First night out with a scope, partially successful

[Aquavit]

The forecast clear skies didn't arrive as early as predicted so planetary observation was limited but the Moon was available from around 10pm. Bear in mind this was my first ever effort with a telescope.

Whilst I was waiting for moonrise, I had an attempt at Mars between the fast moving clouds. This proved frustrating as no sooner had I got the red dot lined up and  observing commenced, I would lose the target. I was surprised by the amount of travel in the mirror as the focus knob seems to turn forever. Rather than getting a clear view of Mars I seemed to be presented with a shadowy disc with a darker solid disk within it. I presume this was the obstruction on the front lens that I could see? In spite of numerous attempts I never managed an observation of Mars. Not sure what I was doing wrong here.

With the Moon high enough in the sky I switched my attention from Mars. Again I had a long struggle with the focus knob, juggling the two eyepieces and whirling the control cables in an effort to get past what seemed like an unfocused very bright blob. I was beginning to think that observing was much more difficult than it should be and that maybe my equipment was somehow faulty. After deciding to stay with the 20mm eyepiece, leaving the cables alone and concentrating only on the focus adjustment finally the Moon came in to view. Wow!

My other half joined me and we spent some time observing the Appenines, Hadley and Eratosthene, using our newly acquired "Turn Left at Orion" as a reference. Slowly moving the scope around, having got the hang of the cable adjusters, it gave the impression of passing over the Lunar surface in low orbit. This was a memorable moment for us and the highlight of our first attempts at observing through a scope.

A few issues we encountered in addition to the aforementioned dark disk. The eyepieces supplied with the scope, 10mm and 20mm, do not have eyecups and I spent a lot of time looking at my eyelashes so I think these need upgrading. Some sort of red light is definitely needed, preferably a head torch, as we found scrabbling around for eyepieces etc. a bit of a fiddle in the dark. Any recommendations? I have a dew cover on order, this will certainly be needed judging from the amount of water on the scope last night. I found using the red dot finder surprisingly easy but the flimsy/wobbly plastic mount doesn't inspire much confidence, I don't know whether to stick with it, accepting this is a budget scope, or upgrade. 

Leaving aside the issues, we both came away from our session with a sense of achievement and thrilled with what we had seen of the Moon.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2020 by Aquavit

[MrFreeze]

Rather than a head torch, have you considered luminous stickers? Much easier, and you don't need batteries

David

[Jasonb]

Nice report! I've just started this hobby too and have maybe two attempts at observing so far. Your report sounds a lot like my first go, I was all fingers and thumbs and wasn't really sure what I was doing. Getting targets in view and in focus (and keeping them there!) was confusing.

However, I'm telling myself that it's all just practice, and soon the simple stuff like the control cables etc. will just be second nature to me. And like you said, it's worth it when you catch a glimpse of something stunning that you've never seen before. I saw four of Jupiters moons last night which was a real highlight, and that was just in a very quick session in the middle of making dinner. I've realised even just going outside with a pair of binoculars can be cool, the Pleiadss looked amazing last night with then, between the clouds.

What telescope do you have by the way?

[Zermelo]

Hi,

be aware that some telescope designs require much more travel to achieve focus than others. This isn't a defect. What are you using? Is it a catadioptric model?

[Zermelo]

1 hour ago, MrFreeze said:

luminous stickers

These are great!
Can you remember where you got them?
I'm assuming they're the kind that get "charged up" by sunlight and give it out later - roughly how long after sunset do they remain visible?

[MrFreeze]

The glow-in-the-dark stickers are from "01 Store" on AliExpress : https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32860049274.html and stick well to most surfaces.

The green ones glow brighter than the blue. They charge fine from artificial light (quicker and brighter from UV), and glow for 2-3 hours. The decimal points are a cheat - they are the centre bits on the "8" digits that hadn't fallen out

David

 

[Aquavit]

40 minutes ago, Zermelo said:

Hi,

be aware that some telescope designs require much more travel to achieve focus than others. This isn't a defect. What are you using? Is it a catadioptric model?

