerslounge.com/imaging-solar/149596-solar-disk-h-dslr-220711-a.html

It's actually relatively easy with a dslr once you get going whereas you do seem to have to use barlows or make some mods with webcams although the result is better in the end.

I should add this is just my experience with the Coronado, I have no idea about the Lunt's although I imagine you can go down a similar path.

My theory on why they make them the way they do is because they are the entry level scopes and are designed with visual use only in mind with the idea that they want you to buy the expensive upgrade when taking the imaging route.

Also just on a visual basis I feel they are worth the investment, it's addictive.

[Merlin66]

The original PST was designed as a visual instrument. Don't know about the Lunt.

Adding a barlow down inside the PST eyepiece holder is the favourite option to allow DSLR's to be used.

[markt]

Personally I think the use of DSLRs in Ha solar observing is not the best option at all, a dedicated b&w CCD camera is the way forward. I know if I represented Lunt or Coronado I would not push for the use of a DSLR as this does not show off what these scopes really are capable of photographically, the results compared to CCD really is a peg below.

[JB80]

It's not the best option, but for some it's the only option. You can only work with what you got and a dedicated CCD is a serious investment for some. All I'm saying is that it can be done to a limited degree whilst saving for an CCD later down the line and I wouldn't let that put you off if your thinking about getting one.

[Smeg]

Personally I think the use of DSLRs in Ha solar observing is not the best option at all, a dedicated b&w CCD camera is the way forward. I know if I represented Lunt or Coronado I would not push for the use of a DSLR as this does not show off what these scopes really are capable of photographically, the results compared to CCD really is a peg below.

Why is that? The sensor size?

These scopes are designed as BUDGET solar scopes, people on a LOW BUDGET that most likely will use what they have at hand, which is most likely a DSLR.

Once one factors in the need to get more equipment, the price range of the PST goes out of range.

Basically at hand I have a Revelation 2x Barlow, Revelation 32mm projection eyepiece with T-thread screws (basically the fantastic standard Revelation Eyepiece photography kit) and the popular 1000D/1100D EOS. Has anybody tried that configuration? I would imagine that combination is VERY popular with budget astro imagers.

[Stephen]

Why is that? The sensor size?

These scopes are designed as BUDGET solar scopes, people on a LOW BUDGET that most likely will use what they have at hand, which is most likely a DSLR.

Once one factors in the need to get more equipment, the price range of the PST goes out of range.

Basically at hand I have a Revelation 2x Barlow, Revelation 32mm projection eyepiece with T-thread screws (basically the fantastic standard Revelation Eyepiece photography kit) and the popular 1000D/1100D EOS. Has anybody tried that configuration? I would imagine that combination is VERY popular with budget astro imagers.

Sorry but budget to me is a £20 webcam, not a DSLR

[Smeg]

Sorry but budget to me is a £20 webcam, not a DSLR

Budget to me is what I have at hand WITHOUT having to run out and buy something else.

PS: the cheapest MS LifeCam is 50 GBP on Amazon S.A.R.L (UK) then one has to modify it which risks the price doubling to 100 GBP if it goes wrong lol

[Merlin66]

Guys,

Sure you can use what ever you have to hand...even film still works...

To make the best of the seeing conditions and to get a stack of frames to be able to select the best, is probably the best way to go. Mono cameras give better resolution, web cam type give the AVI for quality and stacking.. combine the two and you have a good fighting chance of get some creditable solar images.

[Stephen]

Budget to me is what I have at hand WITHOUT having to run out and buy something else.

PS: the cheapest MS LifeCam is 50 GBP on Amazon S.A.R.L (UK).

That's not what you said however. You said it was a budget scope for people on a budget. We're trying to help!

Have a good old read through previous posts, you will find more posts than not will recommend a fast frame rate webcam or planetary camera for planetary / solar - it's the better tool for the job.

Yes, you can get good results with a DSLR as well - but requires more work to make it work in this case.

PS : The cheapest webcam that is more than suitable for "budget" use is the Philips SPC880 which is available for £15

By default, a lot of telescopes won't accept a DSLR without extras (adaptors) being required - these scopes are primarily a visual thing, imaging is a really nice extra.

In this case it appears to make a DSLR work, you need an eyepiece, and a means of connecting the DSLR to the eyepiece to achieve focus.

[Smeg]

Ok anybody out there used a PST with...

Revelation 2x Barlow

Revelation 32mm Eyepiece projection

Canon 1100d/1000D unmodded

??

[Smeg]

That's not what you said however. You said it was a budget scope for people on a budget. We're trying to help!

Have a good old read through previous posts, you will find more posts than not will recommend a fast frame rate webcam or planetary camera for planetary / solar - it's the better tool for the job.

Yes, you can get good results with a DSLR as well - but requires more work to make it work in this case.

