Working out my best home grab and go set up

[Paz]

I thought I would post about a great grab and go set up for home use that I have been working on.

I have been changing and trying to improve my set ups over time. Initially I was just enjoying getting into observing with smallish scopes, then the first improvements I made were to do with being able to see fainter objects better (i.e. aperture for DSOs), then over time my attention moved to being able to resolve better details in smaller and brighter objects (e.g. good refractors and observing technique for solar system and double stars), and then my attention moved to making my sessions as comfortable as possible (by trying to perfect things like binoviewing, eyepiece height, tracking, seating and posture, clothing for cold and hot weather, etc). After that and in recent years as the weather has become more persistently cloudy my attention has turned to making those sets ups as quick as possible to set up and take down (so things like pre-set finders, pre-loaded diagonals and eyepieces, not changing eyepieces in the field, simplifying as much as possible, etc). That has worked well and I can take out a big-ish scope such as a C8 or 125mm refractor on a Skytee 2 or EQ5 quickly. However it is still 3 or 4 trips out and back (mount, scope, observing chair, eyepiece/finders/other bits bag), and bringing things back in I have to take them apart and ensure things do not dew up and then put them safely away so the cats don't destroy anything overnight. So if I had an hour clear I could set up, observe for a bit, pack up and be done and it would be worth it but it takes some degree of commitment to go for it.

Recently I've recently been experimenting with various set ups to go one step further and have something I can take out and bring back much more easily and in one trip, with everything ready to go, and that I can bring back in and not have to take down and put all the bits away. I was thinking about other things we can do that compete with choosing to go out and observe and how easy and quick they are to start doing, like say watching something on Netflix, and I wanted a set up that was as easy and as quick to use as doing that. I have had such set ups in the past but I have never really put much thought into them and never had one that I stuck with due to vibes, or eyepiece height being too low without an observing seat or no slow motion controls, etc etc. I would go back to observing with better but more complex sets ups that meant observing less often. This time around I have kept with it, and every time I have been out and come across something I am not happy with I have been trying to fix it and this is paying off. I was keen to make the best of the kit I have and not problem solve by just buying more stuff, so what I have ended up with is within that context, i.e. not the best there is, but the best of what I have.

So in the end the set up is based around a Vixen Porta 2 mount and a 72mm f6 doublet refractor.

Mount

The mounts I had to choose from were:

Horizon 8115 - good for height adjustment but it can't balance in altitude (unless I make a contraption to enable this) and has no slow motion controls.

Neewer tripod with AZT6 - good for height but not so good for stability and no slow motion controls (being a home set up I don't need the small size or super light weight benefits of this mount).

Skytee 2 - too heavy.

EQ5 - too heavy and too complicated (counterweights weights to set up, more balancing to have to do etc)

Porta 2 - the best combination available to me - light enough, stable enough, and it has slow motion controls. It does not get the scope as high as I would like but I have figured out a few ways around this. One being to leave the spreader tray off the tripod and pull the tripod legs in to get more height from the tripod if I need it - this can add up to about 7cm of height without compromising stability or leading to tipping over risk as the scope I am using is compact. This doesn't sound like much but it does make a notable difference to observing comfort if I don't have an observing seat.

Scope

The smaller scopes I had to choose from were: 

Skywatcher ST80 f5 achromat - really light for the aperture but poor options for mounting finders on the version I have, and not enough in focus for some of the back ends that I use.

Skywatcher ST120 f5 achromat - too heavy/long to be what I would call easy to take out when already attached to a mount.

Messier MC127 f15 maksutov - too specialist, focuser is not the best, and options for mounting finders are not great on the one I have.

TS Optics Photoline TS72 - the best option that I have - it has good facilities for mounting finders, a good focuser, is easily adaptable between different uses (solar white light, solar Ha, lunar, deep sky, etc), and has good quality optics. The downsides of this scope though are the small aperture, it's quite heavy for its size (compared to the ST80) and that it is a short scope so balancing it with heavy loads at the back is a challenge. Historically I've used counterweights on the front of the dovetail to balance out heavy loads at the back which adds weight and set up time. Having mulled this problem over and played around a bit I've ended up with a longer dovetail bar on the scope, and I've enabled that to be run further back on the scope by pulling the scope rings closer together and by removing one of the finder shoes to allow enough clearance between the OTA and the dovetail to let the dovetail go so far back. This means I can balance just about any load at the back, light or heavy, by just moving the dovetail up or down in the mount. I've added a one-into-three finder shoe adapter to the remaining finder shoe so that I can still have any finder combination I want. I've also kept the stubby slow motion control knobs on rather than change back to longer ones as stubby ones are nice and easily to hand when at the eyepiece using a short scope.

That's the core of it. I've been testing out various ways of making the best of this which I'll add to this thread, for example to do with how to have everything I need right there on the scope or the tripod so that I don't need to use pockets or go and find bits I need from anywhere else when I decide to go out, getting the best configuration of where all the controls are when at the eyepiece, how to be able to go out for solar Ha one minute then solar white light the next or lunar the next with a minimum of re-configuration hassle with diagonals/filters/eyepieces etc, how to avoid the hassle of having to take out an observing seat (I historically don't like observing without a seat), how to avid having to constantly reconfigure and and align finders depending on what I'm observing, etc. The basic scope and mount are a good start but there are a number of little things about how I use them and set things up that have helped and I already have something that is very close to being as easy to use as watching Netflix (or even easier if you count the half an hour you then spend trying to decide what to watch once you've got Netflix on).