Sky-Watcher Mak  MC102/1300.

[Stu]

2 minutes ago, Aquavit said:

Sky-Watcher Mak  MC102/1300.

Once in focus, this shouldn’t change between the Moon and Mars, so it’s easiest to focus on the Moon then pan across to Mars. The focus point may change a little when changing eyepieces though, but it shouldn’t be from one extreme to the other, just a few turns perhaps.

[Aquavit]

22 minutes ago, Stu said:

Once in focus, this shouldn’t change between the Moon and Mars, so it’s easiest to focus on the Moon then pan across to Mars. The focus point may change a little when changing eyepieces though, but it shouldn’t be from one extreme to the other, just a few turns perhaps.

Thank you for that little snippet, I've learnt something!

[Tiny Clanger]

I'm surprised there are no eyecups on your EPs, I thought all the skywatcher 'scopes came with the same 10mm and 20mm starter ones. My heritagedob.  did,  and so did the 127 mak I bought more recently . Both pairs of EPs were identical (the mak set I checked were OK then put back in the delivery box to store) and had small fold up rubber eyecups .

I saw somewhere a suggestion that you can make a cheap temporary soft eyecup from a bit of (well cleaned !) bike inner tube of a suitable diameter , so maybe you could make a temporary solution. I'd suggest a do it yourself dew shield too, closed cell foam cut from a cheap camping mat or craft shop stock should be fine : on my neat final version I stuck velcro on using a hot glue gun ( which I'd thought would melt the foam, but I experimented on a scrap bit, and  it was fine ), on my prototype I just tied some string around it !

The trouble with getting a good focus is that if the 'seeing' is not ideal,   Mars (or Jupiter, or Saturn ) will appear fuzzy even if your focus is bang on . Rather than expecting your view to snap into something sharp, use the apparent size of the planet's disc , it will increase as you move out of focus (either way), so aim to get the little circle as small as possible, and when starts to increase in size again, turn the focus knob back the other way. You may find you have good focus, but still Mars looks fuzzy due to atmospheric conditions here on Earth. If the Moon looked sharp, it's not a fault with you, your focusing or your telescope  , and as has been said, you can focus on the Moon first if it's available.

Heather

[Aquavit]

Thank you Heather, some good advice there for focusing, of course I'm now itching to get out again and put this in to practice, but no sign of clear skies in the forthcoming days.

 

Yes, it's a mystery as regards the eye cups. I assumed they would be standard on even the most basic kit. Here is a snap of what it looks like:

 

[Zermelo]

21 minutes ago, Aquavit said:

Thank you Heather, some good advice there for focusing, of course I'm now itching to get out again and put this in to practice, but no sign of clear skies in the forthcoming days.

 

Yes, it's a mystery as regards the eye cups. I assumed they would be standard on even the most basic kit. Here is a snap of what it looks like:

 

That's odd.

The Skymax 102 ought to come with the Skywatcher stock 10mm and 25mm eyepieces. The one FLO sells does anyway.

... which have an eyecup, and look like this:

The eyecup just sits on the outside of the barrel next to the eye lens - you can pull it off.

It is possible to buy eye cups separately, e.g.
https://www.astroboot.co.uk/AstroBoot/telescope-and-astronomy-stuff.html?highlight=AB9203#AB9203

 

[Tiny Clanger]

I was just about to say exactly what Zermelo did , thanks, saved me the trouble !

Note the O.P. is in Hungary though, perhaps the importer gets a different specification package there ?

 

[Aquavit]

I bought the scope here https://tavcso.hu/en/product/SWM102SQuest. The buying decision was of course heavily influenced by where I could find stock. Their product description is a little sparse so couldn't see any spec on the EP's. Maybe I should fire an email off to them asking if this is normal.

I've got half a mind set on purchasing a zoom EP though, should be better quality than what I have now and removes the need to keep switching them around

[Tiny Clanger]

6 minutes ago, Aquavit said:

I bought the scope here https://tavcso.hu/en/product/SWM102SQuest. The buying decision was of course heavily influenced by where I could find stock. Their product description is a little sparse so couldn't see any spec on the EP's. Maybe I should fire an email off to them asking if this is normal.