PS : The cheapest webcam that is more than suitable for "budget" use is the Philips SPC880 which is available for £15

By default, a lot of telescopes won't accept a DSLR without extras (adaptors) being required - these scopes are primarily a visual thing, imaging is a really nice extra.

In this case it appears to make a DSLR work, you need an eyepiece, and a means of connecting the DSLR to the eyepiece to achieve focus.

Now in the words of Dragons Den - I'm out!

I avoid the philips webcam as it is on life support with hacking firmware and being on windows 7 64 bit, that is probably a world of hurt going Windows 8. A lot of scopes (skywatcher) come with adaptors , eyepiece kits that beginners buy come with threaded T rings nosepieces or eyepieces with T threads. Tring for their DSLR is most likely what a beginner would buy (I did) as I already had a DSLR, any photographer would have a DSLR or else they are not a photographer are they

[StevieDvd]

Some PST folk are using a projection eyepiece such as the Hyperion or Skywatcher zoom with a dslr. They, and I believe the Revelation you have, either have a T thread as standard or via an add on (like the Hyperion).

The benefit of the zoom is you set the disk size of the sun as required, a fixed eyepiece may mean it's a little small and a barlow might be needed.

Not had much use of mine as I rely on weekend and the weather which has not been favourable lately.

[Smeg]

Some PST folk are using a projection eyepiece such as the Hyperion or Skywatcher zoom with a dslr. They, and I believe the Revelation you have, either have a T thread as standard or via an add on (like the Hyperion).

The benefit of the zoom is you set the disk size of the sun as required, a fixed eyepiece may mean it's a little small and a barlow might be needed.

Not had much use of mine as I rely on weekend and the weather which has not been favourable lately.

Yes the Revelation kit 32mm projection has a built in thread (unscrew the rubber eye cup to get at it), it also comes with a T-thread nose piece in the kit.

I don't want to shell out 500 GBP only to find I have to spend more just to get it to work out of the box, Sure I can add stuff later, but the point is I want to get it out of the box imaging, even basically, I don't mind extra effort in post processing, I do that for fun

[Smeg]

Another thing occurred to me, the DSLR's have a video mode, has anybody used that as an image source for stacking like they do with webcams?

[StevieDvd]

Seems like you have what you need to do the basics. With the dslr and projection eyepiece( probably with barlow needed to get a decent size) you can take one image for the detail of sunspots etc and another longer exposure to bring out the prominences.

Don't ask me for the camera settings I've yet to work that all out for myself.

[Smeg]

Seems like you have what you need to do the basics. With the dslr and projection eyepiece( probably with barlow needed to get a decent size) you can take one image for the detail of sunspots etc and another longer exposure to bring out the prominences.

Don't ask me for the camera settings I've yet to work that all out for myself.

That's what I am hoping, I would feel warmer and fuzzier about it if I knew somebody with that configuration has succeed with it.

Now there is the added issue of possible degrading filters lol

I don't feel warm and fuzzy about forking down 500 on a "not designed for imaging" and possible filter degradation problem.

[markt]

plus they have special eyepieces for sale for the PST's that just puts more doubt about using regular eyepieces in the scopes.

The only thing 'special' about the coronado eyepeices is the price - they're expensive! Yes, they're optimised for Ha wavelengths, however i've always found that a semi-decent plossl will actually outperform them. My personal preference is a televue plossl for a fixed fl ep, better views than the Cemax ep's.

[markt]

Why is that? The sensor size?

Nope. One of the principle reasons is that un-modded DSLRs are particularly insensitive to Ha light at 656nm - they have a low pass long wavelength filter on the chip. This reduces the amount of light you can work with resulting in a poor signal to noise ratio.

The second reason why DSLRs aren't the best solar option is that as working in narrowband light at 656nm is that only a quarter of the camera chip is actually used - DSLRs use a bayer matrix Bayer filter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - 75% of the bayer matrix is made up of green and blue, which is not used in Ha. Some people use information in this channel for their Ha image, however I think the thing to remember is that this is just light (I prefer to use the term noise here) that has leaked as a result of imperfections in the colour filter array.

The art of focussing with a DSLR whislt Ha imaging is also something that takes practice and perseverance.

DSLR Ha images, IMHO, end up lacking contrast and resolution compared to ccd alternatives.

I'm not saying don't use a DSLR for Ha work, i'm just saying be aware of their limitations... If you have the kit already for it my advice would be to give it a go, you have nothing to lose!

HTH!

Mark

[Photosbykev]

My first attempts at Solar imaging was with a DSLR PST Solar Imaging PhotosbyKev using a Hyperion 8-24mm zoom EP. It worked I was happy. Now I've moved onto a mono CCD camera the DMK41. Yes it's more expense, but damn the results are worth it .

If you want decent results, almost without exception, it costs money. If you just want to dabble then it can be done very reasonably with webcams/solar film etc.