Edited June 14 by Paz

[Emperor!Takahashi!]

Nice Netflix killer 😎 I enjoyed reading about your approach!

[Ags]

It is very similar to my visual setup. I'm using and AZT6 on a carbon fibre tripod. The scope is a Zenithstar 66, and the one-and-only eyepeice is a Svbony 3-8. This gives a one-degree field of view and a max magnification of 130x, so it covers most requirements. 

I am actually toying with changing scopes to a Skymax 127 - that would still give a one-degree FOV with a wide 1.25” eyepiece, but I would need to do eyepiece changing for higher magnifications. I would also need to get a sturdier mount and tripod, so maybe I will just stick with what I have!

Edited June 15 by Ags

[RobertI]

Nice read! I can really relate to what you are trying to achieve. You’ve got a great setup there, quality refractor on a quality mount with slo mo’s that can be picked up with one hand. I ended up with a very similar setup, a 72mm apo on a Mini-Giro head (no slo mos) on a Horizon tripod. It was a fantastic g&g setup, really solid and good all rounder. The only downside (which I think you allude to) was using it without a seat - it had to be “wound up” to almost its highest setting and I also ended up with a neck ache (not so young now!). I now use a Heritage 130P on the same mount/tripod which is easier on my neck. Not such clean views as the apo, but a bit more aperture, pros and cons. 

[kirkster501]

Excellent.  It is not all about aperture, that's for sure.  Bigger is not better if you can only use it with a marathon effort.  I often use my FSQ85 as a visual telescope and it is absolutely superb. 

I am taking a small setup like this to Cornwall next week.

[Paz]

On 14/06/2024 at 23:12, Ags said:

It is very similar to my visual setup. I'm using and AZT6 on a carbon fibre tripod. The scope is a Zenithstar 66, and the one-and-only eyepeice is a Svbony 3-8. This gives a one-degree field of view and a max magnification of 130x, so it covers most requirements. 

I am actually toying with changing scopes to a Skymax 127 - that would still give a one-degree FOV with a wide 1.25” eyepiece, but I would need to do eyepiece changing for higher magnifications. I would also need to get a sturdier mount and tripod, so maybe I will just stick with what I have!

That Zenithstar set up sounds very good I think you are already winning with that.

A 127 Maksutov is tempting but as you say it would pull you back to a more complex (and expensive) set up.

[Paz]

2 hours ago, RobertI said:

Nice read! I can really relate to what you are trying to achieve. You’ve got a great setup there, quality refractor on a quality mount with slo mo’s that can be picked up with one hand. I ended up with a very similar setup, a 72mm apo on a Mini-Giro head (no slo mos) on a Horizon tripod. It was a fantastic g&g setup, really solid and good all rounder. The only downside (which I think you allude to) was using it without a seat - it had to be “wound up” to almost its highest setting and I also ended up with a neck ache (not so young now!). I now use a Heritage 130P on the same mount/tripod which is easier on my neck. Not such clean views as the apo, but a bit more aperture, pros and cons. 

Pros and cons sums it up, my attempt at this set up is making me weigh up what things I value the most and what to trade off for what and when it comes down to it my preferences are not necessarily what I would have said at they were at the start. For example I am actually fine being limited to lower magnifications than I normally observe at, and I don't mind being limited to one eyepiece for a whole session with no option to change eyepieces, but I have found I really can't compromise on having a physically comfortable observing position / posture.

[Paz]

Here's an update on the tripod set up and finders.

...but first I should mention that there was a small scope contender that I forgot to mention... a 102mm f7 refractor. This wasn't chosen as it is more weight and length so more work to carry out, more vibes, and a lower eyepiece height at high altitudes.

Tripod

i have made up out of zip ties a little rail around the tripod head to hang some small bags from to hold things. This was driven by noticing the hassle of having to go back inside and get bits and pieces, and the hassle of putting things in pockets and forgetting where I put them. The bags are high so they are easy to get to and they are small so that it's easy to compartmentalise things. These are proving ato be really good in the field, everything is easily to hand and it is easy to put things down in them and so not run out of hands to do things.

So far one bag holds observing hoods, gloves and glasses, and the other holds end caps, a blower, and things like filter boxes. I need one more for my beanie hat and gloves, and one more for a power brick for my Quark.

I've tried vibration suppression pads on the tripod and they do make a significant difference. However I need to find a way to attach them permanently so that I don't have to put them down and pick them up every session.

 

Finders

The solar finder can just stay on so that it's there when I need it. It didn't have good resolution so I put some tin foil over it and put a pin prick in that for a much smaller hole. It's now a lot more accurate.

The rdf is nice and high  so it's easy to get under to look through. Originally I had a Rigel on the tube ring sticking out sideways but it was blocking the raci finder and was a bit too low for getting under easily.

The right angled finder is RACI so that orientation is easier. I've got it as low as I can get it to minimise balance issues and make it easier to keep it upright at all times whilst still being able to get above it and look , but I would have it a bit lower if I could .

The idea is I can leave all 3 finders on if I want so I don't have to spend time finding, fitting, and aligning them and this is working well.

 

The tin foil on the ota cap is so I can leave the scope out in the sun, pointing it at the sun to minimise how much heat the scope collects from the sun.

I have had 17 sessions since late May with this scope,  the vast majority being between 5 to 20 minutes in observing time which illustrates how easy to use it is.

[Emperor!Takahashi!]

Very cool. I, too, enjoy the process of perfecting my setups, so I appreciate the satisfaction that comes with a setup that's a pleasure to use 🙂