I've got half a mind set on purchasing a zoom EP though, should be better quality than what I have now and removes the need to keep switching them around

I'd email the seller, and maybe skywatcher too if you don't get a satisfactory reply , it could be a regional difference, it could be a mistake, or it might be a dodgy dealer ...  Does the seller advertise a big stock of bargain skywatcher 'super' long eye relief 10 and 25mm eyepieces  ?!

[Aquavit]

I emailed the seller of my scope regarding the eyepieces.

I received a prompt reply from him: "Hello, these are the new Barium/photo eyepieces, better fit to photo adapters." 

I then asked him if they were specifically designed for camera use: "You can use it for both purposes. There is no difference between the old and new design regarding viewing comfort. Rubber eyecup helps only to (somewhat) block stray light comes from outside."

I guess these are to enable smart phone photography. I'm not hugely enamoured with them, although the 20mm gives a nice crisp image. But the 10mm doesn't seem so capable, having a tiny depth of field, which makes it difficult to achieve focus, and poor eye relief creating a problem with my (quite long) eyelashes.

As a result I'm mulling over buying either a zoom lens https://www.firstlightoptics.com/ovl-eyepieces/hyperflex-72mm-215mm-eyepiece.html or a fixed 15mm https://www.firstlightoptics.com/ovl-eyepieces/hyperflex-72mm-215mm-eyepiece.html

Edited December 8, 2020 by Aquavit

[Tiny Clanger]

OK, so I searched for barium EPs .and came up with only one hit :

Barium eyepieces (product group) - Budapest Telescope Centre

https://tavcso.hu/en/productgroup/okular_barium

The Barium eyepieces can be used in 1.25\" focusers. They\'re reversed Kellner eyepieces where one of the lenses contain Barium. As a result the image quality is definitely better than the one of Kellner eyepieces and the eyepiece provides a wider field. Recommended for slow telescopes (F/8 and under) but perform well even in faster scopes. Ideal for outreach events. The eyepieces contain ...

 

My security software didn't like the website's certification so all I have is the excerpt from my search engine (not google hate google) . It sounds as if it is that dealer's own EP ( no doubt they have a batch made to order in China) not a skywatcher item at all. I don't know much about glass chemistry, but I do know that borosilicate glass is neither rare or terribly expensive: laboratory glassware and old CRT TV screens use it , I have a friend who is doing a fine arts course and making glass sculptures, he is using melted down old TV screens !

 

I'd be sending off a query to skywatcher : if the retailer is selling their 'scope with different accessories from those advertised they may not be pleased.

[Moonshed]

On 06/12/2020 at 08:58, Aquavit said:

The forecast clear skies didn't arrive as early as predicted so planetary observation was limited but the Moon was available from around 10pm. Bear in mind this was my first ever effort with a telescope.............

After deciding to stay with the 20mm eyepiece, leaving the cables alone and concentrating only on the focus adjustment finally the Moon came in to view. Wow!

My other half joined me and we spent some time observing the Appenines, Hadley and Eratosthene, using our newly acquired "Turn Left at Orion" as a reference. Slowly moving the scope around, having got the hang of the cable adjusters, it gave the impression of passing over the Lunar surface in low orbit. This was a memorable moment for us and the highlight of our first attempts at observing through a scope..........

Leaving aside the issues, we both came away from our session with a sense of achievement and thrilled with what we had seen of the Moon.

 

 

The moon can certainly make a big impression. Even now, after many years star gazing, I still on occasion like to line my scope up just ahead of the Moon’s leading edge, use a high magnification eyepiece that still gives a sharp image and stop the drive motor. As the Moon appears and then slowly drifts across the FOV until it fills the eyepiece I gain the impression that I am in lunar orbit as it appears to slowly rotate  beneath me. It’s quite an experience isn’t it! Moments like this create lasting memories. I hope you continue with your new hobby and continue to enjoy it because that’s what it’s all about.